Back winding spinning reels?

[TnRiver46]

Just now, J Francho said:

The rotor and the spool both can spin at the same rate. The spool has lower mass, so technically it is the cheetah. 

That's your tale, I'm sitting on mine....

 

Loosen your drag enough to spin as fast as the rotor disengaged and you will catch zero fish 

59 minutes ago, MN Fisher said:

Then you try to grab the handle as it's spinning and 'WHAM' - hence 'knuckle buster'.

I still have 2 knuckle buster baitcaster reels that the handle spins backwards when you cast

[J Francho]

You are talking about resistance. That’s different. There is nothing preventing a spool spinning as fast as the rotor. 

[TnRiver46]

9 minutes ago, J Francho said:

You are talking about resistance. That’s different. There is nothing preventing a spool spinning as fast as the rotor. 

Call it what you may and bust as many balls as you need, I can reel backwards faster than the drag can let line out. If you don't like back reel, why hang out in this thread???

 

Sure do see a lot of pros stripping drag  off by hand , seems like they want more line out in those instances 

[J Francho]

I just need back reelers to admit it isn’t an advantage and really about control issues ?

[MN Fisher]

19 minutes ago, TnRiver46 said:

Call it what you may and bust as many balls as you need, I can reel backwards faster than the drag can let line out. If you don't like back reel, why hang out in this thread???

 

Sure do see a lot of pros stripping drag  off by hand , seems like they want more line out in those instances 

Loosen the drag - loosen it enough and it free-spins...just as fast as switching off the anti-reverse or even opening the bail.

[soflabasser]

If you see people jumping off a cliff will you do it as well to be part of a group?  That is what back reeling and thumbing the spool is to me. There is a reason why more and more spinning reels do not have back reeling, it is because the drag system on spinning reels has greatly improved in the past couple of decades. 

[TnRiver46]

9 minutes ago, MN Fisher said:

Loosen the drag - loosen it enough and it free-spins...just as fast as switching off the anti-reverse or even opening the bail.

Let's see how the hook set works with your free spinning drag 

[soflabasser]

9 minutes ago, MN Fisher said:

Loosen the drag - loosen it enough and it free-spins...just as fast as switching off the anti-reverse or even opening the bail.

It is very easy to loosen the drag and much more effective than thumbing the spool or back reeling.

[TnRiver46]

14 minutes ago, J Francho said:

I just need back reelers to admit it isn’t an advantage and really about control issues ?

We are all well versed in your tactics by now haha

[J Francho]

Having the last word is also a sign of control issues. 

[MN Fisher]

11 minutes ago, TnRiver46 said:

Let's see how the hook set works with your free spinning drag 

Set the hook...THEN adjust drag as needed.

[J Francho]

Remember “fightin’ drags” ?

[soflabasser]

20 hours ago, looking45 said:

Reels have a drag for a reason. Everyone should learn how to use them

Well said!

[Finessegenics]

4 minutes ago, J Francho said:

Remember “fightin’ drags” ?

My father still exclusively uses old Shimano reels with those drag systems. I still dont understand how they work 

[Team9nine]

 

11 minutes ago, J Francho said:

I just need back reelers to admit it isn’t an advantage and really about control issues ?

 

1 minute ago, soflabasser said:

If you see people jumping off a cliff will you do it as well to be part of a group?  That is what back reeling and thumbing the spool is to me. There is a reason why more and more spinning reels do not have back reeling, it is because the drag system on spinning reels has greatly improved in the past couple of decades. 

 

And why wouldn’t greater control not be an advantage?

 

I guess I view today’s modern and much improved reels similar to today’s modern and much improved electronics. For most people, running “auto” mode after answering a few simple setup questions works just great for probably close to 90% of electronic users; but then there are those like me who have to put the unit in advanced mode and tweak the settings manually, removing any ‘auto’ function capacity because I want the most control over the unit. I feel it provides me with a slight edge over “auto” and maximizes my odds of a potentially productive day, which is sometimes dictated by landing a single nice fish.

