Vanford Vs. Stradic FL 2500

[JustJames]

@Rusty_ShacklefordYeah I firm decided on 1000/2000 size Vanford base on MGL rotor and long stroke spool. If oscillation is not so slow at least long stroke spool would help a little in casting distance. Can you tell me how many rotations of roller to travel from top to bottom of the spool?

Compare between my old Sahara 750FB and all my Daiwa LT 1000, 2000 and 2500 I have, that little reel with smaller and shorter spool cast just as good. The Sahara would take total of 7 rotations to travel up and down but all my Daiwas doesn’t matter what size only 5 rotation.

@AJ.AJ.AJ.congrat on your new reel. It doesn’t matter FL or Vanford, you should be happy with either. Now that you mention Exceler LT, would you say FL is smoother and lower inertia that Exceler LT? I’m a shimano Fanboys but let myself loosen a little and got about 5 Daiwa LT reel from Exceler LT all the way to Ballistic FW LT. Every time I switch from Daiwa to old Stradic CI4, it feel like ?. I wanna get back to Shimano with either FL or Vanford.

[AJ.AJ.AJ.]

1 hour ago, Bass_Fishing_Socal said:

@Rusty_ShacklefordYeah I firm decided on 1000/2000 size Vanford base on MGL rotor and long stroke spool. If oscillation is not so slow at least long stroke spool would help a little in casting distance. Can you tell me how many rotations of roller to travel from top to bottom of the spool?

Compare between my old Sahara 750FB and all my Daiwa LT 1000, 2000 and 2500 I have, that little reel with smaller and shorter spool cast just as good. The Sahara would take total of 7 rotations to travel up and down but all my Daiwas doesn’t matter what size only 5 rotation.

@AJ.AJ.AJ.congrat on your new reel. It doesn’t matter FL or Vanford, you should be happy with either. Now that you mention Exceler LT, would you say FL is smoother and lower inertia that Exceler LT? I’m a shimano Fanboys but let myself loosen a little and got about 5 Daiwa LT reel from Exceler LT all the way to Ballistic FW LT. Every time I switch from Daiwa to old Stradic CI4, it feel like ?. I wanna get back to Shimano with either FL or Vanford.

It's definitely smoother and has lower inertia. Supposedly the Vanford with the MGL will be better at low inertia than the Stradic FL. The Stradic FL feels much smoother and more solidly built for sure than the Exceler, also the exceler nob has a little play in it which bothers me but the Stradic FL has none. It just feels all around like a much more premium reel, as it should considering the price difference.

[GetFishorDieTryin]

3 hours ago, Bass_Fishing_Socal said:

@Rusty_ShacklefordYeah I firm decided on 1000/2000 size Vanford base on MGL rotor and long stroke spool. If oscillation is not so slow at least long stroke spool would help a little in casting distance. Can you tell me how many rotations of roller to travel from top to bottom of the spool?

Compare between my old Sahara 750FB and all my Daiwa LT 1000, 2000 and 2500 I have, that little reel with smaller and shorter spool cast just as good. The Sahara would take total of 7 rotations to travel up and down but all my Daiwas doesn’t matter what size only 5 rotation.

@AJ.AJ.AJ.congrat on your new reel. It doesn’t matter FL or Vanford, you should be happy with either. Now that you mention Exceler LT, would you say FL is smoother and lower inertia that Exceler LT? I’m a shimano Fanboys but let myself loosen a little and got about 5 Daiwa LT reel from Exceler LT all the way to Ballistic FW LT. Every time I switch from Daiwa to old Stradic CI4, it feel like ?. I wanna get back to Shimano with either FL or Vanford.

Comparing the FL to an Exceler is like comparing a Timex to a Rolex.  The Rolex looks and feels great, but ultimately the Timex tells time just as well.  You also have to consider the difference in price, you can get an Exceler for about $70 from ebay.  You could get 3 Excelers for what you pay for an FL.

All of my Daiwas have a lower gear ratio then my Shimanos.  This kind of stuff confuses me sometimes so I could be wrong, but I think the rotor on a reel with a higher ratio will turn faster then a reel with a slower ratio.  Spool dimensions have an effect as well, so its not really an even comparison. 

Im a Shimano fan as well, for years I didn't use anything but Shimanos.  When the LTs came out I bought a Fuego and was impressed.  Now I actually prefer Daiwas spinners over Shimanos.     

