The Rod & Reel BALANCE Thread

[WRangler506]

3 minutes ago, J Francho said:

No one in this thread told anyone to quit fishing. The OP demonstrated a fact, and formed an opinion about it.  The very nature of how these forums work is stating agreement or dissent in reply.  If you don't want to hear an opposing opinion, or can't handle a reasonable discussion, then it is you that should move on.

Uh no, I was commenting to a particular person, who told someone else not me, to give up fishing and go fly a remote control airplane. And that no they probably couldnt handle that. Thats pretty lame to say to someone on a fishing forum that shares the same interests.

 

Go ahead tell me to move on, whatever. I was defending someone else not myself, for someone insulting them. Nice coment though. I offered some data and opinions to others, that was it.

[fishballer06]

Can we all be friends again? Or do I need to get more popcorn?

 

[A-Jay]

4 minutes ago, fishballer06 said:

Can we all be friends again? Or do I need to get more popcorn?

 

 

A-Jay

[NittyGrittyBoy]

Balance is a big deal to some, to others it ain't. Opinions formed, feelings hurt, apologies made. Get on with it, throwing shade ain't gonna help.

 

 

 

In before it's locked ?

[J Francho]

Again, if you post an opinion, and can't handle someone not agreeing, don't post.  Several in this thread have gotten chippy instead of trying to learn more.

 

@fissure_man that's a great post, and something I was thinking about as to why it's not all about "balance."  The device that Dahlberg used measured tip weight.  He felt a lighter tip helped him fish longer.  He was dealing with pretty heavy tackle, though.

 

[WRangler506]

3 minutes ago, J Francho said:

Again, if you post an opinion, and can't handle someone not agreeing, don't post.  Several in this thread have gotten chippy instead of trying to learn more.

 

@fissure_man that's a great post, and something I was thinking about as to why it's not all about "balance."  The device that Dahlberg used measured tip weight.  He felt a lighter tip helped him fish longer.  He was dealing with pretty heavy tackle, though.

 

Since you replied quoting me above, I assume you are referring to me. Nobody said anything bad to me, nor did I. I was simply referring to someone else that was throwing insults to another person on here, about the find a new hobby comments...and to clarify IT WAS NOT a comment from A-Jay...

As for the opposing opinons, Im all for it. Thats what Im here for is to hear all opinions. Thats not what the issue was.

[J Francho]

It was a general warning.  This is your third post justifying your comments.  We've all had enough.  I'd like to return to the topic.  fissure_man posted an interesting point.  Stay on topic.

[WRangler506]

Just now, J Francho said:

It was a general warning.  This is your third post justifying your comments.  We've all had enough.  I'd like to return to the topic.  fissure_man posted an interesting point.  Stay on topic.

Point taken. I wont ever defend anyone else here from insults here again. Thanks

[Jrob78]

59 minutes ago, fissure_man said:

Agreed - "Both options result in an increase to overall setup weight, Option B in particular. "  Kinda outside my point, though.

 

 

@Jrob78 and @BaitFinesse: While balance point is obviously not unrelated to tip heaviness, I stand by my previous post that demonstrates that it’s not always reliable for comparing the tip-heaviness of setups, and I’d challenge the belief that heavy reels cure tip-heavy rods (depending on one’s grip, of course). It’s difficult to come up with a more straightforward or relevant example than I’ve given above, but here’s another

I appreciate you taking the time to provide a real world example and I agree that balance point isn't the tell all when comparing rods of different lengths, with different components, some of which are on both sides of that balance point. All of those things play a role in how a set up will balance, as will grip position. 

 

I'm simply saying, as @BaitFinesse also stated, anything that moves that balance point closer to the reel seat is going to lessen felt tip heaviness on a given rod. This is especially true when you grip a reel with all fingers in front of the trigger, close to the reel nut, as I do. Adding weight to the butt of the rod is going to be much more effective than adding a heavier reel but it isn't nearly as easy or convenient to accomplish. 

[Joshua van Wyk]

1 hour ago, ResoKP said:

So if someone with a 20k post count and is worshiped like a god around here comes in to tell me that I should quit fishing and take up knitting instead, I should just stay quiet?

 

Not to mention he completely missed the point regarding the topic while coming off condescending and making assumptions that I was looking to reduce weight when in fact I did just the opposite.

 

I tried to be nice in the beginning but seems like you can't have a productive discussion around here when you've got a few people pushing their post counts around and continue derailing the topic.

 

Anyways, still have a ton of respect for A-Jay. I've read lots of his insightful posts in the past so it's all good haha

If A-Jay tells you to start knitting you start knitting.

[soflabasser]

This subject made me curious to see if my fishing rods are ''balanced'' and so I tested them and most are balanced with the exception of some travel rods and saltwater rods I have. Those rods have caught me muskie, smallmouth bass, blue catfish, snook, tarpon, hybrid striper, various species of sharks and other nice fish. Based on my personal experiences I do not need a rod to be 100% balanced but acknowledge the fact that balanced rods might help some people who fatigue easily while holding a fishing rod for more than 1 hour. Maybe the heavy hammer dumbbell curls I do help my fishing game to the point I do not need a light, balanced rod? Point is everyone needs to fish the way they want and they will know if they are fishing ''the correct way'' if they are catching lots of quality fish.

[jbrew73]

I find tip heavy rods more fatiguing when I am working a frog or spook tip down.    My favorite pond fishing frog rod (7’3”)where I worked the frog tip up due to the shoreline was the worst rod ever in my boat where I tend to work the lure tip down. I dropped back to a similar 7’ rod and problem solved.   

With other applications it doesn’t even seem like an issue either way.

