Heartbreaking -- Grass Carp Stocking in Briery Creek

[68camaro]

On 12/13/2017 at 10:18 PM, 5-20 said:

Again, I would be shocked if there's any vegetation at all left in Briery Creek Lake in two years.

 I only starting fishing Briery a few weeks ago, launching yak at Landing Road access, but during my first outing there I was surprised there was so little vegetation, I chalked it up to being late November but had no idea of its history and the grass carp issue.

 

I usually fish Swift Creek Res. which is shallow & choked with hydrilla so Briery being deep (relatively for us) with so much standing timber is nice different type of fishery.

 

 

 

[5-20]

The Board of Game and Inland Fisheries is meeting on Wednesday, January 17th at 9:00am at 7870 Villa Park Dr. Suite 400 in Henrico, VA if any of you might be interested in trying to make a difference.

 

[68camaro]

So, here is what I found out about Briery after talking to one of the conservation officers in charge of managing it plus several others:

 

Every year they do a spring electric shock

Spring of 2017 they noticed # of bass is up, most bass in size of 18 - 20", however trophy bass population is down.

Last shock they got one 24" (8-9lbs), and a lot of 18-20" in 4-6lb range...quantity up, trophy sizes down.

 

Trophy sized bass in Briery are down for following reasons:

  1st stocking in 80's and those bass got huge because little competition

  1st stocking started dying out in 2000's

  2nd stocking group was in 90's, again these grew big due to lack of competition

  2nd group started dying off recently

  Subsequent stockings did not get as large and chances are will not grow as big as first two stockings due to increased competition and maturity of lake. As lake ages fish normally are smaller for reasons stated.

 

Grass Carp & Hydrilla

  Hydrilla is invasive vegetation and chokes out spawning areas, natural grasses/weeds and uses lots of nutrients that will normally fuel plankton which is imoprtant to baitfish food chain.

  Fisherman loved hydrilla because they can catch alot of LM fishing its edges, but it comes at big cost to fisheries ecosystem and health.

  There was more bass when they had tons of hydrilla but the fishery was less healthy and was not sustainable.

  Grass carp were introduced 10 years ago to control the hydrilla which was choking out natural grass and weeds.

  The grass carp have done their job and the conservation folks are concerned about lack of vegetation.

  The grass carp are starting to die out.

  1/3 of 1st stocking of grass carp are dead and rest are aging so not as threatening as younger carp.

 

Helping Briery

  With hydrilla under control they have noticed an increase in natural pond grasses and weeds.

  They also have a plan to reintroduce natural grasses shortly.

  The lake is stocked with 250,000 1" - 4" bluegill each year and they have reported increases in natural bluegill which is very positive for the lake and bass - Looks like I am switching to Blugill patterns from shad:)

  

Bottom line is they are aware of anglers complaining about less trophy fish but they are increasing the numbers of fish in 18-20" range.

 

Of the local lakes:

  Briery has most quality fish

  Sandy River - most trophy size

  Lake Burton - most huge fish but are reportably very difficult to catch  - sounds like a challenge:)

 

 

 

 

  

  

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[flyfisher]

great post and very informative, thank you for posting.

 

[5-20]

68Camaro, thanks for talking with these people.

 

It's just sort of bizarre that these fisheries biologists we have in Virginia are saying hydrilla is bad for the health of water systems. Just sort of unbelievable. 

 

EVERY lake that has hydrilla it ends up producing not only giant bass but also many healthy and fat bass. Fishing isn't "easier" because people fish the grass edge. Fishing becomes BETTER because there's so many bass, thanks to the increased amount of baitfish and feeding opportunities. 

 

Water clarity always improves. There's decreased erosion in the lake because of the grass growth. The entire food chain benefits from hydrilla. 

 

Hydrilla is just a huge canopy with tons of room to swim underneath the canopy. It grows in small clumps and then branches out on top of the water.  

 

Anyone familiar with the last 30 years of bass fishing has seen this played out at so many reservoirs.

 

a. A lake has typical fair to decent bass fishing, maybe even good fishing.

 

b. Hydrilla's found in the lake. For the next 5-10 years bass fishing becomes increasingly better until its possibly off the charts, producing new lake and state record fish.

 

b. People have a problem with hydrilla for whatever reason and either kill it off with grass carp or chemical spraying.

 

c. Bass fishing ends up becoming poor to mediocre for as long as the grass carp is in the lake and there's no vegetation. 

 

Amazing how some fisheries biologists can disregard all of the evidence that comes from tournament results, websites and other readily available information. 

 

Two recent examples include Lake Austin and Lake Chickamauga in Tennessee. Lake Chickamauga was never known as a giant bass fishery until hydrilla was found in the lake several years ago. Now it's an absolutely amazing fishery kicking out many 10-14 pound bass including a NEW STATE RECORD 15.3 pound bass in 2015. The previous state record was set in 1954. More than fifty years ago.

 

This is what the fisheries biologist in Tennessee said:

 

Chickamauga has been producing giant fish in the last several years due in part to TWRA stocking programs and the return of aquatic vegetation.

"Chickamauga Lake is kind of the perfect storm right now," says TWRA Biologist Mike Jolley. "The habitat aquatic vegetation has done well, and you've got a good forage base. It's a rich environment right now and there's no doubt that the current TWRA stocking program levels out some poor year classes," 

 

Link to the article the quote came from: http://www.wrcbtv.com/story/28105648/pending-state-record-bass-caught-on-chickamauga-lake

 

 

 

 

[68camaro]

5-20, you bring up good counter points and clearly well versed on the lake and the subject matter. I guess at this point we can only hope the VDIF knows what they are doing and their plan works out.