[AJ.AJ.AJ.]

21 minutes ago, Rusty_Shackleford said:

Comparing the FL to an Exceler is like comparing a Timex to a Rolex.  The Rolex looks and feels great, but ultimately the Timex tells time just as well.  You also have to consider the difference in price, you can get an Exceler for about $70 from ebay.  You could get 3 Excelers for what you pay for an FL.

All of my Daiwas have a lower gear ratio then my Shimanos.  This kind of stuff confuses me sometimes so I could be wrong, but I think the rotor on a reel with a higher ratio will turn faster then a reel with a slower ratio.  Spool dimensions have an effect as well, so its not really an even comparison. 

Im a Shimano fan as well, for years I didn't use anything but Shimanos.  When the LTs came out I bought a Fuego and was impressed.  Now I actually prefer Daiwas spinners over Shimanos.     

Yeah i just got that Exceler LT about a month ago on Discount Tackle for $64 total after tax and shipping. Much less expensive reel. Just doesn't have the fit and finish and feel of the Stratic. Your watch analogy was spot on.

[JustJames]

Actually Legalis was the one that turn me into Daiwa for its smoothness compare to my old CI4. Now I have Ballistic FW, Kage LT, Tatula LT and Exceler 2000 LT as spare and for lower gear ratio. Price is not only thing that consider reel is good or not. I still love my old beat up Sahara 750 FB and just fish with it this evening after all the talk.
 

Talking about oscillation, I don’t think it matter how fast rotor turn, the mainshaft will go up and down according to oscillation gear, this make slower oscillation gear move up/down at lower speed and the roller would spin around more turn than faster oscillation gear. I might be wrong though.

[GetFishorDieTryin]

13 hours ago, Bass_Fishing_Socal said:

Talking about oscillation, I don’t think it matter how fast rotor turn, the mainshaft will go up and down according to oscillation gear, this make slower oscillation gear move up/down at lower speed and the roller would spin around more turn than faster oscillation gear. I might be wrong though.

Oscillation doesn't directly effect casting distance.  Slower oscillation should improve line lay which in turn effects casting distance.  On the other hand, if you have 2 reels, one with slower oscillation then the other, but the line lay is identical on both reels.  In theory they will cast the same distance.  I don't think comparing 2 different brand reels with different spool dimensions is fair.  I'm definitely not the best person to explain this  If you want to find out exactly whats going on you would be better off contacting Shimano.

When I compare my FLs distance to my LTs its really close.  The FL has the advantage but just barley.  I didn't buy the FL because I was looking for greater distance.  I bought it because it fishes like a $350+ reel.  They could probably charge closer to $300 for the FL and people would still love them.  If they did that they would have to upgrade the Sustain or stop making them.  I think one of the reasons the price is so reasonable on the FL is because of the success of the LT line.  

 

 

 

 

 

[NHBull]

My vanford 3000xg came in today and it it’s going to be hard not to get a couple more.  It just feels great in hand and balances a 7-6 St Croix M , perfectly

[JustJames]

2 minutes ago, NHBull said:

My vanford 3000xg came in today and it it’s going to be hard not to get a couple more.  It just feels great in hand and balances a 7-6 St Croix M , perfectly

I thought you are getting the 2000 size? 

[NHBull]

Just now, Bass_Fishing_Socal said:

I thought you are getting the 2000 size? 

They are back ordered, but I am....for 2 DS setups?

[JustJames]

4 minutes ago, NHBull said:

They are back ordered, but I am....for 2 DS setups?

Waiting for more info on 1000/2000 size. I check YouTube almost everyday but haven’t seen any 1000/2000 or even 500 yet. 

[mrpao]

I want a 1000 or 2000 size also. Might even try the 500 size for ultralight. 

I dont think the smaller sizes are available yet. I'm not aware of any place having them yet.

[Gkitz]

Beautiful october day on table rock! I love my stradic but the vanford is definitely a step up!  If you buy one you will not regret it

[Dave_AKA_Fraf]

On 10/10/2020 at 12:23 PM, kayaking_kev said:

I believe the Vanford had Aluminum gears with a Ci4 body and MGL spool, while the Stradic FL is all Aluminum (Hagane), which is why there is a weight difference and that should make the Stradic FL a little more durable and last longer. I'm not sure, but the Vanford might be able to cast farther with that MGL spool. Both are nice reels, but if I had to choose, I would pick the Vanford, just because I like lighter gear.

