Water temp by region

[kdubracing]

A question just popped in my head that I have no clue about while thinking about bass behavior relating to water temp. Do bass in different parts of the country react to specific water temperatures the same way? For instance, if the water temp is 55 degrees in Arizona, would bass be in similar depths, activity levels, etc. in Illinois when the water temp is 55? My uneducated guess is it would be a bit different due to the fact that the water temp range is different in both locations. The water temp is Arizona never reaches the lows as in Illinois, and conversely, the water gets much warmer in Arizona than in Illinois. Would the different basic "seasons" such as pre-spawn, spawn, post-spawn, summer, fall, etc. be based on different water temps? Does anyone know of any research that has been done, or any real knowledge, of this?

[Bluebasser86]

I'm not sure that any scientific studies have been done, but bass certainly don't seem to react the same from what I can tell. Bass in southern states don't seem to tolerate cold very well, whereas fish in the northern states can be surprisingly active even when the water is near freezing. I'd guess that this is most likely due to necessity because of the shortened seasons. A fish in Texas can shut down for a while if the water cools off during a cold front because it will likely warm up again soon. A fish in Minnesota has a few short months to fit it's entire season into before the water cools off again and the lakes start to lock back up, so shutting down during a cool water period might not be as much of an option for them if they want to survive.

[WRB]

Yes. The majority of the LMB Bass spawn when the cold water warms to 62-67 degrees. SMB a few degrees lower regardless what regional area they live in.

Nothing in nature is absolute but the spawn cycle is predictable. 

Anomolies like power plant lakes with water being artificially heated and very severe weather impacts the spawn cycle and can result in very low recruitment seasons.

If the spawn is predictable the pre spawn and post spawn the overlaps the egg laying bedding period are also predicable; pre spawn stagging starts about 55 degrees, post spawn after the spawn about 68-70 degrees. Summer follows as the water warms above 70 degrees. Fall cooling starts as the water cools, winter cold water winter period is water temps below 55 degrees in general wherever LMB live.

Tom

[JediAmoeba]

Just like people that live in the north, we are more acclimated to the cold and don't suffer as many consequences out in the elements.  When its 30 degrees outside I wear a very light jacket and am usually toasty.  Take a Floridian and they freeze their arses off at 50.  

 

Same goes for fish.

[DanielG]

3 hours ago, JediAmoeba said:

Just like people that live in the north, we are more acclimated to the cold and don't suffer as many consequences out in the elements.  When its 30 degrees outside I wear a very light jacket and am usually toasty.  Take a Floridian and they freeze their arses off at 50.  

 

Same goes for fish.

I was a teacher in my previous life. One year I had two girls arrive to my Maine classroom, in February, within two weeks of each other. One from Florida, one from Alaska. The Floridian wore a winter coat to class. The Alaskan wore shorts.

[webertime]

I think it's more than temperature that affects spawn, (moon phase, current, light spectrum...).

Do I think northern fish eat/spawn at lower temps?  Yes...  they have to since the growing season is so short.  I've seen many LM spawning well before the SM on Champlain.  

 

Feeding?  Man they chew in February through the ice up here.  It seems like they're easier to catch then than they were in Kissimmee the next day, when I went. (Florida strain vs northern aside).

 

I think shocks or big deviations from the seasonal norms have a big effect on all fish behavior. 

[kdubracing]

It makes sense that the activity levels of the bass would be different. What about the depth of the bass? If a bass goes to deeper water for summer at , for instance as WRB stated, 70 degrees water temp in Texas, would a bass in Illinois prepare for the summer at 70 degrees also? Or would it be like 65 degrees? I would tend to lean towards what webertime stated also, that light spectrum would play a large part. There can be a significant difference in sunrise/sunset times here in Illinois than in the south. 

 

What the basis of my question is for, is I am going to start kayak fishing this season. I am also going to get a boat in about a year. I'm going to be able to start paying close attention to water temps now and will be able to fish basically wherever I want. So when I'm reading about how to fish in early spring, summer, fall, etc. and the correlating water temps, will I need to make adjustments for fishing in the north? Or will 60 degree water temp fishing be the same in Illinois as it is in Texas? The fun part will be getting out and trying it out, I just also enjoy the study and dissecting of information to try and become a better angler. 

