Rod End Repair

[leafman60]

I broke off about 4 inches from the end of a favorite carbon fiber rod and would like to repair it.  I do not want to just re-tip the shorter rod.  I have looked at several old, throwaway rods I've found as a possible donor but the diameters are not correct.  Any suggestions of a source for rod pieces??? 

 

Thanks in advance.

[J Francho]

23 minutes ago, leafman60 said:

I do not want to just re-tip the shorter rod.

That's pretty much your only option.

[MickD]

I assume you  have seen this site:  https://www.rodbuilding.org/library/repair-oquinn.html  

 

Glass is preferred, but not mandatory for a good repair.  Find any graphite, preferably cheap, rod (lower modulus comes with cheap)  at second hand stores or similar possible places, or simply buy a really cheap rod to use for this repair of a rod you want to save.  I have a few old rods that I'm willing to sacrifice if this comes up on one of my favs.

[J Francho]

I've seen that article many times.  No way will the rod ever behave as before the break.

Also:

Quote

I have repaired lots and lots of rods where the cost of the repair was substantially greater than what it would have been to replace the rod with a far better one.

......

Then he learns about this guy that can make the old rod new again - at about twice the price of those he looked at in the shop!

Those two statements should be written in bold face.

[MickD]

You understand CCS objective rod testing?  Measures power and action?  I repaired a "shattered" 8 wt Pac Bay Quickline that I built and had tested as new.  The repair consisted of both an internal spigot and an external sleeve.  The CCS and AA after repair matched what it was when new, and I subjectively evaluated its casting characteristics as being unchanged.  No it's not the same, has to be a little heavier and the characteristics have to have changed with the repair.  But I could not find the difference either with CCS or my evaluation of the repaired rod.

 

So, don't dismiss the repair as being one that will change a great rod into a dog.  It will still be a great rod.  With a lump in it.  I've done other rods where the rod owner said the rods performed the same after repair.

[J Francho]

My understanding of the CCS is it's a tool to compare two different rods.  Is that wrong?

15 minutes ago, MickD said:

No it's not the same, has to be a little heavier and the characteristics have to have changed with the repair.

These are your words, so we agree.  Maybe not to the same extent.

 

15 minutes ago, MickD said:

So, don't dismiss the repair as being one that will change a great rod into a dog.  It will still be a great rod.  With a lump in it.

OK, but what at what point is the rod either irreparable or not? Just curious about this, because I've been told by many builders that it isn't worth the effort or expense to attempt.  Your best recourse is to re-tip and accept the possibly slower action.  Your saying there's other possibilities.  Any guess as to the claims about the expense?

[MickD]

The expense, of course, depends on the builder's rates.  But it really is not that big a deal to repair as the article suggests.  I'm a hobby builder who gets requests from my friends to repair their rods, and I do it gratis.  And they give me waypoints and their latest greatest lure.  One case I did a repair of a fly rod with an internal spigot and external sleeve for a person who found me on line, and I charged him $20.  For him, it made sense even with my caveats that I couldn't guarantee the repair.  

 

it all depends on what your favorite rod is worth to you.  But I maintain, it is not out of the question to repair rods like we are discussing for a price that makes sense to most people.  And, after the repair, if done right, they will fish just fine.  I cannot stand simply putting a tiptop on a broken tip.  It simply is never quite right.  But this repair is not like that.  it yields a rod that fishes just fine.

At what point is the rod repair not practical?  I'm not sure, but between the simple 4 inches from the tip failure to the shattered rods I mentioned, my repairs have been effective worth the effort.  But as stated before, it depends on the cost you have to pay for the repair.  And the value of the rod.  For a fifty buck rod, replace it.  For a $200 rod, the repair most likely makes sense.

[.ghoti.]

I have done this repair twice, on my own rods. One attempt was successful, giving me a functional rod back. The second attempt was not. That rod was never the same, and is now a bare blank I use for thread experiments.

 

The difference between the two was the power of the original blanks. The rod that came out well was a heavy power rod. The failure was a light power finesse stick. Both were broken near the tip. The repair had little noticeable effect on the heavy power rod, but produced a major difference in the action of the finesse stick, rendering it useless to me. 

 

My limited experience seems to tell me there is no one answer to this question. To repair or not needs to be determined on a case by case basis.

[MickD]

I did an RX8 Rainshadow built as a casting rod that was broken about 6-8 inches from the tip and it came out well.  The rod was not a high powered rod, a "med-L" power, fast to X fast action.  I agree that the lighter the power, when broken near the tip, the more the action and sensitivity will be affected by the repair.  Mass is being added at the exact wrong place.  The fly rod I mentioned was broken quite far from the tip, at the bottom of the second section.  It was shattered to the point there were loose pieces.

 

If the rod is an expensive one I submit it is worth a try-not that hard to do.

 

Very good point about this issue.

 

Did you get my message about the line sample you sent me?

 

 

[MickD]

23 hours ago, J Francho said:

My understanding of the CCS is it's a tool to compare two different rods.  Is that wrong?

Yes, but in this case there was one rod tested twice, once before breaking and repair, and once after the repair.  It gives objective data on power and action, numbers, not terms like "med-light."  It would be very valuable for a person who has a favorite rod and is trying to duplicate it, but the exact rod is no longer available.  The favorite  rod could be tested, then a candidate second rod could be taken home from the store, and tested.  If the numbers were not close enough, it could be returned.  Of course the process does not damage the rod or blank. If a rod is found that is close in the numbers, it will be close in the feel, power, and action.  I recently received a new blank and before even testing it I thought it was very close to another premium blank that I like.  When I tested it the numbers were almost identical.  

 

It was originally developed for fly rods, and the info below focuses on fly rods, but it may be used for ANY rod or blank.  Exc possibly for the really heavy salt rods where flexing them to a deflection of 33% of their length doesn't make sense or cannot be done.

 

http://www.common-cents.info/

[J Francho]

1 hour ago, MickD said:

Yes, but in this case there was one rod tested twice, once before breaking and repair, and once after the repair.

Ah, that makes sense.  Thanks for taking the time to explain this.

[Delaware Valley Tackle]

You need to have the origin tip that broke off. You're not going to be successful making a Frankenstein rod. If you have all the parts they can be successfully spliced but the material must be appropriate: low modulus and sanded thin enough to hold yet flex.