Critique my Topwater Troubles

[Shane Y]

I have only been fishing top water hard for the past couple of years so take what I say with a grain of salt.  But what helps me is to remember to give the fish a little slack by pointing the rod further in that direction, I'll be paying close attention to the line as I'm taking that slack back up. When I can tell that the fish is actually swimming away with my lure I'll set the hook. It might seem like a lot but all of this happens very quickly. Like before the fish realizes that something ain't right. 

[FishDewd]

You do look quite uncomfortable with that baitcaster, which is understandable since you're fairly new to it. If you've always reeled left handed that could be a reason for that discomfort. Personally I learned to reel right handed back in the day on spincast set-ups, but I've gotten to where I now prefer using spinning set-ups reeling left handed. Since I am actually right hand dominant I tend to be much more precise this way working the rod and it feels a lot more comfortable. Less like "rubbing my tummy while patting my head". I learned baitcasters reeling right handed, and I find that I still have not developed the ability to work the lure left handed as well as I'd like. Been hurting me on things like texas rigs and whatnot. So I'm actually going to be switching mt BC reels to left hand reeling over time as soon as I get the budget to allow it. I'll likely start with a Fuego CT and see how that feels, but I really think it'll work better for me. Then I don't have to cast right handed and switch to holding the rod left handed either. Certain advantage in that too.

 

As far as your topwater hook-set... I use a bit of a non-traditional technique. I've had good luck with side sets as opposed to straight up, especially since I am normally working the lure at a slight angle as opposed to straight back at me (like along banks). Hard to explain, but once I see the blow up, I let the fish have it for about a second, I take up most of the slack and then give it a firm sweep to one side or the other depending on positioning. It buttons nice and tight, matter of that I have needed pliers to get the trebles out of all but 1 bass I've hooked on topwaters. The best topwater for me so far as been whopper ploppers at certain times/locations. I've actually caught a few at midday in full sun, which goes to show you that there is no ideal time to use a topwater. Sometimes the bass just want it that way, don't know unless you try. I also tie them on directly, use whatever knot you're confident in and it'll be fine. I used to use leaders but now I just run straight braid. For a WP it allows it to reach plane quicker; I may start rod tip up, then bring it down as it reaches plane. Can react better that way. For a popper straight braid will allow you to walk it and work it a lot easier than running a leader that sinks, like FC or copolymer. Yo could use mono I suppose, but... I don't really like use mono very much. Just my opinion.

 

And yeah your drag... It should be firm enough so that you can get the fish in, but not so firm that the fish gets a lot of leverage and can't pull out line. You can always bump the drag up a hair if need be, which works better then trying to bump it down before it's too late. Work them carefully. If the fish wants line, let it have it. Apply pressure to keep the rod loaded then reel down to recover line when the opportunity arises. I learned this using light tackle for catfishing for cats that were really too big and heavy for my set up. If I had too much drag, either my line or my rod would've broken. So maybe I just understand that naturally from growing up fishing that way.

 

I'm far from an expert, but that's what has worked best for me thus far. Ymmv.

[Chris at Tech]

If part of the discomfort is due to your reel handle being on the wrong side, why try a reel with a handle on the other side?

EDIT: let me ask it another way.  Which is your dominant hand?  I think the general consensus is to have the rod in your dominant hand and crank the reel with the other hand.  Based on you using different hands for spinning and baitcasting, one of them is the "wrong hand"

[Bass Junke]

On 8/16/2018 at 11:55 PM, Derek1 said:

Just curious why did you switch hands. Does that mean that your not holding the rod with your dominant hand. I just switched over to a baitcaster my self but I still hold the rod in the same hand as I did the spinner. That might be part of the problem I think your dominant hand wants to hold the rod to work the bait, set the hook, play the fish. Allot less awkward. Just my 2 sense. 

That is a whole other topic that probably requires its own post

[TotalNoob]

-Update- Almost One Month to the Day

 

I want to give a huge "thank you" to literally everyone who chimed in on this thread with feedback a little while back. Literally everyone. I read every post several times - with the information and feedback provided I've been able to begin to turn around my topwater game. A lot of that feeling of frustration has turned into that incredible feeling of a successful topwater experience. 

 

Real, actual, positive outcomes have come as a direct result of this thread and the feedback within. Again, thank you. 

 

However, I know I still have improving to do and there are still some technical things I'm unsure of that I'm hoping for some additional feedback that leads toward clarification and additional improved results/understanding. 

 

I'm seeking 1) verification of process improvement and 2) next-level feedback. I have a clip with 4 topwater fish, first 3 landed, lost the last one. Just to reiterate, I know that 100% of topwater fish can't be landed - this is about trying to ensure I'm procedurally correct in my actions. 

 

Before watching the vid I've listed a few thoughts below I hope you'll read and consider while watching and offering feedback. 

 

Areas where I think I've made progress:
-The Hookset! Actually getting (or trying to get) a solid hookset that sets everything else up
-When the strike hits, keeping my d**n hands off the reel handles! From the previous vids/comments it was plain as day that I was often literally pulling the lure away from the fish before they even had it
-Per @A-Jay and other's feedback, not "winching" the fish in so much, rather using the ROD to fight the fish and using the REEL to recover the line 
-Speaking of hands... I try to be highly conscious of my retrieve-hand placement post-hookset. I can even see this in some of the new clips - I'm literally screaming in my mind through the adrenaline to myself "TAKE YOUR HAND AWAY FROM THE REEL HANDLE". Thinking through it while it's happening is incredibly helpful but it isn't second nature yet. 