[Mr. Aquarium]

Florida strain bass can’t tolerate  cold temperatures like northern bass 

[soflabasser]

9 hours ago, Mr. Aquarium said:

Florida strain bass can’t tolerate  cold temperatures like northern bass 

That is correct but you can still catch Florida bass even in the coldest of cold fronts in Florida, you just have to slow down your presentation most of the time.

[WRB]

Bass are cold blooded animals their body temps are the same as the water they live in.

All Black Bass prefer warmer water, they are the sunfish family, not  true bass.

How cold of water can bass live in? 

Since bass can't breath air they breath dissolved oxygen and too high mL/g over 12 stresses the bass and too low mL/g under 3 also stresses the bass 3 to 12 is their range.

Water colder then 39.4 degrees is supersaturated with DO levels and starts to float until it gets 32 degrees where it freezes. Ice is lighter weight then water. 33 degree water is lighter weight then 38 degree. If the cold water DO levels exceed 14 mL/g the bass can no longer survive. For this reason bass go deeper to find water temps above 38 degrees with DO levels within their survival range.

Florida LMB lower water temp limit is around 45 degrees and that fact restricts their distribution into colder climates.

I grew up bass fishing at Big Bear lake* at 7,200 elevation about 100 miles south of Los Angeles Ca. The bass at Big Bear spawn when the water temps are 62 dergree in May**. Where I live now and most of my bass fishing is 30 miles north of Los Angeles at Lakes Casitas, Castiac etc and the bass spawn at 62 degrees in March. All these lakes are in the same photoperiod so day light isn't a factor, water temps are.

Tom

* Big Bear freezes.

** Calendar months are average depends on weather condition and usually on going for 6 to 8 weeks.

 

 

[kdubracing]

16 hours ago, WRB said:

Bass are cold blooded animals their body temps are the same as the water they live in.

All Black Bass prefer warmer water, they are the sunfish family, not  true bass.

How cold of water can bass live in? 

Since bass can't breath air they breath dissolved oxygen and too high mL/g over 12 stresses the bass and too low mL/g under 3 also stresses the bass 3 to 12 is their range.

Water colder then 39.4 degrees is supersaturated with DO levels and starts to float until it gets 32 degrees where it freezes. Ice is lighter weight then water. 33 degree water is lighter weight then 38 degree. If the cold water DO levels exceed 14 mL/g the bass can no longer survive. For this reason bass go deeper to find water temps above 38 degrees with DO levels within their survival range.

Florida LMB lower water temp limit is around 45 degrees and that fact restricts their distribution into colder climates.

I grew up bass fishing at Big Bear lake* at 7,200 elevation about 100 miles south of Los Angeles Ca. The bass at Big Bear spawn when the water temps are 62 dergree in May**. Where I live now and most of my bass fishing is 30 miles north of Los Angeles at Lakes Casitas, Castiac etc and the bass spawn at 62 degrees in March. All these lakes are in the same photoperiod so day light isn't a factor, water temps are.

Tom

* Big Bear freezes.

** Calendar months are average depends on weather condition and usually on going for 6 to 8 weeks.

 

 

What about bass that live is shallow ponds/small lakes? This would suggest they can not survive a cold winter. Unless there is a drastic difference in water temps in a small depth change.

[WRB]

It's not uncommon for bass in northern ponds to die off from too cold of water. There is a reason bass distribution is limited to a survivable climate.

The earth heats the ground year around to about 60 degrees, 3' to 6' below the surface and that keeps deep water warmer then shallow water in the winter. Spring water also stays around 50 to 60 degrees heating or cooling the surrounding water year around.

Keep in mind bass evolved in their harsh environment and adjust to what is availble if possible.

Tom

 

 

[kdubracing]

So basically the ground will heat up the water enough to keep the temps at a survivable level as long is it isn't too shallow. It will just obviously take it longer to warm up based on the air temps. Thanks for the responses. It seems the best tactic is to use the water temp as the main factor in trying to locate fish, with the best fishing locations being the same everywhere based on the specific temps. The amount of sunlight, wind, etc. being factors more for bait selection.

