Fine Tuning My Carolina Rig Presentation

[Big Hands]

If details aren't your thing, you may have stumbled across the wrong thread. I'm more of a 'details matter' type and I don't know how to put this into a 'TL/DR' format, so here goes. . . .

 

I've fished a mojo/slipshot rig for decades and never had this issue. Since I have had pretty good success using that rig for finesse fishing, I never saw the point in going with a Carolina rig as it is a little more complex and not as stealthy. But I recently started fishing the forebay to our local lake, and it's a different animal compared to the upper lake with a general bowl shaped bottom (with some dips and humps) and a fair amount of vegetation (almost all of which doesn't reach the surface) scattered around different portions of the 180 surface acres and is . The upper lake that I have fished for 35+ years is a deep canyon reservoir and completely different.

 

Since I now have a small aluminum boat with a bow mounted trolling motor, I have dedicated myself to learning how to fish this body of water because it is home to a good population of bass, some of which are huge (bigger than most state records). And since it has vegetation present and bait/fish present in the vegetation, I have committed to embracing the vegetation rather than trying to avoid it. 

 

A recent pattern that has emerged this fall for me is to fish a Carolina rig with a long leader and smallish minnow/shad type plastics in 25 feet of water. I have experimented with different weights, and have found that a 3/4 to 1 oz weight seems to work best for me. I think that maybe because it tends to keep the bait down rather than crawling up and down the vegetation. So far, my rod/reel of choice has been a baitcaster on a 7'1" heavy (but toward the light side of heavy IMHO) fast taper rod with #30 braid to a short section of 10 lb fluoro where the weight and a bead resides, and a 4' leader of 8 lb mono connected to the main line by a swivel. A 7/7 alberto knot connects the braid, and Palomar knots connect the rest eventually terminating with a #1 or #2 texas rigged Cover Shot hook (nose hooking dropshot style and reeling up into them had even fewer hookups). I am open to going with straight braid to the swivel if tungsten weights don't abrade the line too quickly, or maybe a mono or fluoro main line, but I do love the sensitivity of the braid for feeling my way through the vegetation and detecting bites. And I like the Heavy action rod for popping the bait free from the weeds, but admittedly I could be missing something here too.

 

The issue is that if I don't let the bass run off with a LOT of line, they aren't getting hooked. Very few are being hooked deep, and the few that are, I have been able to get the hook out without damaging the fish (thanks to the 'BR method'). I'm not talking about letting them have a few feet of line, we're talking about 10' to 20' of line and up to 30 seconds or more of them fiddling around with the bait.

 

These are not small fish per se as yesterday I boated 11 fish with the smallest being 13.5" with two 18" fish and two 17" fish, and last week I boated a healthy 22" fish among others. But yesterday, I had nearly twice as many bites that I didn't convert into hookups. And on several of my recent fish, the hook falls out or is barely stuck.

 

Additionally, when I reel down the slack to set the hook, I think the fish are going somewhere other than directly away from me because after I crank down and bust them, it often feel like I missed them until I reel in some more line and find out that they are still there.

 

So, I'm not sure if some part of the rigging/gear is part of the issue, or if it's technique, or both.

 

What could be done to increase the hookup ratio of such a rig?

 

Is this just one of the downsides of fishing a Carolina rig is these conditions?

[Mbirdsley]

I don’t have a ton of experience with Carolina rig but, I’d use like 1/0-3/0 off set or ewg hook.  I’d also would run either straight braid or flouro to the swivel than use mono to the hook.  If your talking as big of fish as you are I would want to eliminate as many of the knots or weak points as practicable possible 

[TnRiver46]

First off, you have the best memes on the forum. Kudos for that!

 

Carolina rig is an awesome bait deep or shallow, I love it for any situation (except for tying it up after breaking one off). After much trial and error I think the hard part that will throw everything off is the hookset. It’s so hard to set the hook with all that mess. The best way to figure it out is to go fishing with somebody’s grandpa that sits on a pro pole seat and drags Carolina rigs. It’s some kind of sweeping motion that apparently takes a lifetime to master, I still lose fish with it. I don’t think the leader material is terribly important, the beauty of this rig is that the extremely heavy sinker keeps the bait ON THE BOTTOM. Constant contact is why I throw it, don’t really care which kind of line 

[roadwarrior]

I don't like casting a Carolina Rig, but it's great for drifting!  My #1 bait is the

Rage Tail Eeliminator with the Rage Hawg a close second.  I am using a 5/0 

EWG hook, 1/2-1oz egg weight, 30lb Smackdown and 12lb Seaguar AbrazX leader.  The hook-set is a slow sweep while reeling fast.

[WRB]

My guess is the OP is slow trolling/strolling the rig with the TM in lieu of casting.

1. Reduce the number of knots and connections. 
2. Quality tungsten cylinder weight shouldn’t fray the braid. 
3. Use premium mono leader, FC drags on the bottom pulling the soft plastic down with it.

