Latest Color Research (Bass Vision)

[Team9nine]

Somewhat surprised no one has jumped on this one yet, but a study published just last month in the journal Current Zoology confirmed some interesting details on bass vision that have been suggested by others over the years. These included the following;

 

• Bass have dichromatic color vision, with green sensitive single cones and red sensitive twin cones, along with a rod cell. This has been compared to seeing the world through a yellow filter, which would give the poorest vision (color discrimination) toward the blue/purple end of the spectrum.
• As far as bass are concerned, chartreuse yellow is indistinguishable from white.
• Also, the behavioral assays indicated that blue is indistinguishable from black.
• Red and green were the most easily identified and distinguished colors.
• They saw little if any difference in outcomes when comparing Florida strain bass to northern strain fish.

 

Obviously, there are no absolutes in terms of making definitive statements on bass vision and what their interpretation in their little brains is. It can be especially difficult when comparing lab analysis to field conditions. One thing you can count on...manufacturers will keep selling and profiting off chartreuse-white and black-blue baits, while bass anglers will keep believing in these color combinations and continue to buy them. However, the accumulating science (going back to 1937) is beginning to suggest perhaps we've all been 'fooled.'

[Sam]

Outstanding!

 

Great information.

 

Hopefully the research will continue into the future.

 

Thanks for sharing.

[frosty]

That’s it, all my baits are either red or green! Seriously though, I think on my next order of jigs I’m going to find one red and one green and give them a shot. 

[MIbassyaker]

29 minutes ago, Team9nine said:

Somewhat surprised no one has jumped on this one yet, but a study published just last month in the journal Current Zoology confirmed some interesting details on bass vision that have been suggested by others over the years. These included the following;

 

• Bass have dichromatic color vision, with green sensitive single cones and red sensitive twin cones, along with a rod cell. This has been compared to seeing the world through a yellow filter, which would give the poorest vision (color discrimination) toward the blue/purple end of the spectrum.
• As far as bass are concerned, chartreuse yellow is indistinguishable from white.
• Also, the behavioral assays indicated that blue is indistinguishable from black.
• Red and green were the most easily identified and distinguished colors.
• They saw little if any difference in outcomes when comparing Florida strain bass to northern strain fish.

 

Obviously, there are no absolutes in terms of making definitive statements on bass vision and what their interpretation in their little brains is. It can be especially difficult when comparing lab analysis to field conditions. One thing you can count on...manufacturers will keep selling and profiting off chartreuse-white and black-blue baits, while bass anglers will keep believing in these color combinations and continue to buy them. However, the accumulating science (going back to 1937) is beginning to suggest perhaps we've all been 'fooled.'

Excellent! I'm going to have to look this up -- is the indiscriminability of chartreuse and white also verified from behavioral testing in this study?   There are mechanistic reasons why this would be the case when you have a red+green form of dichromacy, but it's one thing to say, "here's what should happen based on physiology", and another thing to actually show how this translates into behavior.

[Team9nine]

1 minute ago, MIbassyaker said:

Excellent! I'm going to have to look this up -- is the indiscriminability of chartreuse and white also verified from behavioral testing in this study?   There are mechanistic reasons why this would be the case when you have a red+green form of dichromacy, but it's one thing to say, "here's what should happen based on physiology", and another thing to actually show how this translates into behavior.

 

 

Excerpted from the paper:

Quote

This study had 2 goals. The first was to characterize the bass visual system and determine whether it differed among populations/subspecies. Specifically, we sought to (1) characterize the number of photoreceptors in the bass visual system and their spectral sensitivities and (2) determine whether the photoreceptor sensitivities varied between 2 subspecies of bass: Micropterus salmoides salmoides (from IL) and Micropterus salmoides floridanus (from FL). To do this, we collected bass from Florida and Illinois and performed microspectrophotometry (MSP) where we measured the spectral sensitivities of cones and rods for many individuals from each collection site.

 

The second goal was to determine which colors bass could discriminate and whether this matched the predictions from a simple model that was parameterized using our estimates of bass photoreceptor spectral sensitivities. Visual detection models provide predictions of opponency and brightness for the bass visual system. We used our model to identify target colors that look different to humans, but should appear similar to bass. We also used our model to identify colors that have similar values for opponency, but differ in brightness, to test whether bass use opponency as a visual cue. To test these predictions, we trained bass in the lab to approach and strike a specific target color and then asked whether they could discern their target color from other colors.