[OCdockskipper]

18 hours ago, WRB said:

...I grew up bass fishing at Big Bear lake* at 7,200 elevation about 100 miles south of Los Angeles Ca. The bass at Big Bear spawn when the water temps are 62 dergree in May**. Where I live now and most of my bass fishing is 30 miles north of Los Angeles at Lakes Casitas, Castiac etc and the bass spawn at 62 degrees in March. All these lakes are in the same photoperiod so day light isn't a factor, water temps are.

Tom

* Big Bear freezes.

** Calendar months are average depends on weather condition and usually on going for 6 to 8 weeks.

This is an excellent example where fish located north spawn earlier than southern brethern.

 

An extended example of this is where I live in Orange County, which is almost due west of Big Bear (both south of Los Angeles).  Early to mid February, the water temps here breach 60 degrees and stay there consistently, which coincides with when we see the first bass on beds.  Our lake is shallow (13 ft max) and never drops below 50 degrees, yet the spawning period is still triggered by the same water temps as that of a lake much deeper that freezes over.  These lakes have the same photoperiod, the latter is just at a higher elevation.

 

So as far as spawning & prespawn goes, the environment the bass lives in doesn't alter what the trigger is.

[WRB]

Google search "The Cosmic Clock andcBass Calendar". Water temps affect calendar periods, daily activity or rythym is affected by sunlight depth of light into the water. 

It's impossible  to predict weather in advance and  that is something that changes constantly affecting activity and location. 

Tom

[kdubracing]

16 minutes ago, WRB said:

Google search "The Cosmic Clock andcBass Calendar". Water temps affect calendar periods, daily activity or rythym is affected by sunlight depth of light into the water. 

It's impossible  to predict weather in advance and  that is something that changes constantly affecting activity and location. 

Tom

Good resource. Thank you.

I know it's going to vary quite a bit based on the weather, but what is a general guideline for the time it takes for the water temp to increase, say, 3-4 degrees?

[BigAngus752]

51 minutes ago, kdubracing said:

Good resource. Thank you.

I know it's going to vary quite a bit based on the weather, but what is a general guideline for the time it takes for the water temp to increase, say, 3-4 degrees?

I understand why you are asking all of this, but you are overcomplicating it just a bit.  You keep mentioning Illinois so lets talk about an Illinois lake.  Newton Lake is a cooling lake for a coal-fired power plant.  I went there in October and caught my biggest bass of 2019.  I went there in December and got skunked.  The water temps were in the low 50's, but it was December and the bass were in "winter mode" just like all the bass everywhere in Illinois.   I will go back to Newton in early February because they will be in pre-spawn to spawn mode depending upon where they are in the lake and what the weather has been like.  The other lakes I fish won't get to pre-spawn/early spawners until the mid to late March.  My point is that the bass are all acting the same.  You have to adapt to the water you are fishing. 

 

As for you question about how long it takes water temps to change, I have a pond across the road from me that I have permission to fish.  I've posted about it several times because most days if I make five casts with a Ned rig I'll catch four bass.  I can catch bass on that pond anytime it's not frozen BUT the max depth is about five feet and even when the water is at it's coldest (not frozen) the bass will congregate in the only place where there is rock and cattails.  So it's literally fish in a bucket.  That pond is usually muddy and it's shallow so a single sunny day will raise the water temps.  Conversely, a gin clear strip mind lake that is 40+ feet deep outside of Mahomet, IL will need a couple weeks of sun to see much temp movement.  

[Sam]

On 12/31/2019 at 2:45 AM, JediAmoeba said:

Just like people that live in the north, we are more acclimated to the cold and don't suffer as many consequences out in the elements.  When its 30 degrees outside I wear a very light jacket and am usually toasty.  Take a Floridian and they freeze their arses off at 50.  

 

Same goes for fish.

From Louisiana. Make that 70* for me.

[kdubracing]

53 minutes ago, BigAngus752 said:

I understand why you are asking all of this, but you are overcomplicating it just a bit.  You keep mentioning Illinois so lets talk about an Illinois lake.  Newton Lake is a cooling lake for a coal-fired power plant.  I went there in October and caught my biggest bass of 2019.  I went there in December and got skunked.  The water temps were in the low 50's, but it was December and the bass were in "winter mode" just like all the bass everywhere in Illinois.   I will go back to Newton in early February because they will be in pre-spawn to spawn mode depending upon where they are in the lake and what the weather has been like.  The other lakes I fish won't get to pre-spawn/early spawners until the mid to late March.  My point is that the bass are all acting the same.  You have to adapt to the water you are fishing. 