 

i guess tip heavy, balance, overall weight, etc are all related but can mean different things to different people.  I think this thread was a good read overall and hope we can stay on track.

 

side note......

11 minutes ago, Joshua van Wyk said:

If A-Jay tells you to start knitting you start knitting

This will probably be my favorite quote of 2019.   Love it!!

[fin]

Zebco 2020 (c.1975) on 5’-6’ M Pistol Grip Ugly Stik

[QUAKEnSHAKE]

22 hours ago, ResoKP said:

Often overlooked, let's see some of your favourite spinning and baitcasting combos and how they balance.

Post up some pictures of their balancing points.

So the topic is posting pics of favorite combos' balance

1 hour ago, J Francho said:

It was a general warning.  This is your third post justifying your comments.  We've all had enough.  I'd like to return to the topic.  fissure_man posted an interesting point.  Stay on topic.

Thanks.

A combo that I use with the lightest overall weight is a Core50MG7 5.5oz with an Okuma Helios 7' M/F rod weighing 3.3oz. The rod still has good power and crisp action and can be bought around $120 or so at times so getting a lightweight rod doesnt mean breaking your bank account. The balance is good even with light reel.

 

[fissure_man]

@Jrob78 – thanks for the reply.  Not meaning to be difficult but I still wouldn't agree with the statement “anything that moves the balance point closer to the reel seat is going to lessen felt tip heaviness on a given rod.” 

As you’ve indicated, the tip heaviness you feel depends on where you’re gripping the rod. Putting a heavier reel on a tip-heavy combo will always move the balance point closer to the reel, regardless of grip, but this only translates into reduced “felt tip heaviness” if you’re gripping ahead of the reel’s center of mass (as it sounds like you may be). Many don’t, and for those whose grip supports the rod at or behind the center of the reel, tip heaviness will be either unchanged or worsened with a heavier reel, respectively. 

Simply put (on paper, anyway): if you’re not gripping ahead of the center of reel, then the reel’s weight is acting on the ‘tip’ side of the fulcrum (or at best, it’s acting directly on the fulcrum).  Only when the fulcrum is ahead of the center of the reel by using a forward grip (or by doing the “finger balance test”) does the reel’s weight begin to offset tip weight. Folks fine-tuning the balance of their setups (and installing heavier-than-necessary reels) based on the finger test, then reverting to centered or rear-biased palming grips are misleading themselves, IMO.  (Does this really matter when it comes to putting fish in the boat?  Of course not.  What works, works)  

It should be said, it's certainly an oversimplification to consider one's grip as a single point around which the rod rotates, as I've done. In reality, your fingers are spread out, some of which may be ahead of the center of the reel, some aligned, and/or some behind (depending on grip style).  Where wrist action is involved, say, twitching a jig with an upward-pointed rod, I can imagine the brunt of the upward force is provided by the foreward-most fingers, "dynamically" moving the fulcrum ahead (lightening the tip).  On a "down-twitch" the opposite could be true. 

[Glaucus]

I've never checked where my combos balance just like I don't check or compare the weights of rods and reels. Only in special cases for specific people could I ever see it mattering. Like who cares if one rod is 3.8oz and the other is 4.2oz. Who cares if one reel is 7.6oz and the other is 7.8oz. Who cares where I have to place my finger to balance a setup. 

[ratherbfishin1]

I’m hesitant to post seeing what is going on with this thread... but here’s my lews tournament pro lfs on a Johnny Morris signature series. It balances out nicely for my liking.

[MN Fisher]

Oh why not - all my rigs balance around the same point. Here's a shot of my Finesse rig.

[Way north bass guy]

Man what a thread! It just took me 15 min to read all of this and it’s some darn good reading ?. My opinion of rod balance is that it doesn’t seem to matter much ( at least for me). Seems like a very slight difference one way or the other isn’t going to make or break whether or not I use a rod, and like someone mentioned earlier, if I’m running tip down while spinnerbaiting etc, or tip way up while working a worm, it changes a lot. Even with the same rod I can be doing different casts/retrieves back to back so it doesn’t matter much to me. Maybe this is just coming from a guy that has a 3lb stone hammer in his hands for most of the work week, makes a fishing rod feel like a feather, no matter what the balance point is ?. 

[The Maestro]

My first "decent" rod was a Bass Pro Extreme spinning rod that could be balanced with a kit sold separately. I bought the kit and added some of the weights to balance it and I have to admit it does feel nice but I've not given any consideration to the balance of any of my setups since then. I don't think it's hampered me or effected my fishing in any way.

[Team9nine]

 

~1990 TD Cochran 6' Topwater rod (4.9 oz)

~1990 TD1Hi reel (9.7 oz)

 

As for thoughts on balance, I've tested all my setups with a large Excel file of weights, measures and ratios to back it all up - ;

 

1. For the way I hold my rods, for me it simply boils down to the better the balance point to length ratio (of just the rod), the better that rod will feel to me and fish regardless of which reel I put on it, that reels weight, or technique used for, and
2. I never add any extra weight (to the rod) to "balance" my outfits, regardless. I'd rather sell or trade a rod off to get something "better" balanced than I would add weight, or just live with it the way it is.

[Heartland]

It puts the reel on the rod and casts the bait.....I never think of it.

[CrankFate]

Custom Kistler Magnesium with Shimano Aldebaran. Weighs about 8.6oz total. Still never been fished ⛄

 

[jbsoonerfan]

I'm noticing a trend in this thread.

[MrSmitty]

Have no idea of total weight, just wanted to show off new Dobyn's 736 CB Glass with Lew's Tournament Pro!