Big Swimbait Beginner Questions

[Bass Rutten]

19 minutes ago, Michigander said:

Well you two have conflicting opinions

I’m not following you about what’s conflicting about what i said, I personally find the 795 perfect for trebles and a little softer than I like for driving single hooks home, specifically weedless ones where a big ‘ol honkin hook has to be driven through a thick plastic body and then into the fish. I have not thrown exposed hook paddle tails on that rod but I have a feeling it would probably do ok for them.

[Michigander]

2 minutes ago, Bassjam2000 said:

I’m not following you about what’s conflicting about what i said, I personally find the 795 perfect for trebles and a little softer than I like for driving single hooks home, specifically weedless ones where the hook has to be driven through a thick plastic body and then into the fish. I have not thrown exposed hook paddle tails on that rod but I have a feeling it would probably do ok for them.

Phishl said to make adjustments for trebles because the rod was too stiff and you said it was ideal. That didn't seem to align by my reading. I was really curious why you differed.

[Bass Rutten]

2 minutes ago, Michigander said:

Phishl said to make adjustments for trebles because the rod was too stiff and you said it was ideal. That didn't seem to align by my reading. I was really curious why you differed.

I see, my bad, the rod blank is somewhat parabolic which helps keep fish pinned.

[Michigander]

Has anyone successfully used inline singles on swimbaits? Truthfully,  I don't care much for trebles.

 

 

2 minutes ago, Bassjam2000 said:

I see, my bad, the rod blank is somewhat parabolic which helps keep fish pinned.

Oh, that makes me want it more!

[VolFan]

Hudd 68 (not weedless), 7" Slammer, and Deps 175 or SWaver and you will catch fish as long as you know how to fish. If you're not sure, fish the slammer at night on windblown shorelines and grasslines. Go ahead and burn your wallet.

 

CXX in 17 lb for those baits btw.

[Mr. Aquarium]

Buy a few baits and learn them. Don’t jump in and buy a bunch of baits. Figure out what works for your style. You can get big fish on “cheaper baits” don’t need to jump the hype train with pre orders and bait drops. You don’t need the most expensive baits to be cool. It’s over rated. Buy what works for you. I have a good amount of baits. But only a few makers I buy from.   
swimbaits are another tool. Some guys are swimbaits only. That’s it. I still fish conventional gear. 

[WRB]

15 hours ago, VolFan said:

Hudd 68 (not weedless), 7" Slammer, and Deps 175 or SWaver and you will catch fish as long as you know how to fish. If you're not sure, fish the slammer at night on windblown shorelines and grasslines. Go ahead and burn your wallet.

 

CXX in 17 lb for those baits btw.

Deps 175 weighs 3 oz's, is expensive ($110) and I wouldn't use anything less 25 lb Armillo using a 6 power Swimbait rod.

Tom

[Jig Rookie]

On 2/7/2020 at 5:47 PM, WRB said:

Treble hook lures can only be used effectively in open water, not in cover.

 

Tom

This is absolutely not true. OP, Essentially, cover glides have a narrower glide and react well to rod twitches/quarter-turns, which make the bait have jerkier glide motion, perfect for darting them in and around cover.

 

Also, your bluegill/crappie profiled wake-and-cranks are literally designed to excel cranking and bumping them off wood, stumps, etc. in water 3-foot or less. This'll be my third season with the below wake-and-crank (it's on its third rattle can job too), and all I do is throw it in and around wood. Thing's so beat you can still see the old hook rash beneath the new paint job (repainted a few weeks ago, still iced out up here so haven't fished yet this season).

 

So OP, you can definitely throw trebles (and glides are actually DOUBLE trebles) in cover. 

 

This is the same lure, double-sided (I paint most of my big hardbaits two-sided, for example this one is crappie/bluegill. I've got Perch/rainbow, and Perch/crappie painted baits as well. They all get bit). For reference, this is a 5.5" lure.

[Jig Rookie]

Also OP, EBay has a seller, "Caricaburu Tackle Co," who sells cheap 8" glide blanks (the look of them is reminiscent of a Hinkle Trout, I guess you might as well call it a knockoff). You get 5 of them for like $20, come with tails and fins. You have to paint them yourself and add your own splits and hooks, but the glide on them is pretty good--not super wide and smooth like say a Deps 250, more akin to an S-Waver 168. Just a heads up if you ever wanted to give yourself a cheap winter project to relieve the cabin fever.

[Bass Rutten]

@Jig Rookie who makes that crappie wake?

[Jig Rookie]

@Bassjam2000  The company is Valley Hill, the bait is called "BoogieBack". My buddy got it for me on a Japan trip a couple years back, and I can find like ZERO info on the thing. I've found one YouTube video (in Japanese), and I found the site online, but it's all Japanese also. So they are available for sale through the JDM, but good luck finding great info on them otherwise. The thing is a SLAYER though--my most productive swimbait by far. One night session I caught eleven fish on it in under four hours, from 1.5lbs to a 5.43, my PB at the time. It was painted black with purple stripes at that time (black rattle can, purple glitter nail polish).

[Bass Rutten]

Ah well, looks like it'd have a similar presentation and action as shellcrackers which I have a few of

[Jig Rookie]

YES, exactly like a Shellcracker (I don't have any, but know plenty about them). That's an apt comparison.

[WRB]

Cover being grass, wood you bump carefully but treble hooks on swimbaits isn't any different then crankbaits and snag weeds easily. You try ripping a big Swimbait to clear off weeds? ...it doesn't work like a lipless trap.

If feel comfortable chucking big treble hook swimbaits into weeds go for it.

Tom

[Jig Rookie]

So wait, laydowns, submerged logs, submerged beaver spots aren't cover?? Then what crazy nonsense is Matt Allen talking about when explaining "cover glides"?