4. Small Spro swivel w/ bead to connect braid and leader. 8# UG Maxima or 11 # Sunline Defier Nylon. 

5. The lagoon has some big crappie that may be trying to eat your plastic.

6. Bass don’t have hands, when you first detect something reel and rod sweep.

7. Set your drag at 3 1/2 lbs, add tension with your thumb during rod sweep.

Tom

[jbrew73]

16lb fluorocarbon mainline, 3/4oz sinker, small spro swivel , 14lb mono leader and a 3/0 round bend offset worm hook.  Reel down and sweep.  You will rarely miss.  

[Big Hands]

@ Mbirdsley: I think that the straight braid to the swivel may be the lowest hanging fruit, and it will simplify the rig. It also eliminates a knot going through the guides. A few times I have had to fight the knot when trying to get fish close enough to net, not to mention the possibilities when casting.

 

@ TnRiver46: Thanks, memes are fun!

 

LOL, I'm older than many grandpas. . . . chronologically speaking anyway. I tried 1/2 ounce weights, and the contact with bottom was much more vague and it felt like I was going up and over the weeds where I think it was better to go though them. I really find (so far) that the 3/4 oz to 1 oz sinkers are working better for me, as I like that they keep my line straighter to where I feel subtle bites and they cast a country mile.

 

@ roadwarrior: Since I am using 3" to 3.5" finesse baits, I'm pretty sure a 3/0 to 5/0 EWG will overwhelm the tiny plastics. I do have a tinier version of an EWG tied up to a backup rig in case I wanted to give it a go, but didn't throw it last time out. I'm honestly kinda shocked that a bass will mouth and play with a plastic bait as long as they have been. It reminds me of fishing with live crawdads where they might smack it against a rock, come back and gum it for a bit, then swim a little ways, pause, and then finally start moving steadily away from the scene of the crime.

 

I will be trying the sweeping hookset, rather than cranking down and trying to cross their eyes :-O

 

@ WRB: Not dragging. Shutting off the electronics and sliding into the spot, and quietly dropping an anchor, and literally not moving again until I'm ready to go home. Fan casting in about a 180° arc and fish are coming from all directions within that arc.

 

Been using a Spro swivel with Trilene XL, in 8 lb and some 6 lb Maxima. Will check out the Sunline Defier. And I'll see if I can set the drag more accurately. I've been 'experimenting' with it and haven't settled on a setting that I like.

 

Could be crappie, but in four trips to the same spot, I haven't hooked one yet. I'll try the immediate reel down and sweep as it seems to be a consensus on that one.

 

@ jbrew73: That's more like my summer night time 10' Power Worm setup. Definitely in on the reel and sweep hookset.

 

Thanks all for the input. The thoughtfulness of the comments is appreciated.

[WRB]

6# Max us stronger then 6# XL!

Getting bit is 1st priority, next is putting the bass in the boat!

The tungsten weights are called barrel weight and look good but $$.

Casting a 4’ C-rig means standing using a 7’1 rod, that is ok.

Tom

 

 

 

[BlakeMolone]

Maybe setting the hook to hard with such a tiny hook and stiff rod is the problem? I’m not sure but it seems like you are doing something different then everyone else and it’s working.

[papajoe222]

Three things about your set-up and one about setting the hook.

First, dump the section of fluoro, it isn't necessary, even with brass weights and it adds an extra knot to the rig.

Second, up your mono to 12lb. or higher. That will add more flotation to the leader and will transmit more bite information.

Lastly, switch hooks to a light wire, offset worm hook.

https://www.basspro.com/shop/en/gamakatsu-round-bend-offset-worm-hooks?searchTerm=Gamakatsu+Round+Bend+Offset+Worm+Hooks

It doesn't inhibit your bait from rising as much as using an EWG worm hook and the point sits farther back.

Now the hook-set. Point the rod tip at where the line enters the water and reel until you feel the weight lift off the bottom. Now, in unison, sweep the rod to the side and reel. A high gear ratio reel helps a lot.  It takes some practice to reel and sweep at the same time, but it's fairly easy to master. DON'T use an overhead hook-set. You can't move enough line and you change direction of the bait's movement and hook angle.

[Big Hands]

@ WRB: "6# Max is stronger than 6# XL!"

 

Always has been, always will be!

 

I like that the tungsten weights are of a smaller profile for a given weight. Makes me feel like they would pull through the weeds easier. I read or heard somewhere of a guy putting fish attractant on his Carolina sinker to make it pull through weeds easier.

 

I am currently 6'4" (I hope I don't keep shrinking too much more) and even though I am not up on a casting deck, I can still cast a 4'+ leader without it dipping into the water behind me. I do have to watch out for the boat itself if casting parallel to the keel though.