 

Next-Level Questions/Specific Concerns: 
-When I DO set the hook and, in the next moment realize the fish is in fact there, I suddenly feel like I'm walking on broken glass. It feels kind of like "now what, exactly"? 

 

I think some of this uncertainty can be seen in my hands, my movements, and how I'm generally handling the rod/reel during the fight. This may seem like a stupid question but .. How quickly are you supposed to work a topwater fish? I use the term "Topwater Fish" as a qualifier in that I don't think you ever really know how good of a hookset you got (not me anyway) - as opposed to a Trig or jig where you KNOW that single hook has penetrated and they're locked in. 

 

Perhaps not even "how quickly to work" a topwater fish is the question, maybe even more basic as in "how specifically" is the best way to work in a topwater fish? I ask this because during the fight I constantly feel 100% on edge, completely in fear the tension will suddenly disappear and the bass will high-tail it away. There has to be something of a guideline once the hook is set. What do you do? Or, what do you do (or don't do) that makes you feel like you're doing everything you can to successfully land the fish?

 

-In the below clip, only the first fish comes in 100% "clean". By that I mean the front treble was pinned in his mouth, the back treble didn't penetrate the side at all. The other 2 landed fish either didn't have the front treble pinned well or (on the 3rd fish) came in with just the back treble pinned pretty well in her side. That part does kind of bother me a little - I know it's part of the whole topwater business but the bottom line is it's far more satisfying to have a good, clean hookset than to see you basically drug that fish in by her side... feels like I just snagged her and it's a crappy feeling all-around. 
Is there anything you see where I can procedurally improve to get a higher quality hookset? 

 

Any/all feedback much appreciated. The blunter and more to the point is better. 

 

 

[scaleface]

On 8/16/2018 at 12:42 AM, Brew City Bass said:

It's hard to think about setting the hook in the moment as a bass smashes your top water.

I cant keep from it . 

[LionHeart]

Easy fix man.  Set the hook, but use a sweeping motion.  After the fish has the lure, give the rod a good sideways sweep (just enough to put a good bend in your rod). The hook set need not be massive, since you are using treble hooks, but it has to be there.

 

This alone will make all the difference in the world.  

[BrackishBassin]

I find that the most effective ‘hookset’ for me when using baits with trebles is just a hard ‘lean’. I don’t move arms at all, which is why I don’t like to refer to it as a hookset. People think swing for the fences when you use that terminology. What works best for me is just twisting my torso away from the fish while reeling. As soon as I feel them hit it, I reel down and twist at the same time. I very rarely lose fish that way, but it does happen occasionally. 

 

All my treble hooked baits, actually are my moving baits, are fished on a medium fast action rod. 

[TotalNoob]

2 hours ago, LionHeart said:

Easy fix man.  Set the hook, but use a sweeping motion.  After the fish has the lure, give the rod a good sideways sweep (just enough to put a good bend in your rod). The hook set need not be massive, since you are using treble hooks, but it has to be there.

 

This alone will make all the difference in the world.  

Is this in reference to them coming in only side-hooked (fish #3)? Or are you just speaking generally? 

 

I clearly wrote too much, I should have consolidated that. To be clear, my concerns now (one month after my initial post on this) relate to the most recent fish in that clip which I put together. I am getting hooksets now, but I'm trying to determine the best way to 1) bring in the fish post-hookset and 2) why fish are coming in side-hooked only or barely mouth-hooked. I wonder if I'm kind of horsing them in too quickly? I also don't understand why I lost fish #4. I felt like I had him pretty solidly, he came in 95% of the way. 

[TotalNoob]

On 8/17/2018 at 7:34 AM, bagofdonuts said:

Take it easy on fighting a fish with treble baits, play him gently. They'll often hook themselves with the other treble if given the chance.

@bagofdonuts 

This is exactly where I'm at now. If you have a chance would you be able to look at fish #3 in the clip and tell me if you see something in how the fish was played (too fast?, too hard?, too much movement?) that resulted in the side-hook? I'm very open to suggestions - this is not at all how I want to be landing bass on topwater. 

Additionally, is there in difference in how you'd play a topwater Smallmouth vs a topwater Largemouth? I ask because we have both here but primarily Smallmouths.

[the reel ess]

Yep, no hookset. I had that problem when I was new to bass fishing too. I came from a background of crappie and bream fishing so I'd never set a hook. As you're reeling the bait in and you get a bite just wait to feel the weight of the bass on it and then give it a sharp yank. I also don't like braid for topwaters or any trebles. I know others will argue, but mono gives me time the stretch for bass to take a lure before I can yank it away. It also gives some stretch when you get the bass close and it inevitably jumps and tries to shake the bait. But those two things don't appear to be your issue.

[bagofdonuts]

The last one looked better. I don't really care if they get rehooked in the side during the fight. Its a bit harder to do from the shore, but if i see one is barely hooked i'll often give them line in hopes they get another hook in them.