billmac Posted October 11, 2019 Posted October 11, 2019 How many boats are in a standard FLW tourney? I think they all have boat marshalls now don't they?
Logan S Posted October 11, 2019 Posted October 11, 2019 It's going to be a 150 boat field. They have a marshal program now, but that's not quite the same as a boat official and they rarely have enough marshals to put on in every boat. It's all right here... https://www.flwfishing.com/tips/2019-10-10-how-the-mlf-acquisition-will-affect-me
BassResource.com Administrator Glenn Posted October 11, 2019 BassResource.com Administrator Posted October 11, 2019 @OCdockskipper You need to cool your jets big guy. You're stirring the pot intentionally and then trying to play the victim card. That won't pass with me. Warnings are next. 3
Jim- Indiana Posted October 11, 2019 Posted October 11, 2019 1 hour ago, YoTone said: Will top FLW pros like Thrift and Martin be able to compete with the MLF pros this year? As things set now, there doesn't appear they have a way. From what I know, the BPT guys are under a 3 year contract, and doubt that any step down and break that contract. If MLF increased the field to include others, they would likely be breaking that contract as well.
Pantera61 Posted October 11, 2019 Posted October 11, 2019 4 hours ago, TnRiver46 said: That would be nice 4 hours ago, TnRiver46 said: The thing is, MLF could switch to, or incorporate a "best 5" model with no trouble whatsoever. Why on God's Green Earth would MLF go backwards to a "best 5" model? The whole point of MLF is to see guys catching fish, not weighing in. You would figure Randy Blaukat would pipe in with some support with the conservation aspect of MLF. Think about that tournament of a few years back where Mike McClelland drove 6 hours and fished 2 hours. Did those fish get returned to where they were caught? The reduced impact on the fisheries alone is a light year leap in the right direction. Another impact on fisheries? Smaller venues with smaller fields reduce fishing on overfished big name bodies of water. People start to think about other vacation options to fish and go to smaller lakes and spend time and money in less populated areas. This is "Growing the sport" without placing additional burden on overused resources.
Global Moderator TnRiver46 Posted October 11, 2019 Global Moderator Posted October 11, 2019 13 minutes ago, Pantera61 said: Why on God's Green Earth would MLF go backwards to a "best 5" model? The whole point of MLF is to see guys catching fish, not weighing in. You would figure Randy Blaukat would pipe in with some support with the conservation aspect of MLF. Think about that tournament of a few years back where Mike McClelland drove 6 hours and fished 2 hours. Did those fish get returned to where they were caught? The reduced impact on the fisheries alone is a light year leap in the right direction. Another impact on fisheries? Smaller venues with smaller fields reduce fishing on overfished big name bodies of water. People start to think about other vacation options to fish and go to smaller lakes and spend time and money in less populated areas. This is "Growing the sport" without placing additional burden on overused resources. What i meant, and i think what @billmac meant (somehow i believe you quoted something he said and attributed it to me) is that they could still release the fish immediately after catch and just determine winner by the best 5 instead of total cumulative weight . Still no fish in livewell, i just dont like watching people intentionally target small bass and broadcast it on tv. I want to see the best in the biz target the biggest bass and i don't think I'm alone. Im not mad about it, just what i enjoy. And if its gone for good oh well, i still have boats and rods
Pantera61 Posted October 11, 2019 Posted October 11, 2019 4 minutes ago, TnRiver46 said: What i meant, and i think what @billmac meant (somehow i believe you quoted something he said and attributed it to me) is that they could still release the fish immediately after catch and just determine winner by the best 5 instead of total cumulative weight . Still no fish in livewell, i just dont like watching people intentionally target small bass and broadcast it on tv. I want to see the best in the biz target the biggest bass and i don't think I'm alone. Im not mad about it, just what i enjoy. And if its gone for good oh well, i still have boats and rods I don't know where people get the idea about MLF being a dinkfest. I've watched every episode of the Cups, the Selects, the CBS tourneys and the streamed BPT and what I've seen is anglers, pro anglers, doing what they do best, catch fish. They match the techniques and tackle to the conditions they encounter. It's a matter of when in Rome. One of the most boring things about streamed tournaments is pretending that watching a guy dropping a tube in a nest for 2 hours is exciting. It's not. Honest people admit it's not.
billmac Posted October 11, 2019 Posted October 11, 2019 Yes, what I'm saying is that you can do Catch and Immediate Release and Best 5. When I got back into fishing and started watching tourney videos, one of the things that distressed me was how badly the fish were treated, both by FLW and especially BASS. MLF's rules were a breath of fresh air. I understand the business realities of tournaments, but I've never liked the weigh-in debacle.