 

@ BlakeMolone: I do have a 7' MH extra fast taper rod that may work a little better. I'll bring it on my next trip and compare.

 

@ papajoe222: Braid to the swivel is as good as done. 

 

I think your description of to set the hook, as well as how not to set the hook (I was doing exactly that) are spot on.

[TnRiver46]

I usually have about a 2 foot leader, just what somebody told me was a good length and it seems to work 

[Big Hands]

  On 11/17/2020 at 1:12 PM, TnRiver46 said:

I usually have about a 2 foot leader, just what somebody told me was a good length and it seems to work 

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I remember when I thought a 24" leader on a slipshot/Mojo rig was a loooooong leader. I have become aware that several locals have been using 4' to 5' leaders on the Carolina rigs, and I can't argue that they don't work. Maybe I'll try gradually shortening my leader length to see where the point of diminishing returns lies.

[WRB]

Dick Trask suggested 14” for split rig at Castiac upper lake and 40” at the lagoon. Reason to keep the worm in front of the active bass. 
The main  lake Is steep rocky structure no weeds the lagoon has deep weed beds. If the leader to too short the worm  gets dragged down into the weeds instead of floating along the top.

The down side of long leader is loss of strike detection.

Lindy made a walleye rig with a tiny black cylinder smell float to keep minnows swimming above the bottom. I use these floats at the lagoon to keep the worm above the weeds with a 30” leader years ago.
Tom

[Big Hands]

  On 11/17/2020 at 11:14 PM, WRB said:

Dick Trask suggested 14” for split rig at Castiac upper lake and 40” at the lagoon. Reason to keep the worm in front of the active bass. 
The main  lake Is steep rocky structure no weeds the lagoon has deep weed beds. If the leader to too short the worm  gets dragged down into the weeds instead of floating along the top.

The down side of long leader is loss of strike detection.

Lindy made a walleye rig with a tiny black cylinder smell float to keep minnows swimming above the bottom. I use these floats at the lagoon to keep the worm above the weeds with a 30” leader years ago.
Tom

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Dick would know as much as anyone. Seemed like his little red/white boat was always out there ;-D

 

Thinking back, I fished for trout in the lagoon back in the 80's using Power Bait with 4' to 5' leaders on 2 lb and 4 lb test to keep the bait up above the weeds and in front of the fish. 

 

Do you know if those weed beds die off a bit in the winter, or are they just as tall all year round?

 

I put a little Z-Man TRD on the Carolina rig just for s&g, and caught a bass on the first cast with it. Then nothing for a while. It will work, just not sure it will be better than those Keitech Swing Impact baits. I think the swimming action of the Keitech is a winner.

[Teal]

These are the types of threads I like.  We really get to dig in and dial in a specific technique and the OP already has a good handle on it

 

Me personally, if I'm carolina rigging, I'm using one of my  flipping sticks. Only because it's long, can cast a mile, and already had braid as a main line.  Powell 764 with 50 lb Daiwa J braid.  Typically with 12- 16 lb Sniper FC.  If I'm using a small bait like a finesse worm, robo worm, or baby brush hog, I'll go 2/0.  But if bigger worm, I'll go as big as I can get away with.  I have a love and hate relationship with the c rig.  But it can be a year round fish catcher.  

[Big Hands]

  On 11/18/2020 at 1:26 AM, Teal said:

These are the types of threads I like.  We really get to dig in and dial in a specific technique and the OP already has a good handle on it

 

Me personally, if I'm carolina rigging, I'm using one of my  flipping sticks. Only because it's long, can cast a mile, and already had braid as a main line.  Powell 764 with 50 lb Daiwa J braid.  Typically with 12- 16 lb Sniper FC.  If I'm using a small bait like a finesse worm, robo worm, or baby brush hog, I'll go 2/0.  But if bigger worm, I'll go as big as I can get away with.  I have a love and hate relationship with the c rig.  But it can be a year round fish catcher.  

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I hope I can start to get on some fish that would warrant that type of rig. Here's a shot of what this 180 surface acre "lake" is capable of. No, that's not me, LOL.

[Big Hands]

UPDATE: So, I made a few changes that were suggested and the situation seems to have gotten much better.

 

I did three things:

1) Straight braid to leader (not sure this affected my result, but simplified things for certain)

2) Shortened the leader length a bit now using about 36" to 48".

3) Cranking down on them soon after detecting a strike.

4) Using a sideways sweeping hookset.

 

I think #3 and especially #4 made the biggest difference. Today, and Monday, only missed one strike, and the rest came into the boat for a brief cameo.

 

Thanks all for the suggestions. It's the little details that can make a significant difference.

[roadwarrior]

  On 11/25/2020 at 9:26 PM, Big Hands said:

It's the little details that can make a significant difference.

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[WRB]

Congrats going the right direction.

I crank (reel set) with firm rod sweep nearly everything including jigs.

Feel a rubber resistance set the hook.

Tom