Best budget fluorocarbon

[WRB]

2 hours ago, LegendaryBassin said:

I agree personally. I use Sniper, Invizx, Gamma Edge, Tatsu. But I know people who like Red Label. 

Retying won't help if you tie improper knots though. Double check how to tie a proper knot that works well with fluorocarbon

As I said my knot tying skills are second to none. Tying Palomar and San Deigo jam knots before they were called those names. When Fred Hall show gave away tackle for the highest knot strength tested at the show I won several contest. Anal about knot tying. FC often fails away from the knot from fishing stresses. Also anal about drag setting and use a digital scale to set them at 1/3rd the line strength. I run the line between my fingers on every retrieve and check the line nearly every cast.

You are barking up the wrong tree with your assuming the issue is poorly tied knots!

I have tested knots using aerospace tensile testing equipment at various load rates to determine how to improve the FC knot performance. I use line diameter, not label pound test data, diameter is everything with line to lure performance. It would be easy to simply go up in diameter, if the giant bass would strike the lure used.

Peace,

Tom

[Steveo-1969]

22 hours ago, NHBull said:

Gamma Edge fits your needs and is better than red label and such

Gamma Edge is the most abrasion resistant, good handling, low-stretch fluorocarbon I've ever used. But it's even MORE expensive than Tatsu.

 

10# Gamma Edge: 100 yard spool for $26

10# Seaguar Tatsu: 200 yard spool for $40

[king fisher]

1 hour ago, WRB said:

As I said my knot tying skills are second to none. Tying Palomar and San Deigo jam knots before they were called those names. When Fred Hall show gave away tackle for the highest knot strength tested at the show I won several contest. Anal about knot tying. FC often fails away from the knot from fishing stresses. Also anal about drag setting and use a digital scale to set them at 1/3rd the line strength. I run the line between my fingers on every retrieve and check the line nearly every cast.

You are barking up the wrong tree with your assuming the issue is poorly tied knots!

I have tested knots using aerospace tensile testing equipment at various load rates to determine how to improve the FC knot performance. I use line diameter, not label pound test data, diameter is everything with line to lure performance. It would be easy to simply go up in diameter, if the giant bass would strike the lure used.

Peace,

Tom

Have you done any tests on the amount of stretch floro has?  I'm sitting here with about a yard of 12 pouond Sunline Sniper, and the same amount of 12 pound Ande Premium mono.  Just by pulling the two by hand, I  can't determine any difference in stretch.  I know this is not a scientific test, that is why I'm asking how much difference in stretch there is when an actual mechanical  test is preformed.  I know the manufactures claim very little stretch with floro, but I don't seem to notice a big difference.  I might be wrong, most of my experience with floro, is with leader only.    

[NHBull]

2 hours ago, Steveo-1969 said:

Gamma Edge is the most abrasion resistant, good handling, low-stretch fluorocarbon I've ever used. But it's even MORE expensive than Tatsu.

 

10# Gamma Edge: 100 yard spool for $26

10# Seaguar Tatsu: 200 yard spool for $40

Heck, I have never paid anywhere near those prices....

[WRB]

The only difference between premium mono, coploymer and fluorocarbon stretch using equal dia's is about 3%-5% higher yield start force at around 37%-40% verses 35%-38% ultimate strength force, all stretch nearly equal elongation length. Braid stretches also around 75% of Ulitmate strength, the elongation is lower, meaning it fails shortly after it yields.

It's difficult to get accurate data, the knot sliding until it bottoms out, you see the force staying even while the holding jaws are traveling apart then the force makes a smooth rise. All knots tend to slide as they tighten under testing force.

Tom

[jbsoonerfan]

That's like asking what the best budget toilet paper is, good chance it's going to end up being a pain in the a$$. 

[Kdizzle]

Berkley Vanish has always done the job for me as a leader line.  Its good for one fishing trip, after which I cut it an tie a new one.  Their 8 and 10 pound test versions are my go to leader material.

 

Of course if I were gonna fill up an entire spool with flouro I'd go for a more expensive option probably, but I don't so there you go.

[Dirtyeggroll]

On 10/11/2019 at 5:41 PM, WRB said:

The only difference between premium mono, coploymer and fluorocarbon stretch using equal dia's is about 3%-5% higher yield start force at around 37%-40% verses 35%-38% ultimate strength force, all stretch nearly equal elongation length. Braid stretches also around 75% of Ulitmate strength, the elongation is lower, meaning it fails shortly after it yields.

