A-rig rod (having difficulty)

[Dirtyeggroll]

I am wondering about what kind of casting distance people are getting throwing A-rigs. Currently, I am using a Cabelas ZX Crankshaft 7'10" Heavy/Fast rated to 2.25 oz (https://www.cabelas.com/product/CABELAS-TOURNAMENT-ZX-CRANKSHAFT-RODS/1933023.uts?slotId=11) with a Curado K spooled up with 50-lb Sufix 832.

 

My current A-rig is a Yum Flashmob Jr. with 2 Z-man Diezel Minnows on CPS springs and 3 on 1/8th ounce heads. Yesterday when I went to toss it around I didn't really feel like I was getting much for casting distance (10-15 yards) and it really felt heavy on the end of the rod. I know its a heavier bait, but I am wondering about your experiences throwing A-rigs?

 

Do I need a rod rated higher? If so, I'd like to keep it under $100 and I was looking at the Dobyns Fury 795SB. I'm trying to determine, if a beefier rod will help, or if throwing A-rigs is just difficult. Thanks.

 

***Update March 12th, 2018***

Resolution: 100% operator error! I was not letting out enough line to hang the A-rig (I was only hanging 6-10”; letting out about 2’ helped tremendously!) and the tension knob was too tight (I was afraid to loosen it fearing a giant backlash with the heavy bait). The rod is quite the A-rig launcher now that I’ve got the technique down.

 

That damned bait monkey really wanted it to be the rod, but you all saved me!

 

[Angry John]

Is the rod loading during the cast?  Might want to weigh your total rig and see if your in the mid range of the rod.  I would thing your at least and ounce to ounce and a half but thats just a guess.  I see my fishing partner throw a lot more than 15 yards so i would say that is short.  I just picked up the rod i plan to use so i have yet to start tossing them myself.  If you watch the arig video's on tactical they seem to be going a lot further than you describe.  Is your cast controls really tight on your real to deal with the heavier weight???  The wind resistance on rigs with blades is also a lot higher.

[Deleted account]

I ain't casting no umbrella, but if I were to ever try, I'd ascertain wether the rod was either not loading or being overwhelmed by the clothes hanger/Calder mobile contraption thingy....

[Dirtyeggroll]

1 hour ago, reason said:

the clothes hanger/Calder mobile contraption thingy....

Not familiar with this?

[bigfruits]

he is describing the salt water lure you are having issues with. 

 

what is the total weight of the bait? if under 2oz, sounds like your rod might be rated higher than it is ideal for.

[Deleted account]

12 minutes ago, Dirtyeggroll said:

Not familiar with this?

https://www.google.com/search?q=calder+mobile&rlz=1C5CHFA_enUS777US777&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi85dHWnuDZAhXEu1MKHfVZCK4QsAQIJg&biw=1429&bih=690#imgrc=_i3n-zHJok2LUM:

[bigfruits]

if you take a picture of the top half your rod held straight out parallel to the ground with the bait tied on, we could prob tell right away if its too heavy for the rod.

 

most heavy rods are rated up to 1 or 1.5 oz but not all rod companies have the same ratings. 2.5oz seems way high though for a heavy....

 

are you not going further than 15 yds because you are afraid to whip it hard because the bait feels heavy? a-rigs prob have more wind resistance than most baits but even with an under powered rod you should be getting more distance than that.

 

if you are new to baitcasters, loosen the tension knob and/or brakes.

[bigturtle]

I throw 5 wire rigs with 1/8 and 3/16 oz heads on a H rod rated to 1.5oz

[Dirtyeggroll]

30 minutes ago, bigfruits said:

if you take a picture of the top half your rod held straight out parallel to the ground with the bait tied on, we could prob tell right away if its too heavy for the rod.

 

most heavy rods are rated up to 1 or 1.5 oz but not all rod companies have the same ratings. 2.5oz seems way high though for a heavy....

 

are you not going further than 15 yds because you are afraid to whip it hard because the bait feels heavy? a-rigs prob have more wind resistance than most baits but even with an under powered rod you should be getting more distance than that.

 

if you are new to baitcasters, loosen the tension knob and/or brakes.

