Bye Bye Fluoro

[WRB]

I have a love hate affair with FC line. I use it but don't trust it for some presentations where it excels. I don't believe the low light refraction quality is important for bass fishing. FC has very low coeffient of drag going through water and is heavier then both mono/copolymer and braided lines. The low drag and weight help to keep in contact using bottom bumping lures gives FC the advantage over other lines.

The rattle snake knot strength issue is FC's Achilles heal. I know members will say they don't have a knot strength issue then go on to reveal how many different knots they use.

Before FC line came on the market bass anglers used 2 knots; clinch knot and if joining main line to leader a blood knot, both easy to tie and reliable. A few years prior to FC popularity the Palomar knot became popular for hooks and replacing the clinch knot for bass anglers in the 90's.

Then along came FC line and the knot wars started with dozens of new knots or knots never used by bass anglers. Why so many new knots? The answer is simple, FC has poor knot strength compared to mono/copolymer lines and failing at random times.

FC has higher memory then most other monofilament lines creating line management issues and the popularity of line conditioners to help solve casting issues.

I am in Glenn's camp; use the line that offers you the advantage presenting the lure to the bass.

Tom

[roadwarrior]

13 hours ago, Glenn said:

That can also be said of all lines.  IMHO, braid has limited uses, but is very well suited for them (e.g. flipping, pitching, frogging).  But that's the same with all lines. Some are better suited than others for specific tasks.

 

There really is no one-size-fits-all line. But the closest all-purpose line would be co-polymer or perhaps mono.  But again, there are limitations in those as well.

 

It's really about matching the right tool (line) to the right situation, rather than using a  "favorite" line, or forcing one type of line to do everything. 

 

Personally, I don't use leaders.  Trying to make two completely different types of lines work together is simply a series of compromises where the outcome isn't as good as using the proper line for the task in the first place.

 

Again, that's just me.

I have been a Yo-Zuri Hybrid fanboy for more than a decade and still use #4 for live bait,

but otherwise I am sold on fluorocarbon for single hook presentations, specifically Tatsu.

For treble hooks I like Sunline Shooter Deifer Armilo (monofilament).

 

 

 

[king fisher]

I do believe there are certain techniques where floro or braid have a huge advantage over mono.  For those techniques I'm glad I live in a time with those options.  I also feel that many times floro will have a small advantage, that at one time I would argue for it's use.  Now  my opinion has changed to, if the advantage is minor, why bother.  Mono is cheap and works.  That said, I ordered some floro yesterday.  Bait Monkey loves fishing line as much as lures.

[billmac]

I got around the leader knot problem by tying on 30 yards or so, so that the knot generally stays on the reel.  I probably wouldn't mess with fluoro at all, but I want to fish the St. Lawrence (haven't made it yet) and I've read that mono parts like spider silk when it encounters zebra mussels.  Not sure if that's true.

 

One of the problems I've found with fluoro is that it isn't only invisible to the fish.  I have a wicked time seeing it when dropshotting or wacky rigging.

[Mike L]

1 hour ago, Team9nine said:

No right or wrong answer here. For me, outside of frog fishing or another specialty app, it’s all fluoro all the time on BC gear - and yes, I have the pictures...lots of them ?

Ditto!

Ditto!!

 

As Ive said before many times on this board, I just don't get how so many people could be having so many problems with it.

I really don't. 

 

Other than for 2 techniques I use it for everything and have no reason to change. 

 

 

Mike

[billmac]

Are there some brands of mono that are more invisible than others?

[Team9nine]

8 minutes ago, billmac said:

Are there some brands of mono that are more invisible than others?

Harder to see - yes. More invisible - no.

[scaleface]

18 minutes ago, Team9nine said:

Harder to see - yes. More invisible - no.

Cut it out . ☺️

[fishindad]

I have also been using FC lines, primarily Sniper, for about 10 years. On both spinning and baitcast gear. Here are my thoughts and experiences.

 

1. Regarding "invisibility", no way bass are more line-shy than for example, bonefish or trout. I feel there are zero advantages as far as FC's refractive index compared to quality, clear mono or copolymer lines.

