Increase drag past manufacturers max

[CT Sam]

I've been trying to fill out my arsenal this year for different techniques. I fish on a kayak so I don't have a ton of room to work with but I'd like to have about 5-6 setups with me. I just picked up a Dobyns Fury XH/F frogging rod (awesome rod for the money btw) and I decided to put my Daiwa Fuego on it. Seeing that it has an 8.1:1 gear ratio it seemed like a good choice for topwater applications. I want it to pull double duty for heavy cover jigging/punching but the Fuego has a max drag of 9lbs. I do have a Lew's reel that has a 20lb drag but in a 7.5:1 gear ratio. I'm wondering if there's any way to increase the drag with aftermarket parts or if 9lbs would be enough anyway. Any advice on pairing any of these up different would be appreciated.

This is what I have set up right now:

Fuego/Dobyns XH/F (frogging, jigs, punching)

Team Lew's custom black BC combo MH/F (all around)

*** Concept A/St. Croix Premier MH/M (cranking)

Shimano SLX BC combo M/XF (weighted t-rigs, spinners etc.)

Penn Battle 2/Abu Ike MH/F spinning (t-rigs, some finesse)

[CT Sam]

It's a newer CT that I bought last year. I didn't really think that it would make much of a difference. I don't plan on doing much punching anyway. I guess it's like most things, manufacturers flashing numbers in front of potential customers trying to get them to buy things based on something they don't really need. I wasn't really looking to bump up the drag numbers by much, I was just curious if it was a possibility in case I ever do run into a situation where only having 9lbs of max drag would cause a problem bringing in a fish with 5lbs of slop attached to it. 

[jimmyjoe]

1 hour ago, BaitFinesse said:

manufactures gladly offer up reels with pinon destroying drag pressures just to have that gimick over the competition.  A Revo beast will **** it's pinon at 24lbs of drag and it is rated to 40lbs. 

 

   Too true, too true. It's like the speedometer on your car. Do you really want to try and go that fast?  ?   jj

[J Francho]

I upgrade any reel I can with Carbontex, usually a dry setup, no drag grease.  I prefer the feel and consistency of it.  It will inherently increase drag potential, sometimes by quite a bit. But why do you need more than 9 lbs.?  Would you lift more than 9 lbs, with your rod?  Tie a gallon of milk on, and yank.  Let me know what happens!

[WRB]

9 lbs is far more weight then fresh water rods can lift. You couldn't put that much force on the lure in a kayak.

Tom

[Hook2Jaw]

2 minutes ago, WRB said:

9 lbs is far more weight then fresh water rods can lift. You couldn't put that much force on the lure in a kayak.

Tom

Challenge accepted.

 

Send me a Fred's Magic Stick and lemme see if I can blow it up on a jig set.

[WRB]

Hook set isn't power it's impact shock.

Take the challenge of lifting a gallon of water using your rod, that is power.

Freds Magic stick IRG 754F is a 4 power rod that can lift 4 lbs, 1/2 gallon of water.

Tom

[Hook2Jaw]

6 minutes ago, WRB said:

Hook set isn't power it's impact shock.

Take the challenge of lifting a gallon of water using your rod, that is power.

Freds Magic stick IRG 754F is a 4 power rod that can lift 4 lbs, 1/2 gallon of water.

Tom

The more you know!

 

I'm still gonna need that iRod Genesis II "Fred's Magic Stick" because I'm pretty sure I can blow one up and you said we couldn't from a kayak.

[WRB]

8 minutes ago, Hook2Jaw said:

The more you know!

 

I'm still gonna need that iRod Genesis II "Fred's Magic Stick" because I'm pretty sure I can blow one up and you said we couldn't from a kayak.

 I said you can't put 9 lbs of force pulling on the lure from a kayak. You will pull the kayak over to the lure. I didn't say you couldn't snap the to break off the lure or mention Freds Magic Stick.

Are you looking for a free Freds Magic Stick? Off topic, this has nothing to do with drag force the op is asking about.

Tom

[RoLo]

 

NINE-POUNDS?

Sam, 9 pounds of drag tension will easily land a 50-lb striped bass or even a 100-lb bluefin tuna.

 

Simple Reality Check 

Fetch your most accurate fish scale, then fetch an assistant.

Tie an end-loop in your fishing line, then have your assistant slip the end-loop onto your fish scale. 