I’ll try to take a video later.

 

Not new to baitcasting and I have played with the tension knob, cast control and centrifugal brakes (I might be a little hesitant to whip it since it seems to heavy).

 

I also have the 7’5” ZX Crankshaft in medium heavy. I might try it on that to test if the bait lighter than the rating for the 7’10 rod. 

 

7’10 rod is rated 5/8-2 1/4 so my understanding is that the ideal weight should be about 1.4 ounces ((5/8+2 1/4)/2)

 

I will also try throwing a 130 plopper to compare.

[bigfruits]

2 minutes ago, bigturtle said:

I throw 5 wire rigs with 1/8 and 3/16 oz heads on a H rod rated to 1.5oz

you think the crank rod he is using is too slow? sounding more like a reel issue. 

 

how does your reel do with 1/2oz or so baits?

[bigturtle]

2 minutes ago, bigfruits said:

you think the crank rod he is using is too slow? sounding more like a reel issue. 

 

how does your reel do with 1/2oz or so baits?

I never used any cabelas rods so I dont know, but 2.1/4oz seems a bit too heavy. My reel is a zillion sv tw, handles baits down to 3/16oz no problem.

[Finnz922]

If you do end up looking at new rods. Look at

IRG7104AB “Bama Rig Special”

This is not another swimbait rod. we needed a rod that would be perfect to throw all variations of the umbrella rig. It will throw a three arm bait with 1/8 heads all the way up to a five arm bait rigged with 1/2 oz heads as far as you want. Its responsive tip allows for smooth hook ups and has plenty of backbone to land multiple fish at once.

Length:7’10″

Lure weight:1-4oz

Line weight:50-70 braid

Power: Med. Heavy

Action: Moderate

[bigfruits]

 

My reel is a zillion sv tw, handles baits down to 3/16oz no problem.

 

sorry, meant to ask OP about reel. maybe if its new and hes only thrown a-rig theres an issue with it he doesnt know about.

[Deleted account]

33 minutes ago, bigfruits said:

are you not going further than 15 yds because you are afraid to whip it hard because the bait feels heavy? a-rigs prob have more wind resistance than most baits but even with an under powered rod you should be getting more distance than that.

This brings up a good point. You can't whip larger baits the way you can smaller ones, its more like a lob. You want to use your lower body, and load the rod lower down. We routinely cast 2 -8 oz lures for salt water fish (but never an umbrella, that's just silliness) so it's second nature.

[Dirtyeggroll]

5 minutes ago, Finnz922 said:

If you do end up looking at new rods. Look at

IRG7104AB “Bama Rig Special”

This is not another swimbait rod. we needed a rod that would be perfect to throw all variations of the umbrella rig. It will throw a three arm bait with 1/8 heads all the way up to a five arm bait rigged with 1/2 oz heads as far as you want. Its responsive tip allows for smooth hook ups and has plenty of backbone to land multiple fish at once.

Length:7’10″

Lure weight:1-4oz

Line weight:50-70 braid

Power: Med. Heavy

Action: Moderate

Thanks for the suggestion. Not necessarily looking for a “dedicated” A-rig rod and that one is a bit out of my price range. Surely there are several rods that are good (necessarily fantastic) at throwing A-rigs.

 

8 minutes ago, bigfruits said:

sorry, meant to ask OP about reel. maybe if its new and hes only thrown a-rig theres an issue with it he doesnt know about.

Could be. I haven’t thrown any thing else with it but the A-rig.

[fishwizzard]

3 hours ago, reason said:

 You want to use your lower body, and load the rod lower down. 

Even just throwing a 2oz swimbait, the difference in comfort between a lob and a normal cast was unbelievable to me.  My upper back would get all knotted up after a few hours before I embraced the lob.  

[Dirtyeggroll]

3 hours ago, reason said:

You want to use your lower body, and load the rod lower down.

 

12 minutes ago, fishwizzard said:

Even just throwing a 2oz swimbait, the difference in comfort between a lob and a normal cast was unbelievable to me.  My upper back would get all knotted up after a few hours before I embraced the lob.  