 

[Log Catcher]

I don't know about bass color perception. I can say I have never caught a bass on a green pumpkin jig. It usually either black and blue or pb&j colors.

[Cgolf]

Great info. Thanks for posting. 

 

My clear water strategy has been, to try to match the hatch figuring no matter how good or bad their vision is, if The bait is close to the forage fish color they will see the bait as prey. In clear water when it is overcast or wavy I go with water red, and when it is sunny and flat smoke red or purple. This to me covered gills with the sun on them and in the shade. 

 

The Chartruese results surprise me, I wonder if smallies are the same as largemouth. Over the years smallies have really liked chartruese over other colors. 

[WRB]

Always interesting to learn and thank you for the heads up.

Is there a study of the human eye that can tell how we see colors and why a color blind person can't see the same colors?

I realize color blind is a brain interpretion issue in lieu of eye construction

Tom

[Deleted account]

WTS/WTT

 

UV lures, will consider trade for anything green, red (or either chartreuse or white)...☺️

[FryDog62]

I have always heard that fish can see the color red until it gets a couple feet below the surface, then the fish lose their perception of the red and/or it grays out.  Does this latest research address that at all?  

[MIbassyaker]

Speaking of UV....

 

Some chartreuses have  fluorescent properties, which means they reflect UV light in long-shifted, or elongated form, so that the reflected wavelength tips into the visible spectrum. This is what makes fluorescent colors so bright -- they reflect greater intensity of visible light than is coming in from the environment.

 

So while bass may have trouble distinguishing chartreuse from white all else being equal, in some darker or murkier environments,  a chartreuse lure may still have more intensity than a white lure.  

[NorthernBasser]

Jesus, just when I thought I finally had these buggers all figured out!

[Team9nine]

1 hour ago, WRB said:

Always interesting to learn and thank you for the heads up.

Is there a study of the human eye that can tell how we see colors and why a color blind person can't see the same colors?

I realize color blind is a brain interpretion issue in lieu of eye construction

Tom

 

Haven't studied it a ton, but as I understand it, studies suggest it is a combination of the loss of one of the three cone photopigments (faulty cone, either genetically or due to some type of damage...medical condition, injury, etc.), and/or a breakdown in the visual pathway from the cone to the brain. There are three visual pathway subsystems. The three subsystems allow three kinds of discriminations: light from dark, yellow from blue, and red from green. With cone damage, some studies suggest that no other aspect of vision other than color are actually affected. In the bass study, there is a complete loss/absence of the blue cone leaving only red and green and making them dichromatic (people are trichromatic). How a basses brain interprets that relative to a persons brain with color blindness due to a faulty cone, I can't say.

[Montanaro]

Wavelengths don't change due to cones and rods.  Red may be distinguishable but if red light cant reach the lure then it is not red.

 

As for white and chartreuse...white requires all color wavelengths.  Yellow lasts a little longer than red.  How that translates under watee im not sure...probably creates a blending of shades of white/grey.

 

Black and blue creates different shadings of black that stands out well on bottom...

 

So basically red cranks are great shallow and muddy water....

[OkobojiEagle]

Alright smarty pants, explain why Santa Clause and his elves can sneak in and out without anyone seeing them!

[Cgolf]

2 hours ago, WRB said:

Always interesting to learn and thank you for the heads up.

Is there a study of the human eye that can tell how we see colors and why a color blind person can't see the same colors?

I realize color blind is a brain interpretion issue in lieu of eye construction

Tom

It has been interesting talking to some color blind friends. While they can’t see certain colors, they can tell what it is by the shade of the colors they can see. One guy was actually a fairly good painter. 

 

My thoughts with fish is similar, they see shades of color, so a color may work great, just not for the reasons we think. 

[WRB]

25 minutes ago, cgolf said:

It has been interesting talking to some color blind friends. While they can’t see certain colors, they can tell what it is by the shade of the colors they can see. One guy was actually a fairly good painter. 

 

My thoughts with fish is similar, they see shades of color, so a color may work great, just not for the reasons we think. 

Aaron Martens is color blind or limited color blind.