Now apply increasing pressure to your rod, until your assistant hollers "9 pounds".

Be very patient, as this will likely provide a valuable lesson, and a wake-up call.   

 

Roger

 

[soflabasser]

9 pounds of drag is plenty for largemouth bass fishing. There are many spinning and baitcasting reels that you can purchase that offer more drag if you want.

[WRB]

18 minutes ago, RoLo said:

 

NINE-POUNDS?

Sam, 9 pounds of drag tension will easily land a 50-lb striped bass or even a 100-lb bluefin tuna.

 

Simple Reality Check 

Fetch your most accurate fish scale, then fetch an assistant.

Tie an end-loop in your fishing line, then have your assistant slip the end-loop onto your fish scale. 

Now apply increasing pressure to your rod, until your assistant hollers "9 pounds".

Be very patient, as this will likely provide a valuable lesson, and wake-up call.   

 

Roger

 

It will be a costly lesson!

Tom

[Hook2Jaw]

29 minutes ago, WRB said:

 I said you can't put 9 lbs of force pulling on the lure from a kayak. You will pull the kayak over to the lure. I didn't say you couldn't snap the to break off the lure or mention Freds Magic Stick.

Are you looking for a free Freds Magic Stick? Off topic, this has nothing to do with drag force the op is asking about.

Tom

I can definitely put a pulling load of 9 pounds on a reel from my kayak.  They don't just instantly move, there is resistance.  If the constantly echoed "kayaks get drug around by bass, hooksets, etc," were as true as some people believe it to be, I would land way less fish.

 

The boat simply cannot move fast enough to counteract how quickly a human's physical movements can exert force.

 

Honestly, though, I was just being silly about getting a rod.  I knew it wasn't in the cards, but since you want to debate and remain on topic, there's my point and it's on topic.

 

I can exert 9 pounds of force on a lure from my kayak should it be at all possible to apply 9 pounds of force to it.

[MN Fisher]

6 hours ago, CT Sam said:

I want it to pull double duty for heavy cover jigging/punching but the Fuego has a max drag of 9lbs.

I'm still wondering where this number came from as Diawa's site says 13.2# which is more than enough for pitch/flip/frog/punch...that's what I'm using - a Fuego CT-XS

https://www.daiwa.com/us/contents/reels/fuego_ct/index.html

 

Model Number	Bearings	Gear Ratio	Line Per Handle Turn	Wt. (oz.)	Line Capacity (Lb. Test / Yards)	Drag Max	Handle
FGCT100H	5BB, 1RB	6.3:1	26.3"	7.6	MONO: 14/120, 16/100 J-BRAID: 30/130, 40,100	13.2	RIGHT
FGCT100HL	5BB, 1RB	6.3:1	26.3"	7.6	MONO: 14/120, 16/100 J-BRAID: 30/130, 40,100	13.2	LEFT
FGCT100HS	5BB, 1RB	7.3:1	30.5"	7.6	MONO: 14/120, 16/100 J-BRAID: 30/130, 40,100	13.2	RIGHT
FGCT100HSL	5BB, 1RB	7.3:1	30.5"	7.6	MONO: 14/120, 16/100 J-BRAID: 30/130, 40,100	13.2	LEFT
FGCT100XS	5BB, 1RB	8.1:1	33.9"	7.6	MONO: 14/120, 16/100 J-BRAID: 30/130, 40,100	13.2	RIGHT
FGCT100XSL	5BB, 1RB	8.1:1	33.9"	7.6	MONO: 14/120, 16/100 J-BRAID: 30/130, 40,100	13.2	LEFT

[RoLo]

43 minutes ago, WRB said:

It will be a costly lesson!

Tom

 

Yeah, with 9 lbs of drag tension, you should be able to tow a kayak around,

that is, until the rod blank explodes!

 

 

[jimmyjoe]

   The OP stated that he had a Daiwa Fuego CT reel. That was the reel under discussion. I had one of those reels last year. The pinion (and I suspect the main gear also) decided to crap out not from 9 lbs. of drag, but from casting one ounce spoons. I suspected (and still suspect) poor quality brass alloy in the pinion. I had a conversation with Daiwa that did not leave me happy. If the OP (or anyone else) decides to put a Fuego CT100 to high-stress use, I would caution them to be very, very careful. The pinion is the crunch point.