 

As for you question about how long it takes water temps to change, I have a pond across the road from me that I have permission to fish.  I've posted about it several times because most days if I make five casts with a Ned rig I'll catch four bass.  I can catch bass on that pond anytime it's not frozen BUT the max depth is about five feet and even when the water is at it's coldest (not frozen) the bass will congregate in the only place where there is rock and cattails.  So it's literally fish in a bucket.  That pond is usually muddy and it's shallow so a single sunny day will raise the water temps.  Conversely, a gin clear strip mind lake that is 40+ feet deep outside of Mahomet, IL will need a couple weeks of sun to see much temp movement.  

A couple of reasons for all the questions. I haven't fished other than off a bank since I was a teenager in Texas. I used to fish moderately seriously for a couple of years, but again, I was a teenager. I now live in Illinois. My son is out of the house at school now, so I decided fishing was the hobby I was going to revive to occupy my time now that I don't have his sports (other than his football season) to occupy it anymore. Plus, the wife will go with me. We're getting kayaks now, and a boat in about a year. I need to learn how to find fish, and I'm completely unfamiliar with Illinois water. Another reason is I'm a very analytical person. I enjoy using this time in the winter sitting on the couch to dissect my revived hobby. 

 

That's why most of my questions are pretty general. I know enough about bass fishing to know that every piece of water is different. And there are many factors that affect what bass do on a daily basis. I may be over-complicating it some, but I'm just using this down time to educate myself the best I can since I have nothing better to do. Once it warms up in Illinois, I'll be hitting the water and learning with experience.

[BigAngus752]

14 minutes ago, kdubracing said:

Once it warms up in Illinois

I fish when the water isn't hard.  I am an expert at getting skunked in any season or weather!

[WRB]

The ability to eliminate unproductive water quickly is essential to catching bass consistantly. Understanding basic bass behavior is a big step towards knowing where to start verses blindly guessing where to start.

I put together the Comic Clock and Bass Calendar for a seminar on bass fishing in May of 1974, over 45 years ago. I did this to share what I had learned the prior 20 years of bass fishing. Seasonal periods were not discussed anywhere before this time period and to be honest there were a lot of blank looks and dought in the audience back then. 

I sent a copy to Ray Scott to see if he was interested in doing a article and he replied "it's impossible to predict bass behavior" and had no interest. I recieved a invitation to be a In-Fisherman charter member ( general mailer to anyone who bass fished) and decided to send Al Linder a copy of my presentation and they responded they had come to very similar seasonal periods and offered to have me do a few articles for them.

Learning bass behavior helped me catch hundreds of big bass by eliminating water quickly and fishing high percentage locations for active feeding bass.

Sharing information doesn't always mean it will be accepted, take away what works for you.

Tom

 

[bazzelite19]

No it wouldnt really be the same, maybe some but in a nutshell northern strain largies are much more apt to bite down into the mid40s or cooler. Florida strain like much warmer water around 55+. Smallmouths/spots can be had in much cooler temps. In places the lake varely freeze bass will react much quicker to warmth. Places that stay froze will see the same patterns usually until thaw out.

[Catt]

A bass's metabolism is finally tuned to its circulatory system's temperature which is the same as the surrounding water temperature.

 

This doesn't mean bass do not actively feed in cold water, it simply means it takes longer to digest what they ate.

 

Bass are predators & will react to lures placed in close proximity to their face. 

 

A couple hours after y'all got done eating Thanksgiving Turkey with all the trimmings ya still ate pumpkin pie!

 

Bass are the same, they ain't done digesting their last meal when they ate your lure.

 

Cold water does shut down the males but the females are pregnant & the urge to feed out ways the cold temperatures.

 

Many anglers mistakenly believe the males moves up first to locate & build nest but the females are already there feeding.

 

Water temperature is only part of the equation!

 

Rant over  ?

[Dirtyeggroll]

On 12/31/2019 at 9:15 PM, WRB said:

Ice is lighter weight then water. 33 degree water is lighter weight then 38 degree. 

 

 

You mean to tell me a pound of ice weighs less than a pound of water?

 

Kidding of course. Thanks for sharing your info in detail.

[Mr. Aquarium]

Water is it’s heaviest at 39