real estate- Is this ethical?????

[jbmaine]

Hi all,

 My wife and I are in the market for a house. We recently found one that looked good, and went to see it. I saw some things that looked suspect, but as the market is hot right now, we put a bid in, subject to a through home inspection. 

 Our bid was accepted and a home inspection followed. Unfortunately the inspection uncovered numerous major issues and we opted out of the contract. No harm, no foul on our end, however a couple of days later we saw this house was back on the market, same price, no mention of any of the issues we found. 

 I Know the listing agent and our agent know of these issues,( they were part of the discussion when we opted out).

  So is this ethical?  I hope we don't find a house with issues that no one told us about.

                                                                                 Jim

                                                                                                                             

[12poundbass]

That’s why you pay to have an inspection done. When finding an inspector you really need to do your homework to make sure they know what they’re doing. We just went through the selling and buying last year. We learned that an inspector can’t be held liable for anything missed, so make sure you get one with a good reputation and make sure you are there while they are doing the inspection. 

[jbmaine]

2 minutes ago, 12poundbass said:

That’s why you pay to have an inspection done. When finding an inspector you really need to do your homework to make sure they know what they’re doing. We just went through the selling and buying last year. We learned that an inspector can’t be held liable for anything missed, so make sure you get one with a good reputation and make sure you are there while they are doing the inspection. 

Thanks, we hired inspectors with a good rep. But my question is, once issues are found, doesn't the realtor have a reasonability to mention these when selling a house?

[MN Fisher]

5 minutes ago, jbmaine said:

Thanks, we hired inspectors with a good rep. But my question is, once issues are found, doesn't the realtor have a reasonability to mention these when selling a house?

You'd think so - but some agents really couldn't give a rip. Now in some states, the seller has to fix all items marked in the inspection before the sale can go through - it's like that here in MN. Check with your state regs to see if that's true there. If it isn't - it might not be ethical for the agent to sell...but it's legal.

 

Another way the realtor can get out of it is if they sell it 'As Is'...then the buyer is responsible for the maintenance costs.

 

<- Dad was a home inspector before he retired...I've heard the horror stories.

[Tennessee Boy]

26 minutes ago, jbmaine said:

Thanks, we hired inspectors with a good rep. But my question is, once issues are found, doesn't the realtor have a reasonability to mention these when selling a house?

Last time I sold a house 13 years ago, you had to fill out a disclosure form that even had questions about bad neighbors.  You didn’t have to disclose the stuff in the real estate listing just before the deal closed.  I’m sure the law is different in every state.

[greentrout]

states are different ... buyer beware more so in some than others ... can get tricky ... professional legal advice may be needed ...

[A-Jay]

@jbmaine  Glad to hear you got out in time.

 

 I have used them a few times - never been a fan. 

Sorry, they've all earned my disdain.

What Is an Agent?

An agent, in legal terminology, is a person who has been legally empowered to act on behalf of another person or an entity. An agent may be employed to represent a client in negotiations and other dealings with third parties. The agent may be given decision-making authority.

Many people use special agents from time to time; a real estate agent, an insurance agent, and a travel agent are all special agents in legal terms.

 

Now the real question - how many times have we been hosed by 'agents' ?

 But I'm not bitter.

A-Jay

[Way2slow]

The last time I sold a house was in Texas in 1996.  When I sold that one, I had to fill out a form that had a whole lot of questions about the integrity of the hose and what repairs had be done, such as termite damage or rot repaired.  If you lied about anything on that form, and the new owner found out you could be held liable for any repairs or items cover up and not repaired that you lied about.

 

Now, as for ethical, when it comes to that all mighty dollar, most will throw ethics out the window to squeeze every dollar they can out of a sale.  Then hope enough time goes by that they can say it must have happened after it was sold.  That's the same with most anything, cars, boats, houses, you name it.  Me personally don't even like selling things because I always afraid there might be some hidden problem I knew nothing about that shows up with the new owner and feel responsible for it.  I once sold a car to a neighbor, and a few weeks later the torque converter seal started leaking.  He was a young airman and just as poor as me, but I pulled the transmission, resealed and freshened it up and put it back in, for him, at no cost to him.   I'm a firm believer in karma. 

[slonezp]

2 hours ago, A-Jay said:

@jbmaine  Glad to hear you got out in time.

 

 I have used them a few times - never been a fan. 

Sorry, they've all earned my disdain.

What Is an Agent?

An agent, in legal terminology, is a person who has been legally empowered to act on behalf of another person or an entity. An agent may be employed to represent a client in negotiations and other dealings with third parties. The agent may be given decision-making authority.

Many people use special agents from time to time; a real estate agent, an insurance agent, and a travel agent are all special agents in legal terms.

 

Now the real question - how many times have we been hosed by 'agents' ?

 But I'm not bitter.

A-Jay

 

[NHBull]

In NH, the seller MUST list the issues on the listing document.

Unless paying cash, most banks that resell the loans require an inspection by one of their "approved" inspectors.....

 

 

[flyfisher]

I don't see it an unethical myself.  If it was then nobody would need home inspectors.  I had a friend just a few weeks ago go look at a house and their agent said the owners weren't accepting any offers contingent on home inspections because they just got one done prior to listing and fixed al the problems.  They gave them a copy of the inspection and there were a lot of issues of water damage, mold etc...that were allegedly repaired.  To me that is shady....why would any homeowner not allow an inspection?  it doesn't cost them anything other than not being home for a few hours.  Unless of course they are worried about something being found.