   As for drags in general; most drags will be stable and smooth up to approximately 30% or so of their max. Above that, they may chatter, stick intermittently or heat up too hot from the friction. Carbontex washers will help this, certainly. How much they'll help remains to be seen on each and every individual model of reel.

   Some (less expensive) models won't even remain smooth at the 30% mark after they get hot. Others when hot won't maintain the same drag poundage; they will slip.   jj

[Tywithay]

Fuego CT has 13.2lbs manufacturers listed drag. Measured at 14.1 in real life testing by TT. If you buckle it down, there's little chance of it moving from a bass.

[J Francho]

12 hours ago, WRB said:

I said you can't put 9 lbs of force pulling on the lure from a kayak.

My kayaks range from 350 to 600 lbs. capacity.  I can pull way more than 9 lbs. The boat, my gear and myself probably weighs close to 300 lbs.  Will it move?  Yes, but not straight down.  None of this has anything to do with needing more than 9 lbs. of drag for bass fishing or breaking rods on a hookset.  I don't think it's totally unreasonable to go for 12 lbs. of drag with an aftermarket improvement, and operate around 65-75% of the the max.  That would put you at 8-9 lbs., which probably not far off what I set my heavy cover gear.  More than that is too much for any rod meant for bass fishing.

[OnthePotomac]

And be aware that converting drag washers to Carbontex increases drag efficiency, but not drag power.

[CT Sam]

17 hours ago, jimmyjoe said:

Too true, too true. It's like the speedometer on your car. Do you really want to try and go that fast?  ?   jj

Of course I do but that's why I'm selling my Mustang. Every time I drive it I want to go 130 and blow donuts in the parking lot at work ?. But I have kids and responsibilities and stuff  

50 minutes ago, Tywithay said:

Fuego CT has 13.2lbs manufacturers listed drag. Measured at 14.1 in real life testing by TT. If you buckle it down, there's little chance of it moving from a bass.

Oh shoot, I don't know where I saw 9lbs

[Bankc]

My guess is, most manufacturers limit the amount of drag on purpose to protect the gears inside.  Making a reel with more drag is easy.  You just increase the size of the drag washers.  More surface area equals more friction and greater heat dissipation.  There's you're more drag.  And there's plenty of room inside the reels for bigger drag washers.  Those main gears are huge these days!  In other words, it would probably cost the manufactures just a couple of pennies more per reel to more than double the max drag on most reels.  So the reason they don't do it (because they would probably sell a lot more reels if it had double the drag of the competition and only cost a nickel more than it does now) is probably to protect the gears and other parts inside the reel.  And any extra profit they'd reap from increased sales would get eaten up and more by warranty claims.  So increasing the max drag beyond what it came with from the factory will likely shorten the lifespan of the reel.

 

These engineers typically know what they're doing.  And you can rest assured that the accountants and marketing department are doing everything they can to sell the maximum number of product at the maximum profit margins.  

 

 

[J Francho]

4 hours ago, OnthePotomac said:

And be aware that converting drag washers to Carbontex increases drag efficiency, but not drag power.

I have found the opposite is true with drag power, in almost every single Carbontex upgrade.  Especially in the case where the washer material wasn't carbon fiber and/or multiple washers are used in a stack. Whether that increase is usable depends on the reel, the rod, and the user.  The best reason to use Carbontex is the performance consistency and low maintenance.  Run them dry, then set and forget about them.

[Guitarfish]

You run greased (cf) drags for a smooth start up and no jerkiness. Doesn't really apply if you just hammer down your drags.

[galyonj]

23 hours ago, jimmyjoe said:

It's like the speedometer on your car. Do you really want to try and go that fast?

I paid for that whole speedometer, and I intend to use every bit of it.

 

[J Francho]

40 minutes ago, Guitarfish said:

You run greased (cf) drags for a smooth start up and no jerkiness. Doesn't really apply if you just hammer down your drags.

I used to run Cal's on my Carbontex, because I liked the smooth feel, but dry lets line out just as smooth, never sticks, and requires no regular cleaning or maintenance.  It also is always smooth regardless of temperature.  Wet drags can get sticky in the cold, if that's a concern.  Some like that silky smooth feel, and that works too. No harm in greasing, just know there's some maintenance involved.  If you go with grease, only use a vapor thin layer of it.  Any more, and it squeezes out and makes a mess.