2. Knot strength. As already mentioned, it sucks, plain and simple. Try as anyone might you'll never convince me FC lines have greater knot strength than mono/copoly, no matter how many "lab" tests I read. On the water - FC lines . break more easily and more frequently. And I make sure my knots are tied very well.

3. Handling. FC is way too high maintenance. I have 2 bottles of KVD and yet no FC I've used has ever come close to McCoy's Mean Green or Damyl Tectan (for example) , especially on spinning gear, for ease in handling = no coiling. Note: I live in MI so I fish a lot of cold weather/waters.

4. Cost. No-brainer.

5. Density. The one characteristic that FC has shown a distinct advantage in that it does noticeably sink faster, and is more sensitive than mono/copoly on slack lines.

6. Abrasion resistance. Again, fishing in zebra mussel-infested waters in Michigan, I do see greater abrasion resistance with FC vs mono. However, I'll bet there are copoly lines like P-Line CXX that equal or top FC in this regard. So for bottom contact I use straight FC for dragging tubes. 

 

I do like and use braid, specifically 832 and original PP. I'll use it for the same techniques as most - frog, punch, spinning. I used to use braid to leader but with my 61 y.o. vision, no way I'm taking the minutes to tie leaders on the water, in wind and rough waters. I am going to go back to straight mono on my dropshot rod and I'll bet I see no difference in bites or fish landed. Since the weight is what's dragging bottom I'll risk losing an additional weight or two.

 

Trouble is, like a lot of you, I have plenty of filler spools of Sniper laying around. ?

[Bird]

Interesting responses and all very much respected. 

I fish quite often for hours apon hours and like to dabble with lines and techniques. 

There is one particular 68acre mountain lake that I fish several times a year that I exclusively used floro, lake is ridiculously clear.

I'm going back in 2 weeks for 4 days and already have several reels rigged with 10lb floro and several rigged with 15lb PowerPro braid.

I'm going rotate there usage with methods I've had success in the past to see for myself if there is any increase or decrease in strikes.

 

4 1/2" rainbow trout flukes nose hooked.

4 1/2" Roboworm drop shot nose hooked. 

I'll be throwing leaders and straight braid.

 

I strayed from floro years back so looking for valid reasons to reunite or forever dismissed. 

[papajoe222]

I was like WRB with the love hate relationship. Loved the sensitivity vs. mono when cranking, up brake offs on the hookset reduced its use to cranking only. Once I started paying attention to how I tied my palomar, I returned to using it for my swim jigs and Keitechs. Midway into the season, the break offs returned. I store my reels in a case and the ones that stay on my everyday combos come inside upon my return home. 

 

I’m glad to hear that many of you are pleased with it and my rant wasn’t intended to convince anyone to abandon its use. 

[Catt]

11 minutes ago, papajoe222 said:

 

I’m glad to hear that many of you are pleased with it and my rant wasn’t intended to convince anyone to abandon its use. 

 

The only way I've found fluorocarbon to even come close to me wanting use it is when you first spooled it...all down hill after that for me.

 

I used Maxima Chameleon & Maxima Ultragreen for about tens yrs. The only reason I went back to Big Game was I couldn't get Maxima easily, that was before the internet.

[Shimano_1]

I've used fc line for years and have never had it fail. Yes I've broken line from time to time just like I did with mono. Everyone has their opinions but I feel fc is much more sensitive and I use it on everything except one rod with mono for topwaters and one with braid for frogs and buzz baits. If you were using good quality line I don't see this incident being the lines fault. I certainly don't agree that it has more memory than mono either. In my experience it's been just the opposite.  I say use whatever line u have confidence in and don't try to convince everyone else to do what u do. If FC hasn't served u well by all means use what has. It has been excellent for me and everyone I fish with so we keep trucking with it

[Bassattackr]

I really like FC for the low stretch and better sensitivity, this is where it excels for me over mono.   I don't really use mono much anymore, except as leader material on some of my topwater (braid) setups.

[johnD.]

8 hours ago, scaleface said:

Coincidentally , I just watched a video by David fritz on using Fluoro and crankbaiting . He stated that floro gets weaker when it gets stretched and after  some use it will just start breaking .