Has anyone fished the new Vanford in wet and/or cold weather. It’s time for me to replace my Stradic 2000fg. Been using this reel For 20+ years for largemouth and steelhead in winter. Rotor now sticks when fishing in the rain and anti-reverse fails to engage when temps drop into the 30’s. Basically I can no longer keep it dry. I think Shimano coated the clutch and bearings with a water repellent that has come off over time and from cleanings. 

I am very curious about the Vanford because I prefer finesse fishing over throwing hardware and think this reel might be a better option than buying a Stradic fl. 

Don’t like how Shimano beefed up the Stradic to 2500 over 2000. Is it just the spool that’s larger? Unfortunately, there are no stores around me that carry these reels so I can’t really compare them for size.  For me smaller is better but I don’t think you can put 8lb. test on the 1000 model. 

The Vanford c2000 will hold 100 yards of 8lb test and am leaning in that direction. 

Any input or advice would be greatly appreciated. 

[The Bassman]

9 minutes ago, Dave_AKA_Fraf said:

Has anyone fished the new Vanford in wet and/or cold weather. It’s time for me to replace my Stradic 2000fg. Been using this reel For 20+ years for largemouth and steelhead in winter. Rotor now sticks when fishing in the rain and anti-reverse fails to engage when temps drop into the 30’s. Basically I can no longer keep it dry. I think Shimano coated the clutch and bearings with a water repellent that has come off over time and from cleanings. 

I am very curious about the Vanford because I prefer finesse fishing over throwing hardware and think this reel might be a better option than buying a Stradic fl. 

Don’t like how Shimano beefed up the Stradic to 2500 over 2000. Is it just the spool that’s larger? Unfortunately, there are no stores around me that carry these reels so I can’t really compare them for size.  For me smaller is better but I don’t think you can put 8lb. test on the 1000 model. 

The Vanford c2000 will hold 100 yards of 8lb test and am leaning in that direction. 

Any input or advice would be greatly appreciated. 

I think the new 2000 is just a larger rotor 1000 now. For long runners like steelhead I would definitely go with a 2500 or 3000. 3000 is the same as the 2500 just a deeper spool and T handle. I find the knobs on the smaller models too small.

[Dave_AKA_Fraf]

Great advice Bassman. Thank you!

[The Bassman]

12 minutes ago, Dave_AKA_Fraf said:

Great advice Bassman. Thank you!

Welcome. Glad to have you aboard. BTW the 3000 is only 6.3 oz. Pretty incredible. I've got one on the way. Mine is a JDM C3000 with the slower gear ratio. Still picks up over 29" of line which is more than most 7:1 baitcasters. I find that I overwork moving baits with higher IPT's. Also makes the reel feel all the more free when retrieving. I've got two 1000FA CI4+ also that are absolutely perfect for light work.

[JustJames]

@The Bassmanactually 2000 got bigger spool than 1000. My Vanford 2000 is 43mm while 1000 got 40mm spool, they body are the same. I checked this with the guy that own 1000.

The 2500/3000 size got bigger frame/gear and of course spool size.

@Dave_AKA_Frafif you plan on 8lb mono line, I think 2500/3000 size should handle that better. As @The Bassmanmentioned 2500/3000 size is 6.3oz while 1000/2000 about 5.5oz so not much different there. I spool my 2000 with 4lb Nanofil for light work. 

[bulldog1935]

On 10/12/2020 at 3:17 PM, mrpao said:

I want a 1000 or 2000 size also. Might even try the 500 size for ultralight. 

I dont think the smaller sizes are available yet. I'm not aware of any place having them yet.

don't do it, stick to the 1000 and 2000 size, which is the mix of Stella, Vanquish and CI4+ parts.  

A friend on FFR pre-ordered Vanford 500 and was disappointed with what his wait and $200+ got him.  

No worm drive, instead locomotive, no long stroke - the 500 drive is literally a Nasci with a part left out - missing the bottom crossbar in the oscillation yoke, which is how they reduced drive inertia in this size.   (ok, it's actually the JDM '16 Soare 500 with a facelift)

I would definitely buy a $40 Tica Cetus or $80 Daiwa MR750 over the Vanford 500.  