 

Backreeling and thumb barring are my manual override for reels, taking the drag off “auto” and allowing me to tweak that reels response to every bassin’ situation you can think of. No, I wouldn’t do it with tuna or bonefish, etc., but that’s getting off-topic in this discussion (a bass forum). We (BRers/TBers) are obviously a minority, and I wouldn’t tell anyone they HAVE to do this, but I also wouldn’t say it’s dumb or unnecessary. It works, and works well for those who have learned how, and continue to do it. YMMV (obviously) ?

[The Bassman]

8 minutes ago, J Francho said:

Remember “fightin’ drags” ?

I had some of those. They were actually very handy. I'm not into saltwater but weren't they supposed to basically be the same as lever drags?

[TnRiver46]

3 minutes ago, Team9nine said:

 

 

 

And why wouldn’t greater control not be an advantage?

 

I guess I view today’s modern and much improved reels similar to today’s modern and much improved electronics. For most people, running “auto” mode after answering a few simple setup questions works just great for probably close to 90% of electronic users; but then there are those like me who have to put the unit in advanced mode and tweak the settings manually, removing any ‘auto’ function capacity because I want the most control over the unit. I feel it provides me with a slight edge over “auto” and maximizes my odds of a potentially productive day, which is sometimes dictated by landing a single nice fish.

 

Backreeling and thumb barring are my manual override for reels, taking the drag off “auto” and allowing me to tweak that reels response to every bassin’ situation you can think of. No, I wouldn’t do it with tuna or bonefish, etc., but that’s getting off-topic in this discussion (a bass forum). We (BRers/TBers) are obviously a minority, and I wouldn’t tell anyone they HAVE to do this, but I also wouldn’t say it’s dumb or unnecessary. It works, and works well for those who have learned how, and continue to do it. YMMV (obviously) ?

+1. We are the ones going against the flow, not following jumpers off a cliff.

 

[Finessegenics]

I have nothing against backreeling, I mean if it works for you then go with it. No issues there. But can someone explain how it gives more control? If your drag is set right, wouldn’t the fish be able to run anyways? I think this is really just a preference deal. 

[MN Fisher]

3 minutes ago, Finessegenics said:

I think this is really just a preference deal. 

Bingo - I prefer NOT having my knuckles banged about...which did happen years ago when I tried back-reeling. The control I have using/adjusting drag on-the-fly has netted me a number of fish heavier than the line-test I was using. I'll keep with that as it's proven itself to me over the years.

[DitchPanda]

I'm also not opposed to back reeling and have done it in the past. Now days I can afford better gear than I did in the past so I trust my drags to hold up and do what they should. I caught a carp close to 40lbs a few years ago on 6lb mono and let the drag do its thing. If its sufficient for a fish of that caliber it will hold up to any bass in gonna throw at it.

[J Francho]

29 minutes ago, Team9nine said:

And why wouldn’t greater control not be an advantage?

I guess that depends on who's at the wheel, and what you're driving.  Just because I think a manual transmission is better in a sports car doesn't mean I want one in my truck.

[Team9nine]

28 minutes ago, Finessegenics said:

I have nothing against backreeling, I mean if it works for you then go with it. No issues there. But can someone explain how it gives more control? If your drag is set right, wouldn’t the fish be able to run anyways? I think this is really just a preference deal. 

Let me spin the question around and pose it this way...

 

What makes someone think that setting and using a single drag setting (usually recommended at 25-33% line rating), will accomplish and handle every situation you can think of, knowing that your drag (and drag in general) is changing constantly on every single cast?

 

What you set your drag to while on the reel will be different than what it is with 30 ft of line out, 60 ft of line out, 90 ft of line out (it increases as effective spool diameter decreases) - overall drag will be different depending on the angle of the rod during a fight, the amount of line out, which direction the fish runs, the type of line you are using and the amount of stretch it has; or conditions such as whether you have the fish just barely skin hooked by a single small barb, or whether the line has been degraded because of use or during a fight, or how much pressure you'll actually get on a hookset at various distances?