It's difficult to get accurate data, the knot sliding until it bottoms out, you see the force staying even while the holding jaws are traveling apart then the force makes a smooth rise. All knots tend to slide as they tighten under testing force.

Tom

What are your opinions about sensitivity of fluoro vs mono?

 

I have limited experience, but in the few times I have compared the two, I certainly noticed a difference using the same rod between equal pound test ratings (I did not pay attention to diameter), where I could feel much more of the bottom with FC compared to mono.

[WRB]

If FC is the main line the fact it has lower coeffient of drag in water then Nylon it takes less force to move the line. The fact FC is heavier density it tends to have less bow in the line between your rod tip and the lure with slightly slack line. Combine those 2 factors and FC gives the angler better feedback any movements with the lure.

Feedback with bottom contact lures using FC main line is an advantage and the reason I have put up with all it's random failures for 25 years. I use it less and less every year.

Tom

[Dirtyeggroll]

9 hours ago, WRB said:

If FC is the main line the fact it has lower coeffient of drag in water then Nylon it takes less force to move the line. The fact FC is heavier density it tends to have less bow in the line between your rod tip and the lure with slightly slack line. Combine those 2 factors and FC gives the angler better feedback any movements with the lure.

Feedback with bottom contact lures using FC main line is an advantage and the reason I have put up with all it's random failures for 25 years. I use it less and less every year.

Tom

Thanks for the insight!

[Luke Barnes]

I ended up getting a spool of Hi Seas Grand Slam copoly and spooled up my Black Max baitcaster with it and fished yesterday. Didnt catch anything on that setup but man what a difference it made in casting and feel over the cheap mono I was using before. I cant sling it out like my other baitcaster with braid, but it casted a spinnerbait nicely and felt good on the retrieve. 

[ChrisD46]

Seaguar Red Label FC .

[pauldconyers]

On 10/10/2019 at 11:07 AM, Russ E said:

With fluorocarbon you definitely get what you pay for.

saving 4 or 5 dollars is not worth it to me. there are a lot of things that can make you lose the  fish of a lifetime.

I do not want crappy line to be one of them.

 

you can save money by putting a mono backing on the reel and only using 75 to 100 yards of fluoro.

 

cheaper fluorocarbon lines usually have terrible knot strength and strange breakoffs.

 

Lines I will no longer use are:

seaguar red label

spiderwire ez-fluoro

berkley vanish

p-line fluoroclear

vicious fluorocarbon

 

 

lines I have had success with:

sunline sniper    ( my favorite)

sunline shooter

sunline assasin

berkley 100% fluorocarbon

seaguar invis-x

seaguar abras-x

seaguar tatsu      (probably the best overall, but extremely expensive)

 

there are othe lines available, but I do not have any experience with them.

Thanks for this post! This is the first year I've tried FC and I went with Inviz-X due to reputation and recommendations from others on here. Had it on my Dobyns FR 705CB (I think you've mentioned having this rod as well) and I just could not believe how "whippy" it felt in the tip and when trying to yo-yo a lipless back. Plus I just seemed to have no real distance when casting a 1/2oz RES and since the whole setup was new to me I could not figure out if it was the rod, line or the new SLX reel. Well I took your recommendation and I went with some 12# Shooter and man I was impressed with what I experienced this evening out at Jacomo! By comparison the 12# Inviz-X just feels a lot more stretchy to me. Also I've heard guys talk about how much "smoother one line comes off a spool" than another and had not really experienced that. Man there was just a NIGHT AND DAY difference between the two and I got SIGNIFICANT more casting distance! Thanks again for the tip on the Sniper!

[Stephen B]

On 10/11/2019 at 3:10 PM, WRB said:

As I said my knot tying skills are second to none. Tying Palomar and San Deigo jam knots before they were called those names. When Fred Hall show gave away tackle for the highest knot strength tested at the show I won several contest. Anal about knot tying. FC often fails away from the knot from fishing stresses. Also anal about drag setting and use a digital scale to set them at 1/3rd the line strength. I run the line between my fingers on every retrieve and check the line nearly every cast.