 

But he's right, OP: do NOT try to throw your trebled baits in grass mats, will not work. Thanks Tom.

[salmotrutta]

Get the 795. Pick up some wake baits and fish at night. 7" MS Slammer,Bull Wake,Spro Rat 50 and a G2 Shellcracker will fish well on the 795SB .My Best word of advice is to fish these baits at night.Once you start night fishing you'll never want to see daytime again.The big girls come out at night. 

[MassYak85]

795 will work well for what you're trying to do, the true upper limit of the rod is about 4oz. I think the only thing you might struggle with is 68 weedless hudds. The rod is a true mod-fast action and will load up a fair amount, which is nice for treble hooks, not so much for jig hooks, but it's still a fairly beefy rod compared to what you're used to and can drive home exposed jig hooks fine. I fish a lot on mine, up to 8" Meatheads, 9" Slammers, Swaver 200's, but you can tell you're working the rod a bit. 

 

Like others said, there's a lot of hype around swimbait fishing because of the allure of bigger fish. It's not a magic bullet you have to know your waters and learn how to find fish just like conventional lures, but when you find the right combination of conditions those bigger baits will reward you. It can be a grind though at times, especially starting out. But starting small will give you confidence and let you know if you like it or not, it's not for everyone. 

[WRB]

4 hours ago, Jig Rookie said:

So wait, laydowns, submerged logs, submerged beaver spots aren't cover?? Then what crazy nonsense is Matt Allen talking about when explaining "cover glides"?

 

But he's right, OP: do NOT try to throw your trebled baits in grass mats, will not work. Thanks Tom.

I was replying to the statement to cast 9" slammer into wind blown grass lines.

The overlooked Weedless Swimbait is 3:16 Mission Fish IMO one of the best weedless swimmers available in several sizes and colors.

There isn't a agreed to defination of what cover vs structure is. To me a wooden boat dock or any tree is cover, anything that grows in or on the water is cover. You cast big Swimbait with 1/0 to 2/0 trebles into snags you going to hang it up.

Tom

[MassYak85]

1 minute ago, WRB said:

I was replying to the statement to cast 9" slammer into wind blown grass lines.

The overlooked Weedless Swimbait is 3:16 Mission Fish IMO one of the best weedless swimmers available in several sizes and colors.

There isn't a agreed to defination of what cover vs structure is. To me a wooden boat dock or any tree is cover, anything that grows in or on the water is cover. You cast big Swimbait with 1/0 to 2/0 trebles into snags you going to hang it up.

Tom

Yea slammers around grass are a nightmare. However I have found if you twitch them through sparse to moderately dense lily pads they can do surprisingly well not getting snagged. 

[Jig Rookie]

57 minutes ago, WRB said:

I was replying to the statement to cast 9" slammer into wind blown grass lines.

The overlooked Weedless Swimbait is 3:16 Mission Fish IMO one of the best weedless swimmers available in several sizes and colors.

There isn't a agreed to defination of what cover vs structure is. To me a wooden boat dock or any tree is cover, anything that grows in or on the water is cover. You cast big Swimbait with 1/0 to 2/0 trebles into snags you going to hang it up.

Tom

Ah, I misunderstood, and didn't take into account the different ideas of cover. You're right, there isn't an agreed definition. Definitely agree about the big baits and those kinds of cover (also have heard great things about the MissionFish, thanks for that heads up).

 

Apologies, thanks for clearing that up.

[TBAG]

**edit**

 

I posted this before seeing MassYak's reply, lol.  

 

Ok, so I've got a Dobyns 795 and am a beginner swimbait angler and will be fishing 90% out of a kayak. 

 

I fish several smaller lakes, creeks and rivers and really want to fish more weedless swimbaits like the Huddleston 68 deluxe weedless (also open to other good weedless baits). 

 

Am I going to have a tough time with hooksets with the 795 out of a kayak with the weedless baits? If so, whats a better rod choice? 

[PhishLI]

2 hours ago, TBAG said:

Am I going to have a tough time with hooksets with the 795 out of a kayak with the weedless baits?

No. In this case moderate fast isn't anywhere near moderate like a dedicated crankbait rod. During actual fishing a little delay can often be a good thing as you're less likely to rip the bait out of the fish's mouth if you jump the gun on the hookset. The 795 has plenty of backbone, and quickly enough, to drive the hook home. Plenty. I lost exactly 2 big fish last year throwing larger profile weedless rigged swimmers on 6/0 superline hooks. An Owner Beast hook is like a finishing nail with a point. I caught plenty more on the same setup. It's far lighter and and only slightly faster than the 795. You'll be fine. So will I.

[Adam Markley]

Appreciate the detailed responses guys. I think I’m going with the 795 paired with a Cardiff 300 for a super-budget friendly combo. Or, should I spend a bit more and get a lews superduty 300? Also, I’m looking to grab an s-waver 168, 7” slammer, some sort of bluegill bait (gantarelle, shell cracker etc), a hudd 68 special, and maybe a spro-rat. These baits listed “should” cover most of the basic techniques behind throwing the big swimbaits right?

 

Thanks,

Adam

[PhishLI]

10 minutes ago, Adam Markley said:

Or, should I spend a bit more and get a lews superduty 300?

Superduty Wide spool.

[Bass Rutten]

5 hours ago, TBAG said:

Am I going to have a tough time with hooksets with the 795 out of a kayak with the weedless baits? If so, whats a better rod choice? 

The answer to this question needs context, specifically what lure and what line. I wouldn’t dare tie a 7 or 8 inch rising son and its monstrous 10/0 or 12/0 hook on my 795 with mono. A smaller megabass magdraft or keitech impact? Maybe.