Trouble with Backlash on Strong Casts?

[dodgeguy]

Backlash midway means either more thumb or spool tension. Do you cast with the handle up ? If not turn reel 90 degrees and cast.

[WRB]

30 lb Samuri braid is a extremely soft small diameter braid for a 400 size Calcutta reel to perform with, the spool isn't designed it.

If high capacity braid is your goal try FINS WindTamer braid, it's designed for bait casting reels.

Tom

[Reverendo]

1 hour ago, WRB said:

30 lb Samuri braid is a extremely soft small diameter braid for a 400 size Calcutta reel to perform with, the spool isn't designed it.

If high capacity braid is your goal try FINS WindTamer braid, it's designed for bait casting reels.

Tom

Alright.  Keep in mind that this is a Calcutta Conquest, not the regular Calcutta which is about twice the width... no kidding.

The regular Calcutta 400 is similar in size to the Millionaire 300 in this vid. 

Not sure if that makes a difference? 

 

 

[WRB]

1 hour ago, Reverendo said:

Alright.  Keep in mind that this is a Calcutta Conquest, not the regular Calcutta which is about twice the width... no kidding.

The regular Calcutta 400 is similar in size to the Millionaire 300 in this vid. 

Not sure if that makes a difference? 

 

 

Calcutta D and Conquest A are very similar in size and line capacity, neither reel is designed to cast 30 lb light weight braid. 

The backlash issue is caused by the spool spinning faster then the line is coming off the spool. Braking systems take into account the spool weight with line or total spool weight. Samauri braid is very light weight and small dia per test.

You have 350 yards of very soft light weight braid trying to come off the spool spinning at maximum rpm's p, the centrifical force on the spooled braid want to expand the core of the line, air resistance is stopping the line in flight and the spool continues to spin at high rpm's because the brakes don't sense any change in spool weight....backlash!

40 lb Fins WindTamer doesn't tend to kit is a stiffer line so it doesn't wind knot, it's also polyuerathane coated to reduce friction and makes the line color fast.

I wouldn't go any smaller dia then .012 or .013 D / 30 or 40 lb WindTamer braid on your reel. 30 lb Samauri is .010D. 

Tom 

[CrankFate]

The problem is most likely the rod. Until you have a rod that properly absorbs the power in the way you swing the rod, so that it slingshots the weight properly, you will get little help from the reel. Unfortunately, the only way to know what will work best for you is feeling what is off in the cast for yourself. Usually, you have to go through several rods to get one that will work for what your doing. It’s useless to listen to other people’s choices. That’s what gets you selling off the rods in the BST. 

 

Once you have the right rod, you just need to find out if you need more or less line on your spool, more or less brakes, more or less spool tension, thinner or thicker line, etc, etc, etc.

 

The worst thing to do for this problem IMO, is just ask other people what’s wrong. The best way to fix this, is to start with the advice of others and then feel what is going wrong in the cast. It’s almost always a too stiff or too soft rod. Or a rod that flexes to close to the tip or too far down from the tip.

In my opinion 1 to 3 ounces is the easiest weight to cast and is the easiest weight to get the “feel” of what is going wrong. Try a few rods and keep doing it. Before you know it you’ll get the feel and figure it out.

[WRB]

Any decent MH moderate action swimbait rod rated 1-5 oz will cast 1 1/2-3 oz swimbaits with ease ove 60 yards. Dobyns 795 for example would be choice in whatever price range is preferred.

 .010 dia braid on a Conquest reel is problematic and surprised you haven't casted off the swimbait when getting backlashes.

Tom

[islandbass]

17 hours ago, Reverendo said:

OK right now I have three of the eight brakes on. I tried all the brakes on and went down to just one brake on. Of course with the one brake, I  used more thumb control. In all instances the maximum distance I could get was about 40 yards.  When I really try to put some uumph into it, I would get the overrun about 20 to 25 yards in.

 

By the way I come to the site to gain knowledge from some of the best fishermen in the industry,. In saying that I hope I don’t get flamed for saying that I’m using 350 yards  mainly because I’m fishing for LMB’s Saltywater cousins, Mr. Snook.  In the salt is not uncommon to have a fish, not necessarily a snook, zip off 150 yards in a blink. 

I get it. You’re merely meeting the needs of your situation and I think you’re right to do so. I would presume for most bass only anglers who will view this through their bass angler lenses to be inconceivable since they don’t and won’t ever deal with such a need. 

 

Ive been spooled by a chum salmon with a fully loaded 200 sized curado. Would’ve been nice to have had 350 yards. 

[Tim Kelly]

I've never had any sea fishing where the species are that explosive. If a fish genuinely pulls 150 yards off you, what are the chances of you actually landing it? Seems like they'd be fish you'd be likely to lose no matter how much line you have, but I've never done it.

[king fisher]

Just now, Tim Kelly said:

I've never had any sea fishing where the species are that explosive. If a fish genuinely pulls 150 yards off you, what are the chances of you actually landing it? Seems like they'd be fish you'd be likely to lose no matter how much line you have, but I've never done it.

150 yard run is nothing for many saltwater fish.  Even a Bonefish can take that much line in an initial run.  Yes you can land a fish that takes well over 150 yards of line.  Happens all the time in both salt and fresh water. In open water a person can land very big fish on light tackle, as long as you don't run out of line and time.