Tried “the lob” yesterday and it seemed to help but it seemed like the bait just wanted to slam down in front of me, which now that I think about it, is the description of throwing a light bait on a rod that’s too stiff. Despite this, it seemed like the a-rig was putting a lot of bend in the rod when held out parallel. So I am not 100% convinced (and the fact that I don’t want to mess with exchanging this rod or getting another. I definitely want to be 100% certain before I mess with all of that).

[VolFan]

That sounds like a reel set-up problem more so than a rod problem.  You could lob that on an actual broomstick and get more distance. Also- check to make sure your line's not wrapped or looped through a guide or threaded through a guide base (been there on all of those).

[VolFan]

One more - check you line to make sure it's not crossed after that 10-15 yards. If you spool braid as tight as you need to, sometimes it can dig in.

[Ben Miller]

2 minutes ago, Dirtyeggroll said:

You throw 5-wires with 1/8oz heads?

Normally the top two baits are 2.8" Keitech Swing Impact Fat's with 1/8 qz and then the other 3 are the  4.8" with 3/16 oz.  Rides nicely in the water

[Dirtyeggroll]

Just now, VolFan said:

That sounds like a reel set-up problem more so than a rod problem.  You could lob that on an actual broomstick and get more distance. Also- check to make sure your line's not wrapped or looped through a guide or threaded through a guide base (been there on all of those).

Line is not crossed or wrapped in the guides. 

 

It actually feels a lot like trying to toss a 1.5 crankbait with my MH Veritas 2.0. I can throw a 1.5 sidearm with the Veritas but if I try to cast overhead it plops almost right in front of me.

 

I’m not quite talented enough to throw the A-rig sidearm with any power.

 

I am kind of hoping someone else has tried this rod and can confirm I just need practice or that the rod is not suited haha.

 

I won’t get to play with it anymore until tomorrow.

2 minutes ago, Ben Miller said:

Normally the top two baits are 2.8" Keitech Swing Impact Fat's with 1/8 qz and then the other 3 are the  4.8" with 3/16 oz.  Rides nicely in the water

So maybe just a touch heavier than my A-rig setup with 1/8 oz heads.

[VolFan]

From what you've said above, I'd almost guarantee its not the rod. You may  just need to find the right stroke.

[bigfruits]

10 hours ago, Dirtyeggroll said:

 

Tried “the lob” yesterday and it seemed to help but it seemed like the bait just wanted to slam down in front of me, which now that I think about it, is the description of throwing a light bait on a rod that’s too stiff. Despite this, it seemed like the a-rig was putting a lot of bend in the rod when held out parallel. So I am not 100% convinced (and the fact that I don’t want to mess with exchanging this rod or getting another. I definitely want to be 100% certain before I mess with all of that).

 

slamming down in front of you sounds like the rod isnt loading but you saying it feels heavy and bends the rod quite a bit kind of counters that...

 

when you cast the rod is it loading well? the rod should bend as you swing it and kind of help "catapult" the bait at the end of the swing. 

 

i think if you do these things below you will find your answer.

 

1. cast a-rig with your MH crankshaft rod. 

2. put the curado on a lighter rod and cast a 1/2oz spinnerbait. are you getting the distance you expect?

3. cast a 1/2oz spinnerbait on your current a-rig set up. did it go further than the a-rig?

[CroakHunter]

This may or may not help...I have the 7'5 crankshaft rod and Have thrown 10xd's on it. And although the retrieve was less than ideal it handled casting them great. Those rods are over powered and under rated. I'd say give it a try with a catapult/lob cast in your 7'5. Also make sure your reel is dialed in to the best possible specs.

[bigfruits]

couple more things, not sure if theyve been mentioned. 

 

you might be releasing the bait too late in your swing.

 

put some muscle into it. not saying youre weak, just that you might be scared to break the tip.

 

do an exaggerated lob, putting plenty of power into it but dont whip it fast as to break the tip. do a constant acceleration. like casting 4oz of lead from the surf.

 

sorry if this is basic, not trying to insult. i think a lot of bass anglers arent used to casting larger baits and the different type of cast needed to get distance.