"KNOT" passing through guides easily

[Vincent_Diesel]

I've learned 3 basics braid to leader knots. The FG, Uni to Uni and the Alberto knot. FG is definitely the slimmest but quite certain the longest of the three. The Uni to Uni is not the slimmest but shorter than the other two. The Alberto seems to be a compromise between slim and short.

 

Can't quite decide which one I like better but one thing is for certain is that all 3 once in a while gets hung up on my guides causing me to backlash fiercely, especially when using them on the smaller diameter micro guides. My leaders are about 5-6 feet long, considering a shorter leader, am I doing something wrong?

[looking45]

On a spinning outfit, theres no need for the leader to be so long that the knot goes through the guides. I tie the braid to fluoro, then put the knot at the second guide from the tip.  I cut the leader at the reel. Learn how to lob cast, with the knot outside the guides. Once you learn, you won't be sacrificing any distance

[PAbasser927]

I use the slim beauty knot.  10 wraps down and 8 or 9 back.  Never had an issue with it getting caught on guides, even with micro guides using 50lb braid to 15lb leader.  I used the FG knot until I learned the slim beauty due to how long it takes to tie an FG.  The FG may be marginally slimmer, but slim beauty is shorter.  Comparing knot strength, the FG probably tests stronger.  However in actual use, I have NEVER had this knot fail.  The terminal knot has always broken prior to the leader knot, so I have no reason for anything stronger.

 

This video is where I learned to tie it:

 

 

Edited September 19, 2018 by PAbasser927
Edited to add video

[Vincent_Diesel]

52 minutes ago, looking45 said:

On a spinning outfit, theres no need for the leader to be so long that the knot goes through the guides. I tie the braid to fluoro, then put the knot at the second guide from the tip.  I cut the leader at the reel. Learn how to lob cast, with the knot outside the guides. Once you learn, you won't be sacrificing any distance

Thanks but I should have mentioned this is for both my casting setups.

[Choporoz]

I have micro guides on about a third of my rods - 'mini-micro' on one...lol.

I use (alberto 7/7) leaders on all but two rods.  The only time I have trouble with knots and guides is if my tags are cut sloppy.  It takes time and a good cutting edge to cut perfect tags without dinging the knot, but it is worth it.

 

Edit:  On rare occassions, I do still catch a knot on a guide with spinning gear and very fine line, like 12# Gliss w/ 6# YZH leader...not often and usually only in good wind

[Vincent_Diesel]

I wonder if I could tie the FG with much less alternating wraps making it much shorter. Instead of the standard 20 go like 10?

 

I've gotten pretty good at tying this knot that I want to make it work. On one of my baitcasters I am trying straight braid because this issue was annoying me so bad.

[Yumeya]

I use the FG knot and have never had it cause a backlash, its the strongest leader connection except for the 

PR knot.

 

I hate how other knots have two tag ends that catch guides, the FG only has one and its covered by half hitch knots.

Love it....

[tkunk]

What size lines are you using for braid and fluoro? I wonder if a big difference in line diameters between braid and leader matters.

 

I have the same problem as you, but it only happens on my tube (spinning) rod, where I'm using 8 lb braid and 12-20 lb fluoro. The FG knot often gets tangled in the guides, and I've had much better luck with the alberto knot. For every other application, I use 6-8 lb braid to 7 lb fluoro with an FG knot or 40-50 lb braid to 10-15 lb fluoro with an Alberto knot, and I've never had any issues.

[WRB]

With micro guides why use a leader? If you insist on using a leader use standard size guides or nothing under 5mm.

Tom

[Vincent_Diesel]

13 minutes ago, portiabrat said:

What size lines are you using for braid and fluoro? I wonder if a big difference in line diameters between braid and leader matters.

 

I have the same problem as you, but it only happens on my tube (spinning) rod, where I'm using 8 lb braid and 12-20 lb fluoro. The FG knot often gets tangled in the guides, and I've had much better luck with the alberto knot. For every other application, I use 6-8 lb braid to 7 lb fluoro with an FG knot or 40-50 lb braid to 10-15 lb fluoro with an Alberto knot, and I've never had any issues.

My braid is 50lb and leader is 10-12lb.

 

By eye both look similar in diameter, nevertheless I think it's pretty close. What's funny is that I swear the Alberto knot does pass through better when I drop the line from the top of my staircase. That knot is fun to tie.

10 minutes ago, WRB said:

With micro guides why use a leader? If you insist on using a leader use standard size guides or nothing under 5mm.

Tom

Because I was told that fish see braid and get scared ? I suppose I could go straight fluoro which would solve my knot problems, but have tried that and lose too many battles with weeds.

[LionHeart]

I use the FG knot with every setup I own.  I typically only make 8-10 wraps in each direction (many times I don't even count the wraps, I just wrap till it looks about right).

 

I think once you have used a certain amount of wraps, using extra prevents them all from properly clinching, and becomes counter productive.