Tom

[MIbassyaker]

I'm trying to think of a way of saying this that makes sense, but one way to think about the blue and chartreuse thing is to understand that, in humans, the perception of "white"  as different from "yellow" depends critically on our ability to see "blue" (or more precisely, to detect short wavelengths of light, which we perceive as blue).  In emitted light, as in a TV or computer monitors, if you add blue to yellow in the same region, you essentially get white light

 

As @Montanaro says above, we see white when the full spectrum of light wavelengths hit the eye. Physiologically, what this means is all three cones are being stimulated to about the same degree -- the three kinds of color detecting cells in your eye register the presence of light, with each one "tuned" to be most sensitive to particular ranges of wavelengths that are relatively short (S), medium (M), or long (L).  "White" occurs when all three ranges are registered at once. By contrast, when there is more S than L or M, you see blue. More M than S or L, and you see green. More L than M or S, and you see red.  All color perception is ultimately based on the distribution of responses you get out of the three cones at once. 

 

Yellow is, essentially, the experience of having your M and L cones stimulated to about the same degree, but both more than the S.  This happens when light hits the eye with a wavelength somewhere in-between the peak sensitivity of the M and L, so you get a moderate response out of both cones.  But color yellow is not just that you get equal response out of these cones, it is also that both responses are greater than the S cone. So what's the difference between the perception of white and yellow at this level?  It is entirely due to what's happening with the short cone -- if the response is a lot lower than M and L, you see yellow. If it is about the same, you see white.

 

So, in other words, the consequences of having no third short-wavelength detector are that (1) you lose the ability to detect any light in that range, and therefore there is no basis for seeing blue as different than black, the absence of color, and (2), you also lose the only cone response that differs in the perception of "white" and "yellow".

 

However, even if bass cannot distinguish blue from black or white from yellow/chartreuse, they certainly can still detect differences in light intensity (and are very good at it), and various shades of blue may be greater intensity than black within part of the bass's detectable range, while yellow or chartreuse may have greater or lesser intensity than a shade of white.

[MIbassyaker]

3 hours ago, WRB said:

I realize color blind is a brain interpretion issue in lieu of eye construction

Tom

2 hours ago, Team9nine said:

 

Haven't studied it a ton, but as I understand it, studies suggest it is a combination of the loss of one of the three cone photopigments (faulty cone, either genetically or due to some type of damage...medical condition, injury, etc.), and/or a breakdown in the visual pathway from the cone to the brain. There are three visual pathway subsystems. The three subsystems allow three kinds of discriminations: light from dark, yellow from blue, and red from green. With cone damage, some studies suggest that no other aspect of vision other than color are actually affected. In the bass study, there is a complete loss/absence of the blue cone leaving only red and green and making them dichromatic (people are trichromatic). How a basses brain interprets that relative to a persons brain with color blindness due to a faulty cone, I can't say.

1 hour ago, cgolf said:

It has been interesting talking to some color blind friends. While they can’t see certain colors, they can tell what it is by the shade of the colors they can see. One guy was actually a fairly good painter. 

 

 

All true -- there are several forms of colorblindness, but some are much more common than others. The most common is inherited red-green colorblindness, in which an individual sees colors, but red and green look the same. 

 

As far as we can tell, most instances of this sort of color deficit are abnormalities in what is known as the opponency stage of processing. When the cone cells in the eye respond to light, those responses are passed to a network of neurons that combine the responses and communicate them to brain. As @Team9nine says, there are three subsystems, each of which combines information from the cones in by calculating a difference signal. The difference signals have the effect of organizing color perception into opposite pairs. The red-green pathway, for instance, contains cells that are excited by the response of the "long" (L) cone and inhibited by the "medium" cone, or vice versa, while both are stimulated equally by the short cone (i.e., an L-M+S signal...probably not as simple as that exact equation, but that's the basic idea). The result is a pathway that provides information about "greenness" vs. "redness" depending on where the calculated balance of the signal lies.  Red-green colorblindness is thought in most cases to be an abnormality in how this signal is either calculated or communicated to the brain. There is also yellow-blue colorblindness, which is much rarer, but probably an analogous disruption in the calculation of the yellow-blue opponency signal in another pathway (i.e. an L+M-S signal).

 

And then there are really rare conditions like Achromatopsia, which is loss of color vision (in severe cases, literally seeing in black and white) due to brain damage in an area of the visual system called V4.

[WRB]

Where I fish color usually is a critical factor in soft plastics, ask any western tournament bass angler. I can't tell you how many times having a specific worm makes all the difference. When I am fishing alone it's hard to tell,but when fishing with a partner and one is catching bass the other isn't and changes to the same worm and color starts catching bass and couldn't before the change, it's obvious.