Also note, they don't offer the Vanford 500 size in JDM - it's only offered to the US.  

https://www.jpfishingtacklenews.com/shimano-20-vanford/

 

If you want to see his takedown photos and comments, they're on fiberglassflyrodders forum, the page Another Spin on Glass, topic titled Shimano Vanford 500 size.  

 

I fish a Vanquish C2000S, Stradic C1000S and Stradic C2000SHG side by side.  The lightness of the Vanquish belongs on my shocking-lightweight Yamaga Blanks 83 TZ Nano rod, but 25-g heavier 8' Black Hole rockfish and either of the little Stradics makes a workhorse finesse combo.  

and no, the Vanford will not be able to out-cast the Stradic.  '18 Stella, '19 Vanquish, '19 Stradic, '20 Twin Power and '20 Vanford in the same sizes all cast the same distance because of the common spool stroke - the spools (and most parts) interchange between all these reels.  

[aaatkr]

Thanks for everyone's help.  Bought the Vanford 2500 for the Reinforcer rod.   Hope it catches fish.

[lunkerboss923]

For me, I prefer the NASCI. I think $100 is the sweet spot for spinning reels. Where's the technological advancement in flipping a bail and casting. Now a baitcaster, sure...there so much technology that goes in from the DC, MGL, and BFS. The SV Diawa, the Elite Spool. That justifies spending a bit more, but a spinning reel for $250 is either made platinum or is just because it's cool. 

 

To each his own, but it's a spinning reel. You throw it in the truck dig it out after work and catch a few dinks before getting an ear full of useless drivel from your wife. My every day reel is a Diawa Regal LT 3000. I love it, but I still say my NASCI is a sweet reel! 

 

Good luck in your search!!! 

[JustJames]

13 minutes ago, lunkerboss923 said:

Now a baitcaster, sure…there so much technology that goes in from the DC, MGL, and BFS. The SV Diawa, the Elite Spool. That justifies spending a bit more, but a spinning reel for $250 is either made platinum or is just because it's cool. 

 

To each his own, but it's a spinning reel. You throw it in the truck dig it out after work and catch a few dinks before getting an ear full of useless drivel from your wife. My every day reel is a Diawa Regal LT 3000. I love it, but I still say my NASCI is a sweet reel! 

No wonder there is always a talk back and forth between spinning (fairy wand) and baitcaster (mucho man) because a think like that. Do you know why so many new words (that you called technology) into baitcaster? Because they wanna be able to do what spinning can do all along. Some baitcaster even try to copy line out(drag) sound from spinning lol.

[Delaware Valley Tackle]

The Ci4 material is plenty strong. Flexing is not a concern. It’s all about weight. The knock on the Ci4 predecessor of the Vanford was lack of smoothness, due again to the light weight. Neither is “better” I’m terms of what it will do or how long it will last. Comes down to the feel you prefer: light and effortless winding or slightly heavier with more fluid feel. 

[bulldog1935]

not to offend, but that's not exactly true. 

If CI4+ was as strong as the Stradic forged aluminum, they wouldn't need to decrease the length of the reel stem (foot, knee, whatever you want to call it) on the Vanford. 

They reason the Vanford reel body is closer to the rod than every other Shimano is exactly because CI4+ can't be made as stiff as forged aluminum or magnesium. 

 

Twin Power, a beast, which is the Stradic body with an added aluminum forging in the rotor. I'll take the added stiffness in MH any day, over saving 30 g (=1 oz) in 3000 size. 

 

For the finesse stuff, I have a Vanquish and small Stradic, but you can only tell the difference between weight of the extreme-light Vanquish on extreme light rods. 

[Msl819]

On 10/10/2020 at 12:56 PM, AJ.AJ.AJ. said:

Thanks, sounds like the Vanford is better. Think i'll be returning the stradic FL when it shows up, although i'm going to take it out of the box and look at it when it gets here so who knows i may not want to part ways with it once i have it in my hands. 

I’ve had both and kept the Stradic.  To each their own, right? Nothing at all wrong with the Vanford but I do not place as high a value on lightness. The Stradic is so, so smooth. I also love the solid feel of the aluminum body. It just “feels” higher quality to me. Some reels can start to feel “plasticky” which can “feel” cheap even though it is not. 
 

My actual in the hand experience was there was no real world difference to me in how they fished. 
 

In fact I sold the Vanford to grab a Twin Power. They’re all great. That said, my Daiwa Certates are even better!