Super User J Francho Posted October 11, 2019 Super User Posted October 11, 2019 52 minutes ago, Pantera61 said: I don't know where people get the idea about MLF being a dinkfest. The last time I watched a BPT event live, all I saw was one pound 'score-able' bass after another. Most of the excitement was at the cut line. 4
zell_pop1 Posted October 11, 2019 Posted October 11, 2019 Does MLF still have the 12" size limit? I always thought just going to 15" fish would make it less a dinkfest. That's actually why I usually do not watch MLF. I can go out to a lake nearby and catch 20-30 12"s in a day, but finding 15"+ bass is tough, so I am not impressed by pros catching dinks. Actually I think it is too bad BASS & FLW were not the ones to merge. 1
Super User jbsoonerfan Posted October 11, 2019 Super User Posted October 11, 2019 20 minutes ago, zell_pop1 said: Does MLF still have the 12" size limit? I always thought just going to 15" fish would make it less a dinkfest. That's actually why I usually do not watch MLF. I can go out to a lake nearby and catch 20-30 12"s in a day, but finding 15"+ bass is tough, so I am not impressed by pros catching dinks. Actually I think it is too bad BASS & FLW were not the ones to merge. 1 pound
Shimano_1 Posted October 12, 2019 Posted October 12, 2019 I have no problems with the MLF format and I guess I understand why everyone went. However...after this buyout I will be hoping the elite series can continue to grow and succeed. Seems that as big as bass fishing has become there's room for all of it. I never see it as a win for one entity to own everything. As already stated, the classic will always be the super bowl of bass fishing in my eyes and it wont look the same without the guys I've always watched being there. I get it...times change...I'm just old school and absolutely hate change lol. 2
Super User Jrob78 Posted October 12, 2019 Super User Posted October 12, 2019 It cracks me up that there are still people talking about MLF changing to a 5 biggest fish format but with c&r. They've been doing this for what, 10 years now? As soon as they got the chance all the top anglers in the sport jumped to this format. MLF just bought FLW and is changing their format to the MLF format, in the best way that they can without having to cut the field down dramatically. The every fish counts format isn't going anywhere, it's expanding. Yes there were some BPT events this year where 1 pounders ruled but there were also some where 5-8 lbers were plentiful. It isn't that much different than BASS or FLW events where 12-14 lbs a day wins the tournament and guys spend all day culling up 2 oz at a time. The drama is always at the cutline or for #1 spot on the final day. I am really curious to see if any of the top FLW guys are given entrance to the Elite Series. I'm sure some of them aren't happy about being relegated to the MLF feeder system.
Super User WRB Posted October 12, 2019 Super User Posted October 12, 2019 B.A.S.S. relied on the community to come to their events and spend money at sponsor booths, selling memberships and their magazine revenue. TV audience time has always been a major drawback with the B.A.S.S. format, hoping the weighins could draw sponsors TV time. The west never supported B.A.S.S. events with high community turnouts and they lost money, the western pro's had to move east to compete. MLF changed that, sponsors make good TV money, the competitors can live wherever they want and the format offers lots of action to edit for the audience with some drama. The dink fest label doesn't apply, every event has several 4 to 5 lb bass to keep it interesting and the instant catch & release appeals to today's bass anglers. I am a charter life B.A.S.S. member since 1968 and the organization hasn't kept up with the changes in tournament fishing and ignored western bass angers. Tom 2
Pantera61 Posted October 12, 2019 Posted October 12, 2019 23 hours ago, J Francho said: The last time I watched a BPT event live, all I saw was one pound 'score-able' bass after another. Most of the excitement was at the cut line. The bass were a bit heftier on today's (10/12/19) Lake Conroe tourney
hoosierbass07 Posted October 12, 2019 Posted October 12, 2019 There must be a lot of hurting in pro bass fishing. First all the top guys leave BASS and swear allegiance to MLF. Then FLW is up for sale and MLF buys it. One problem I'm starting to notice with MLF is that they are starting to be on every other channel now. First Outdoor Channel, then CBS a few times during the summer weeks. Then Discovery Channel. Then CBS Sports Network. To be honest, MLF, even though I'm a fan, is starting to look like late night cable filler crap to fill up space on the cable networks simply to put lame commercials around. They really need to hold live tournaments like BASS and to their credit, that's what they did and as we can see now, are doing even more with them buying FLW. So, Boyd Ducket seems to know what he's doing so far.
OCdockskipper Posted October 13, 2019 Posted October 13, 2019 One thing about Boyd Ducket that rubbed me the wrong way was how he went about filling the BPT roster. Had he started that organization at a time he had no affiliation with BASS, and attempted to recruit anglers based solely on the tour he had created, that would have been fine. He didn't, what he did was start his organization at the same time he was still affiliated with BASS, using his contacts and relationships with other anglers up until the very last moment. Nothing illegal about that, just from an owner perspective it is a bit chintzy. I'm sure if 10 years from now, if BPT is still around and flourishing & Jacob Wheeler heads a group that poaches most of BPT's roster to form a new tour, Boyd might be a bit ticked off.