When Zank, John Zankowski, first came out with cinnamon with blue neon vane the he color won nearly every tournament and Zank kept it a secret for a few years before making them for sale. Neon is a micro powder and the bass evidently can see it in deep water with low light. Cinnamon black vane worms are mediocre color until neon orange belly is added. To me we don't know how basses brain process the colors they see, there is more to it then cones & rods.

Tom

[Deleted account]

Excellent conversation. I've always been interested in the subject, both because of fishing, and because I'm "color blind". It doesn't mean I see in black and white, I can see colors, I just don't see as many shades, and they fade or blend much faster in dimming light than for "normal sighted" folks. I have trouble with red/green. Red looks orange (ish), white looks yellowish, and green looks whitetish, again this is mostly in dim light or at a distance in hazy conditions. If I shine a bright white light at something, then I can see most colors, additionally one eye sees less color and light than the other, I must have gotten a hook through it in a previous life...

[Team9nine]

10 hours ago, MIbassyaker said:

However, even if bass cannot distinguish blue from black or white from yellow/chartreuse, they certainly can still detect differences in light intensity (and are very good at it), and various shades of blue may be greater intensity than black within part of the bass's detectable range, while yellow or chartreuse may have greater or lesser intensity than a shade of white.

 

9 hours ago, MIbassyaker said:

 As far as we can tell, most instances of this sort of color deficit are abnormalities in what is known as the opponency stage of processing. When the cone cells in the eye respond to light, those responses are passed to a network of neurons that combine the responses and communicate them to brain. As @Team9nine says, there are three subsystems, each of which combines information from the cones in by calculating a difference signal. The difference signals have the effect of organizing color perception into opposite pairs.

 

If I'm reading it correctly, they did test for brightness/intensity and opponency. I believe this sums up their findings in that regard. If you haven't tracked down the study yet, shoot me a PM and I can forward in its entirety.

 

Quote

We next asked whether bass use chromatic cues to select trained targets. The critical test here is whether bass trained to red and green could identify their target among a series of achromatic alternates. In these trials, bass were less likely to perform strikes, and bass were generally less likely to approach the pipettes. Despite this, bass trained to red and green were able to accurately select their training target among alternative gray targets. An analysis of the time spent associated with each target indicated that bass trained to red more often selected their training target compared with all gray targets except gray 1 (all targets except gray 1. Similarly, bass trained to green spent more time near their training target compared with all gray targets (P<0.05) with the exception gray 2 and black where the differences were marginal. Interestingly, unlike our prediction, bass did not select grays that were similar in brightness to their training colors during gray trails. Instead, bass trained to red and green selected targets that were brighter than their target color (gray 1 and gray 2).

 

In the bass system, chromatic cues, and particularly red, are easier to identify. Bass trained to red and green had high rates of approaches/strikes at their respective targets, and bass trained to other targets rarely mistakenly approached/struck at red or green. Bass trained to red and green were also able to identify their targets among a panel of achromatic cues. These results indicate that bass can more readily associate meaning to chromatic cues of high opponency. However, bass had difficulty associating meaning to achromatic cues (white, black, and for the bass system, yellow). These results are in keeping with a long literature in the field of visual psychology showing that chromatic cues are easier to learn for many species.

 

[MIbassyaker]

1 hour ago, Team9nine said:

 

 

If I'm reading it correctly, they did test for brightness/intensity and opponency. I believe this sums up their findings in that regard. If you haven't tracked down the study yet, shoot me a PM and I can forward in its entirety.

 

 

yeah, I was able to locate the paper -- they tested for opponency with intensity held constant (or pretty close, at least). I expect when it comes to on-the-water experience seeming to contradict the findings of the study, a major culprit is variations in the intensity of different colors found on lures.  Unlike the study, intensity of colors on your lures is not held constant when you're on the water changing from one to the other. 

[Comfortably Numb]

17 hours ago, reason said:

WTS/WTT

 

UV lures, will consider trade for anything green, red (or either chartreuse or white)...☺️

This belongs in the Flea Market section

[WRB]

The late Bill Murphy (In Pursuit of Giant Bass) was a dental tech who made teeth and familiar with color to the extreme. He mentions in his book  the color white changes more shades of white in various lighting then any other color. Looking at 10 white lures that all look alike each can change drastically under different types of lighting. Bass react to a specific white lure and avoid other white lures. There is more to bass vision then meets our eyes.

Tom