Round about the time he says he went to braid is when the new berkley x5 and x9 came out. He was pushing it pretty hard and still is.

 

[Russ E]

I only use flourocarbon for 2 techniques.

Weightless fluke and Texas rigged worm.

In my opinion the enhanced  sensitivity of flouro on a semi slack line works perfectly for these 2 baits.

All other applications get braid or copoly.

One thing I have learned about flourocarbon line is do not use cheap line.

It is sunline sniper or tatsu for me. 

[Fishin Dad]

8 minutes ago, Russ E said:

I only use flourocarbon for 2 techniques.

Weightless fluke and Texas rigged worm.

In my opinion the enhanced  sensitivity of flouro on a semi slack line works perfectly for these 2 baits.

All other applications get braid or copoly.

One thing I have learned about flourocarbon line is do not use cheap line.

It is sunline sniper or tastu for me. 

Just curious what line you use for jigs?  It seems like a similar technique to Texas rigs.  For no reason at all, I have been trying fluorocarbon for jigs and braid for Texas rigs.  Still haven’t figured out what I like the best for all techniques.  

[long island basser]

4 hours ago, Mike L said:

Ditto!

Ditto!!

 

As Ive said before many times on this board, I just don't get how so many people could be having so many problems with it.

I really don't. 

 

Other than for 2 techniques I use it for everything and have no reason to change. 

 

 

Mike

Same here, I don’t even have a memory of the last time I had an issue with flouro.

I don’t use any leaders, and do use flouro,(sniper), braid(pp),and mono(this year sufix advance) straight  up on all my setups. 

Maybe I’m lucky but I don’t have problems with any of them.

[FishTank]

I have tried several different FC's over the years and so far Tatsu has been the best.  The high cost has made it hard to purchase on a consistent basis.  I have been using Invizx instead with zero issues.  I also like Sunline Sniper and Shooter but have had a spool or two give me issues.  Another I like for spinning gear is Trilene XL 100% FC.  

[WRB]

Your line is the most important item that is critical to catching fish, it's the only thing between you and fish, if the line breaks fighting the fish it gets away.

I never lost a bass from line failure until using FC. Operator failure to keep a bass from wrapping the line around something or dragging the line over something abrasive or too tight of reel drag I have broke off bass with mono/copolymer line. I have had several DD size bass break off using FC in open water while fighting them from line failure. When the bass weigh as much or more then the line pound test it takes skill and perfect performing tackle to put big bass in boat. FC helps to detect strikes but random line/knot failures that reduce your chance at catching the bass lowers your confidence in using the line.

I will not use FC line during pre spawn for big bass or at night or for finesse spinning tackle. I have lost confidence using FC line of any brand.

Maxima Ultra Green is far more abrasion resistant then FC. Sunline Diefer Armilo Nylon cast better then FC and stronger dia per dia then FC with reliable knot strength. As soon as my stock in FC is gone it's gone.

This isn't a knee jerk reaction it's taken 25 years of random  break off's to reach this decision.

Tom

[Fishaholic7lbs]

Berkley Trilene Big Game best line out there and cheap as dirt.. boat flip the big girls all day long with 20lb 

[billmac]

I don't know much about copolymer line.  Rather than rehash if it's been discussed before, is there a thread on it?

[Hammer 4]

3 minutes ago, billmac said:

I don't know much about copolymer line.  Rather than rehash if it's been discussed before, is there a thread on it?

Take your pick, there are a few here..   https://www.bassresource.com/bass-fishing-forums/search/?q=copolymer line

[Todd2]

7 minutes ago, billmac said:

I don't know much about copolymer line.  Rather than rehash if it's been discussed before, is there a thread on it?

Copolymer and mono are basically the same or at least I can't tell a difference. Now you have many different types of each, ranging from soft and more manageable (Trilene XL)  to harder more durable lines (Trilene XT). Stren and Big Game seem to be in the middle somewhere. Of course there are countless others.

[Jason Penn]

i'm pro fc. i'm pretty much a slack liner, braid just feels dead to me other than tight line techniques.

 

i use a eugene knot and have had no problems with break offs. i havent had an issue since i started inserting weights.