[Paul Roberts]

Well... I didn't reads all the posts... apologies if I'm redundant. If your rod is exceptionally stiff (F/XF) it may be the culprit. Long bombing casts are best accomplished with a slower rod. This does not mean lacking in power. It should load on the cast, and the longer the level, the easier it is for longer and smoother casts. Something to check off as you troubleshoot.

[Reverendo]

23 minutes ago, Tim Kelly said:

I've never had any sea fishing where the species are that explosive. If a fish genuinely pulls 150 yards off you, what are the chances of you actually landing it? Seems like they'd be fish you'd be likely to lose no matter how much line you have, but I've never done it.

Had a 100# tarpon do that.  Nearly spooled me.  Fortunately, we followed him on the boat.  In 45 minutes. He was boat side.  

6 minutes ago, Paul Roberts said:

Well... I didn't reads all the posts... apologies if I'm redundant. If your rod is exceptionally stiff (F/XF) it may be the culprit. Long bombing casts are best accomplished with a slower rod. This does not mean lacking in power. It should load on the cast, and the longer the level, the easier it is for longer and smoother casts. Something to check off as you troubleshoot.

It's a Mod-Fast swim bait rod...

[Tim Kelly]

Wow. Sounds like hard work to me. I like the take, then to see the fish, the fight is just anxiety inducing and I want it over and done with before the hook falls out! 

[new2BC4bass]

6 minutes ago, Tim Kelly said:

Wow. Sounds like hard work to me. I like the take, then to see the fish, the fight is just anxiety inducing and I want it over and done with before the hook falls out! 

My fishing buddy when I visit Florida says salt water fishing is too much like work.  He will stick with bass. 

[JustJames]

I understand that you want your setup or your prefer gears to work the way you want it, but sometime you need to compromise.

Your gear now should work fine for any of small-medium size saltwater fish, but as Tom mentioned to use 0.01 diameter line and to hard cast might not suitable and create more of cumbersome than usual.

 

I don’t wanna say this becuz it would get back to myself. (My story was I’m using baitcaster to cast 1/32-1/16oz jig head with 1.5-2” plastic for crappies and all others told me the baitcaster not gonna work and to use spinning or spincast instead, of course I prefer my baitcaster and  still using it but in the meantime I’m using spinning outfit too). I do believe in your need of plenty of line and bomb casting, spinning outfit would be the way to go.

[WRB]

The Shiimano 400 Conquest A holds 260 yards of 14 lb (.014D?) line. If the OP changes his 30 lb (.010D) braid to 40 lb (.013D) WindTamer braid the reel should hold close to 290 yards of line. If he hooks fish that run 150 yards there is still over 125 yards of line!

Tom

[roadwarrior]

47 minutes ago, WRB said:

The Shiimano 400 Conquest A holds 260 yards of 14 lb (.014D?) line. If the OP changes his 30 lb (.010D) braid to 40 lb (.013D) WindTamer braid the reel should hold close to 290 yards of line. If he hooks fish that run 150 yards there is still over 125 yards of line!

Tom

Maybe we should move this to "Other Species". Even if you hook-up the World Record

largemouth bass on 2lb test line, she's not going to run 150 yards.

 

[Reverendo]

Chapter 2: Update

Well I heeded the advice of several on here and removed the 30# Samurai.  I had some 50# J-Braid laying around, so I spooled the reel up half way just for kicks and giggles.  This morning I headed out to a nearby canal to test this theory.  I played with both the spool control and brakes, with heavy thumb and without, and still could not see any difference.  The longest cast was about 42 yards, with 38-39 being the average.  

 

Right now the spool tension is set a few clicks (2-3) looser than the recommended starting point, and I have 3 of the 8 brakes on.  I did try going up all the way with the brakes, as well as taking them all off.  The only noticeable difference was shorter casts when using maximum brakes.  Right now, I think this rules out the problem being thin line, no?  

 

The other option I see is to change the lure.  Maybe 1.5 oz mullet is catching too much wind and creating too much drag?  This afternoon I'll get back out there and try a standard 1.5 oz. bucktail jig.  

 

A last option would be to learn to cast. lol.  But really, maybe I need to remove all brakes and just practice training my thumb...

[Reverendo]

Let me say that I do appreciate all of you that took the time to give me your opinions and suggestions.  I would not have considered some of these options without your feedback.  So thank you.  

 

I think I found the culprit.  It seems that the 1.5 oz. Live Target Mullet is the suspect.  If you've been following this thread then you know I was only able to cast this lure about 38-39 yards, and when I really put some zing into the cast, I'd get an overrun about half way.  

 

Well I swapped out my 30# braid for 50# braid and opted to just fill the spool up half way.  Then I swapped out the Mullet for a regular 1.75 oz. bucktail jig.  First cast 45 yards!  After taking off one brake and loosing the spool control knob 2 clicks, pow, 48-49 yards.  This is a 10 yard jump over the LT mullet.  It seems like a noobie mistake, but that lure apparently creates quite a bit of drag and slows down significantly once it reaches its apex.  Right now I have 2 of 8 brakes on, and the spool is set several clicks lighter than the recommended setting. 

 

To further test this finding, I will re-spool with 40# braid and tie on a simple 3 oz. bank sinker.  Let's see what it'll do then.