r83srock Posted October 13, 2019 Posted October 13, 2019 44 minutes ago, OCdockskipper said: One thing about Boyd Ducket that rubbed me the wrong way was how he went about filling the BPT roster. Had he started that organization at a time he had no affiliation with BASS, and attempted to recruit anglers based solely on the tour he had created, that would have been fine. He didn't, what he did was start his organization at the same time he was still affiliated with BASS, using his contacts and relationships with other anglers up until the very last moment. Nothing illegal about that, just from an owner perspective it is a bit chintzy. I'm sure if 10 years from now, if BPT is still around and flourishing & Jacob Wheeler heads a group that poaches most of BPT's roster to form a new tour, Boyd might be a bit ticked off. I understand what you are saying. Angler’s knew what was happening and feelings got hurt at BASS. It’s a bit of a boycott. This happens all the time in business, not saying it’s right...
sully420 Posted October 13, 2019 Posted October 13, 2019 I'm sorry, I couldn't disagree with you more Boyd only affiliation with Bass it that he fished in their tournaments. He paid to fish in those tournaments. He owed them nothing. All Boyd did was created a tournament trail that was more attractive to anglers that bass. Let's be honest there were many anglers that weren't happy with Bass, if not Boyd 5han someone else would have done it. Don't get me wrong I love Bass and think they will be just fine if they make the right decisions moving forward. In my mind Boyd did what he felt like he had to do and see nothing wrong with it. 1
OCdockskipper Posted October 14, 2019 Posted October 14, 2019 1 hour ago, sully420 said: ...Boyd only affiliation with Bass it that he fished in their tournaments. He paid to fish in those tournaments. He owed them nothing... You are correct, Ducket didn't do anything legally wrong, he just stepped out of bounds ethically in my opinion. Happens all the time in business, people work or are involved with companies, gain as much insider info as they can and then use that to leverage a new company of their creation against their former employers. Ducket spent 5 plus years working on MLF, originally under the guise that he was not going to compete with BASS or FLW, but just complement them, all the while being involved with BASS and the other anglers who fished the Elite series. To me, it just looks real shady. I think the reason I don't like people doing those actions, even though they are legal, is how it then effects the future generations of employees or contractors who work for or with the organization afterwards. You would have to think the organization that was poached from would be distrustful after that, making it less of a positive place to work at or for. There is & was a lot that BASS could have done to stop this from happening or mitigate its effects years earlier. They didn't, or didn't effectively (or fast enough), hence the result. 1
billmac Posted October 14, 2019 Posted October 14, 2019 It does make you wonder how many anglers were fishing BASS or FLW (before the word of the acquisition got out) hoping they would be invited to fish MLF. It also makes me wonder how many of the big names at MLF are tempted to jump back to BASS now that a lot of the serious competition (in their mind) is gone. 1
Pantera61 Posted October 14, 2019 Posted October 14, 2019 13 hours ago, OCdockskipper said: You are correct, Ducket didn't do anything legally wrong, he just stepped out of bounds ethically in my opinion. Happens all the time in business, people work or are involved with companies, gain as much insider info as they can and then use that to leverage a new company of their creation against their former employers. Ducket spent 5 plus years working on MLF, originally under the guise that he was not going to compete with BASS or FLW, but just complement them, all the while being involved with BASS and the other anglers who fished the Elite series. To me, it just looks real shady. I think the reason I don't like people doing those actions, even though they are legal, is how it then effects the future generations of employees or contractors who work for or with the organization afterwards. You would have to think the organization that was poached from would be distrustful after that, making it less of a positive place to work at or for. There is & was a lot that BASS could have done to stop this from happening or mitigate its effects years earlier. They didn't, or didn't effectively (or fast enough), hence the result. What are you thoughts about tournament organizations paying their contestants pennies on a dollar to compete for their own entry fees? You know, ethically, speaking? 1
Global Moderator TnRiver46 Posted October 14, 2019 Global Moderator Posted October 14, 2019 5 hours ago, Pantera61 said: What are you thoughts about tournament organizations paying their contestants pennies on a dollar to compete for their own entry fees? You know, ethically, speaking? Kind of reminds me of every job ive ever had.
OCdockskipper Posted October 14, 2019 Posted October 14, 2019 8 hours ago, Pantera61 said: What are you thoughts about tournament organizations paying their contestants pennies on a dollar to compete for their own entry fees? You know, ethically, speaking? Well, as our mothers all told us, 2 wrongs don't make a right. Ethically, if an organization is upfront about entry fees & payoffs, it doesn't matter what the ratio is as long as the company lives up to what was advertised. Don't begrudge profits going to the company that created the stage for others to launch from. If BASS had never been formed, Rick Clunn would have been a guide on Lake Conroe. If Rick Clunn had never become a BASS pro, someone else would have won those 4 Classics & BASS would still be BASS. If BASS had lousy payouts, then the market corrected itself by introducing other tours. They had to have been doing something right all these years, people wait in line to fish their tour.
preach4bass Posted October 15, 2019 Posted October 15, 2019 3 hours ago, OCdockskipper said: If BASS had lousy payouts, then the market corrected itself by introducing other tours. They had to have been doing something right all these years, people wait in line to fish their tour. That's exactly what Boyd and the MLF are doing. They're correcting the market. Nothing unethical about it.
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