 

Somehow a single magic setting on today's ultrasmooth drags handles all these situations? Even if you "tweak" the drag during a fight, you have no confident level of what you have done. So you know your setting was 3 lbs. of drag on your reel with your 10 pound line. Now, during a fight, you adjust the drag up a few "clicks" or down a few "clicks," but just how much did it change? You now have no clue how much you let off or added. You only know there is 'more' or 'less' than what you originally set at. You have no way to gauge this because now your "feel" is totally different because of a changed initital drag setting.

 

Not sure if that helps explain or not, but those are the things I think of and feel are overlooked by just using "auto."  

5 minutes ago, J Francho said:

I guess that depends on who's at the wheel, and what you're driving.  Just because I think a manual transmission is better in a sports car doesn't mean I want one in my truck.

 

So just settle for an automatic transmission in all your vehicles under all cases and be happy 90% of the time like most bassers 

[Finessegenics]

8 minutes ago, Team9nine said:

Let me spin the question around and pose it this way...

 

What makes someone think that setting and using a single drag setting (usually recommended at 25-33% line rating), will accomplish and handle every situation you can think of, knowing that your drag (and drag in general) is changing constantly on every single cast?

 

What you set your drag to while on the reel will be different than what it is with 30 ft of line out, 60 ft of line out, 90 ft of line out (it increases as effective spool diameter decreases) - overall drag will be different depending on the angle of the rod during a fight, the amount of line out, which direction the fish runs, the type of line you are using and the amount of stretch it has; or conditions such as whether you have the fish just barely skin hooked by a single small barb, or whether the line has been degraded because of use or during a fight, or how much oressure you'll actually get on a hookset at various distances?

 

Somehow a single magic setting on today's ultrasmooth drags handles all these situations? EVen if you "tweak" the drag during a fight, you have no confident level of what you have done. So you know your setting was 3 lbs. of drag on your reel with your 10 pound line. Now, during a fight, you adjust the drag up a few "clicks" or down a few "clicks," but just how much did it change? You now have no clue how much you let off or added. You only know there is 'more' or 'less' than what you originally set at. You have no way to gauge this because now your "feel" is totally different because of a changed initital drag setting.

 

Not sure if that helps explain or not, but those are the things I think of and feel are overlooked by just using "auto."  

That makes a lot of sense. I hadn't seen anyone on this thread actually explain it but I may have missed their post. The thing is I don't even "set" my drag with weights like a lot of people do. I just play it out by feel which is leaving a lot up to chance but I just fish for fun ? I've never had a drag set too loose or too tight on an initial hookset. If I feel the fish wanting to run I just loosen it up a bit from whatever the heck I set it at. But thank you for your explanation, it's clear to me now. I'll try backreeling next time I'm out just for the fun of it.

[J Francho]

14 minutes ago, Team9nine said:

 

So just settle for an automatic transmission in all your vehicles under all cases and be happy 90% of the time like most bassers 

No, I use a centrepin for fish that put up a serious, prolonged fight. There’s no gears, no drag, and barely has knobs. Just a big arbor supported by a ball bearing. I control the level of resistance with my pinky. That’s my sports car. Bass fishing is my truck in 4 wheel auto, cruising along letting my brain work on other things than driving in stop and go traffic that is bass fishing. 

[WRB]

Interesting debate.

How often does anyone back reel with the fish more then 25' away? 

Spinning reels with rear drags like Cardinals worked by applying pressure on the spool shaft and easy to ajust with number settings, back off 1 click if needed. Hard to find rear drag reels today.

The older spinning reels the spool type drags tended to stick and higher force to get started and weakened quickly making adjusting difficult constantly readjusting or trusting them. Few bass angler used older spinning reels as adults until about 20 years ago when finesse presentations became more popular.

My biggest bass on a spinning reel, Stratic 2500, using 5 lb Max UG line was 13.2 lbs on a drop shot. Didn't back reel just used my trolling motor!

Tom