A house is a huge purchase and should not be taken lightly so a home inspection is a normal thing and I wouldn't' expect anything to be disclosed to me as problems in the house.  

[BigAngus752]

5 hours ago, jbmaine said:

Thanks, we hired inspectors with a good rep. But my question is, once issues are found, doesn't the realtor have a reasonability to mention these when selling a house?

In Illinois if you don't bring your own realtor and just call the realtor on the sign then at closing you have to sign a document swearing that you understand that the realtor is working on the behalf of the SELLER and NOT YOU.  That's their license to "not tell you" stuff.  You have to find it for yourself.  

 

Always hire a reputable home inspector and if the property is not on city water and/or sewer then you need to hire separate inspectors for the well and the septic system!  It amazes me that people don't have wells and septic systems inspected.  It costs $10,000 for a new deep well or aeration system.  

[jbmaine]

7 hours ago, BigAngus752 said:

if the property is not on city water and/or sewer then you need to hire separate inspectors for the well and the septic system!  It amazes me that people don't have wells and septic systems inspected.  It costs $10,000 for a new deep well or aeration system

We hired separate inspectors for everything and it's a good thing we did. Leach field, roof , foundation, all had problems.

[12poundbass]

10 hours ago, BigAngus752 said:

In Illinois if you don't bring your own realtor and just call the realtor on the sign then at closing you have to sign a document swearing that you understand that the realtor is working on the behalf of the SELLER and NOT YOU.  That's their license to "not tell you" stuff.  You have to find it for yourself.  

 

Always hire a reputable home inspector and if the property is not on city water and/or sewer then you need to hire separate inspectors for the well and the septic system!  It amazes me that people don't have wells and septic systems inspected.  It costs $10,000 for a new deep well or aeration system.  

Here in Michigan it’s required that you get a well and septic inspection which I think is a no brainer. 

[jimmyjoe]

17 hours ago, jbmaine said:

So is this ethical?

   No.

Is it moral?

   No.

Is it common?

   Very.

 

jj

[NYWayfarer]

Similar situation for me. My home inspector is a friend’s dad. He found mold and termites in a house we put a bid on. Very treatable problems but we backed out. 

 

It was then I decided to purchase a newly built home. My home inspector help make us aware of some issues. We had them fixed before we moved in. Even new homes need inspections.

 

That house with the termites and mold was back on the market with no mention of the problems. 

[BigAngus752]

8 hours ago, jbmaine said:

We hired separate inspectors for everything and it's a good thing we did. Leach field, roof , foundation, all had problems.

Good call!

[deaknh03]

When a house has issues, they're not mentioned on the listing, but often in the disclosure agreement. 

[CrankFate]

I did that the first time I was buying, even after putting money down. Got out of it and got the money back. They never even took the listing down, let alone mention any problem. Wound up sitting out the whole bubble that started right after that and waited until the crash, when the new super strict, post bubble underwriting criteria went into effect, driving prices to record lows.

 

So don’t sweat it. You’re going to be better off.

[gnappi]

Lesson learned... your signature on a contract is VERY important, and you and for the most part the seller is bound by the conditions in it.

 

That said, I don't think there's a state that doesn't allow you to pencil in any additional "get me outta here" clauses.

 

I once put a bid on a 25 +/- acre tract in a rural community and I specified that a survey must bear out the "claims" of where the owner and Realtor "claimed" the property was. Guess what? The property was 1/2 where it was said to be (a nicely wooded tract) the other half looked like the surface of the moon, HUGE craters where thieves had dug out fill for some other properties. Imagine 12-15 acres of fill and replanting remediation needed?

 

Escape clause triggered.

 

Another property I put a bid on I specified a home inspection, and even before seeing it the inspector told me...

 

"It has new floors, walls, external siding, nice exotic fruit trees etc." 

 

Yup the house was breaking apart and sinking in muck  (Muck is half-decomposed organic matter and is often sold as potting-soil or top-soil).  They never pulled out the muck and filled it in. They just built on top of the muck.

 

Escape clause triggered :-)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Harold Scoggins]

On ‎6‎/‎1‎/‎2019 at 3:57 PM, jbmaine said:

Hi all,

 My wife and I are in the market for a house. We recently found one that looked good, and went to see it. I saw some things that looked suspect, but as the market is hot right now, we put a bid in, subject to a through home inspection. 

, Our bid was accepted and a home inspection followed. Unfortunately the inspection uncovered numerous major issues and we opted out of the contract. No harm, no foul on our end, however a couple of days later we saw this house was back on the market, same price, no mention of any of the issues we found. 

 I Know the listing agent and our agent know of these issues,( they were part of the discussion when we opted out).

  So is this ethical?  I hope we don't find a house with issues that no one told us about.

                                                                                 Jim

                                                                                                                             

If you only knew. When I retired from the Army, I thought I'd get into Real Estate. Went through the course, took the state test, got my license, and then went to work for a big name company. Within a week I quit and got my teaching certificate and taught Math until my second retirement. There are some things I will not jeopardize, and my honor is one of them.

[Sam]

No ethics in real estate.

 

It is, Caveat Emptor: buyer beware.

[deaknh03]

23 hours ago, Sam said:

No ethics in real estate.

 

It is, Caveat Emptor: buyer beware.

kind of a broad stroke to brush. Are insurance agents all scumbags too?