 

I have a few rods where the guides closest to the tip get as small as just a hair over 4 millimeters (measuring the inner diameter of guide eye), and I do not have problems casting or reeling in the knot through the guides.

 

I do get a slight tick as the knot passes through the guides about 30% percent of the time, but it's really more caused by the changing of the line texture as it passes through and contacts the inner surface of the guide ring.  It has never had any impact on casting or retrieving.

 

Also, for many setups with the previously mentioned guide sizes, I use 50 lb braid and 20 lb mono for a leader, so it's about as big of a line size/knot, as I think most people will use.

 

I think where most people go wrong with the FG, is they don't cinch it down properly before adding the finish knots.  You really need to pull hard.  Just grabbing the leader with one hand and braid with the other won't suffice.

 

I tie the leader end to something heavy, then wrap the braid around a piece of wood, and pull, HARD.  When I tie an FG, I have no doubt about its strength, and am confident that it is the thinnest knot possible.  Hope that helps.

[WRB]

28 minutes ago, Vincent_Diesel said:

My braid is 50lb and leader is 10-12lb.

 

By eye both look similar in diameter, nevertheless I think it's pretty close. What's funny is that I swear the Alberto knot does pass through better when I drop the line from the top of my staircase. That knot is fun to tie.

Because I was told that fish see braid and get scared ? I suppose I could go straight fluoro which would solve my knot problems, but have tried that and lose too many battles with weeds.

Bass strike lures tied directly onto 80 lb braid, they are not line shy fish. Line diameter and stiffness can affect some lures action and can result in fewer strikes. 

2 knots are twice as likely to fail then 1 knot, regardless of the line used.

Most anglers believe bass can't see FC line and in clear water it gives them an advantage, I haven't experienced that being a fact. FC line has poor knot strength compared to equal diameter Nylon mono line and millions of bass have been caught using mono line over the past 70 years, that is a fact.

Whomever told you fish get scared from line doesn't know what they are talking about.

Tom

[jimmyjoe]

  I've got a different outlook on leaders. My leader connections, no matter which line or which leader material, never get inside the tiptop. But they're not for bass, either. They're because there are pike where I fish. If you don't have to worry about pike, then what WRB said is your answer.    jj

[Rzbassin]

If you backlash and have to cut out 50or so yards of line, can you use the double uni knot to connect the line or respool it? I am using the shimano slx dc on 12lb fluorocarbon.

[dodgeguy]

Ditch the leader. Use flouro braid or copolymer by themselves.

[galyonj]

3 hours ago, Rzbassin said:

If you backlash and have to cut out 50or so yards of line, can you use the double uni knot to connect the line or respool it? I am using the shimano slx dc on 12lb fluorocarbon.

It's worked for me in the past, and I did it again today. Fishing with a buddy, he let my Tournament MB get away from him to the point it just had to be cut apart. Double uni and we were back in business.

 

I've started playing with the GT knot for my leaders. I like it okay so far.

[king fisher]

Alberto tied correctly is strong, and almost as slim as an FG.  If it catches in your guides, I would recommend bigger guides or don't use a leader.  Uni to Uni is not as strong or as slim as the Alberto, but has worked for better anglers than me for a long time.  Blood knot is not as strong as Uni to Uni and about the same diameter, but is used successfully by far better anglers than me, including the tactical bass'n guys and many pros.  FG is the strongest and slimmest, with practice can be tied quickly, but in my opinion is only needed, when you use leader over #50 test.  If you feel you need a leader, and want the strongest slimmest knot than use the FG.  As many great fishermen prove every day, you don't need the strongest, slimmest knot to catch trophy fish.    I rarely use a leader, but when I do prefer the Alberto because of the strength, size, and can be tied quickly.    

[FrankN209]

The Albright is a good knot. It's thinner than the uni. 

[Maggiesmaster]

I’ve gone to the Shin knot; looks to me it’s almost the same as the Alberto, but a bit thinner. Only had it come loose one time, when I cut the mono tag too close.

[S Hovanec]

I've switched to this knot.

 

 

[galyonj]

That is the exact video that got me to switch to the GT knot.

[S Hovanec]

I've been happy with it.  Used to tie the uni-uni.  Since switching, I haven't had a single leader break at the knot.

[galyonj]

43 minutes ago, S Hovanec said:

I've been happy with it.  Used to tie the uni-uni.  Since switching, I haven't had a single leader break at the knot.

I had one, with fluoro (of course), but I'm pretty sure it's cause I burned the knot.

 

Way too early for me to tell how good the knot actually is, of course, but I like the size.

[S Hovanec]

26 minutes ago, galyonj said:

I had one, with fluoro (of course), but I'm pretty sure it's cause I burned the knot.

 

Way too early for me to tell how good the knot actually is, of course, but I like the size.

It's on my tube rod, jerkbait rod and all 6 dropshot rods. I plan to have the Erie smallies test it out on my vacation in about a week.