Sounds like you may get in your own way being that extreme if you ask me. It's a good thing to pay attention to detail but sometimes we as fisherman can get in our own way. Just need to learn to tie a few good knots and set your drag to what you find ample. Just fish. Have yet to have a knot/line fail on fluorocarbon fighting a fish.

[WRB]

42 minutes ago, Stephen B said:

Sounds like you may get in your own way being that extreme if you ask me. It's a good thing to pay attention to detail but sometimes we as fisherman can get in our own way. Just need to learn to tie a few good knots and set your drag to what you find ample. Just fish. Have yet to have a knot/line fail on fluorocarbon fighting a fish.

Let me know when you put a bass in the boat that weighs more then the pound test of your FC line how your knot tieing skill worked out.

Tom

[Efishin]

1 hour ago, WRB said:

Let me know when you put a bass in the boat that weighs more then the pound test of your FC line how your knot tieing skill worked out.

Tom

This guy again...

No issues for me either. I use Red Label and SNiper

[J Francho]

2 hours ago, WRB said:

Let me know when you put a bass fish in the boat that weighs more then the pound test of your FC line how your knot tieing skill worked out.

Tom

13-8 on 8#Invisx

 

Unweighed on 6# Invisx

 

Unweighed on 6# Invisx

 

Unweighed on 6# Invisx

 

Worked out fine for me?

[RichF]

2 minutes ago, J Francho said:

13-8 on 8#Invisx

 

Unweighed on 6# Invisx

 

Unweighed on 6# Invisx

 

Unweighed on 6# Invisx

 

Worked out fine for me?

That brownie is a beaut!

[WRB]

Nice to see a skilled angler catches.

Tom

[RichF]

No largemouth will ever pull as hard as that 15+ lb King @J Francho has there.

[J Francho]

2 minutes ago, RichF said:

That brownie is a beaut!

Thanks, man.  Not my biggest.  I'd say that one went around 15 or so.  Colors on spawn run males are incredible.  Here's another nice brownie.  That year, you couldn't not catch.  I pinning 10-20 in an afternoon.

 

https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-xQN4kCp/0/X2/i-xQN4kCp-X2.jpg

 

 

1 minute ago, RichF said:

No largemouth will ever pull as hard as that 15+ lb King @J Francho has there.

I had to chase that dang thing up and down that ditch to get him.

[Choporoz]

For bottom contact baitcasters, I started with cheap fluoro,

went to Yo Zuri Hybrid,

then to Braid/leader,

and then straight braid for a time,

and then higher end fluoro

 

I am going to try to simplify next season and only keep braid and YZH on hand.  I like braid with and without leaders, depending on the set up and conditions....or how I feel that day.   If I get the urge to fish straight fluoro, I'll use YZH, because with a liberal dose of KVD line and lure lube, I can barely tell the difference between YZH and 'good' fluoro.

 

I'll  continue to use straight YZH on cranking rods.  For spinning, I'm still working through which rod, which applications demand what specific line.  I love smaller fluoro....for the first couple hours --- once the loops start, it gets maddening....thin braid to leader is great....until it isn't

 

 

[JustJames]

@J Francho, I don’t think Tom meant to ask you. Do we need to really show since we all know you are skilled fisherman. I land many bass that heavier than my Lb test line but still compare to TOM I’m still average joe.

I don’t agree with him sometime but when a fisherman that land more than a dozen DD bass speak should we at least listen?

[J Francho]

It was a condescending, sarcastic response, to which I debunked.  I'm no "great fisherman."  I take what's there.  All those fish pull harder than any bass, including double digits.  I take my time tying knots, give 'em a quick pull test, and the rest is up to the rod, drag, and my own luck in landing the fish.  I think the whole knot thing is over played, in regards to fluorocarbon.  Heck, I just use an improved cinch knot on some baits.  I've even NOT wetted the line to see what happens.  Works fine.  I'll repeat, take your time, and tie a quality knot.  Doesn't matter which on, just use a knot you can tie well.  

[JustJames]

Do you think average bass anglers really spend that much time tying and checking knot? Do you think average bass anglers know how to use a proper drag according to line size and rod power? And you are right about LUCK, every time I hooked on a big fish with my small line 6lb test, all I can do is pray to whoever up above and use all my rod action/bend and smooth drag. Do you think average bass anglers using rod action/power to fight bass? I watched a lot of youtubers and at least 50% just winch the bass in with their drag lock tight reel.