 

We'll have to see what happens now that grass carp are dying out and natural vegetation comes back naturally and through human reintroduction, but your overall concern seems correct as it seems the VDIF has accepted more 4-6lb fish at the expense of trophy size numbers.

 

 

 

 

[flyfisher]

50 minutes ago, 5-20 said:

68Camaro, thanks for talking with these people.

 

It's just sort of bizarre that these fisheries biologists we have in Virginia are saying hydrilla is bad for the health of water systems. Just sort of unbelievable. 

 

EVERY lake that has hydrilla it ends up producing not only giant bass but also many healthy and fat bass. Fishing isn't "easier" because people fish the grass edge. Fishing becomes BETTER because there's so many bass, thanks to the increased amount of baitfish and feeding opportunities. 

 

Water clarity always improves. There's decreased erosion in the lake because of the grass growth. The entire food chain benefits from hydrilla. 

 

Hydrilla is just a huge canopy with tons of room to swim underneath the canopy. It grows in small clumps and then branches out on top of the water.  

 

Anyone familiar with the last 30 years of bass fishing has seen this played out at so many reservoirs.

 

a. A lake has typical fair to decent bass fishing, maybe even good fishing.

 

b. Hydrilla's found in the lake. For the next 5-10 years bass fishing becomes increasingly better until its possibly off the charts, producing new lake and state record fish.

 

b. People have a problem with hydrilla for whatever reason and either kill it off with grass carp or chemical spraying.

 

c. Bass fishing ends up becoming poor to mediocre for as long as the grass carp is in the lake and there's no vegetation. 

 

Amazing how some fisheries biologists can disregard all of the evidence that comes from tournament results, websites and other readily available information. 

 

Two recent examples include Lake Austin and Lake Chickamauga in Tennessee. Lake Chickamauga was never known as a giant bass fishery until hydrilla was found in the lake several years ago. Now it's an absolutely amazing fishery kicking out many 10-14 pound bass including a NEW STATE RECORD 15.3 pound bass in 2015. The previous state record was set in 1954. More than fifty years ago.

 

This is what the fisheries biologist in Tennessee said:

 

Chickamauga has been producing giant fish in the last several years due in part to TWRA stocking programs and the return of aquatic vegetation.

"Chickamauga Lake is kind of the perfect storm right now," says TWRA Biologist Mike Jolley. "The habitat aquatic vegetation has done well, and you've got a good forage base. It's a rich environment right now and there's no doubt that the current TWRA stocking program levels out some poor year classes," 

 

Link to the article the quote came from: http://www.wrcbtv.com/story/28105648/pending-state-record-bass-caught-on-chickamauga-lake

 

 

 

 

Are you a fisheries biologist?  I'd also venture a guess that the Fisheries biologist who is responsible for managing the lake knows a lot more than you do about the health of the lake.  Everything you posted is anecdotal "evidence" at best and using tournament results isn't always the most scientific approach to answering a problem.  I also noticed that the article you quoted mentioned aquatic vegetation, not specifically hydrilla.  

[5-20]

27 minutes ago, flyfisher said:

Are you a fisheries biologist?  I'd also venture a guess that the Fisheries biologist who is responsible for managing the lake knows a lot more than you do about the health of the lake.  Everything you posted is anecdotal "evidence" at best and using tournament results isn't always the most scientific approach to answering a problem.  I also noticed that the article you quoted mentioned aquatic vegetation, not specifically hydrilla.  

 

Kinda seems like you skipped over much of what I've written in this entire thread. 

 

The vegetation in chickamauga is definitely hydrilla. A simple internet search turned up this article from 2011. 

 

State and Tennessee Valley Authority officials say non-native aquatic plants, particularly hydrilla, have spread dramatically on Nickajack and Chickamauga lakes. A delay on a new federal permit that would allow the use of herbicides to kill the plants is complicating matters.

 

http://www.timesfreepress.com/news/news/story/2011/may/31/waging-war-water-weeds/50893/

 

And haha, no, fisheries biologists don't know more about me when it comes to hydrilla and bass. It's so simple. Where there's hydrilla, there's many bass of all sizes, from small, happy and fat ones to those absolutely giant sized fish and the entire lake absolutely thrives. Like I said, this has played out exactly in this way on so many lakes, it's beyond being a simple coincidence now. 

 

Hydrilla has never made a lake worse for bass fishing. 

 

Hydrilla is great. Long live hydrilla. 

 

But you know, I'll look forward to seeing some of your trout pictures on this site sometime later on, flyfisher. 

 

Here's a link to an austinbassfishing.com thread that shows "before and after" pictures of the damage the grass carp have done in Lake Austin. These pictures show how much of the reeds the grass carp ate after they ate all of the hydrilla and other grasses in the lake.

 

This is the damage grass carp can do to any lake. This is why Briery Creek has poor vegetation now, because those grass carp can and will eat anything they can get into their mouths.

 

http://www.austinbassfishing.com/forum/conservation-ethics/56522-lake-austin-grass-carp-before-after-photos.html

 

 

[SWVABass]

Sad to hear they are stocking a non-native but hypothetically sterile fish for this problem. Though hydrilla is a non-native invasive as well. Reading the above comments regarding your game and fish officer sounds like they are on track. I think it is important for bass fisherman to remember they are not in the business of managing a lake just for us and our fishing opportunities but for the public and for all game species. So while weights or quality fishing for some has declined the opportunities for the public might have increased.

[flyfisher]

11 hours ago, 5-20 said:

 

Kinda seems like you skipped over much of what I've written in this entire thread. 

 

The vegetation in chickamauga is definitely hydrilla. A simple internet search turned up this article from 2011. 

 

State and Tennessee Valley Authority officials say non-native aquatic plants, particularly hydrilla, have spread dramatically on Nickajack and Chickamauga lakes. A delay on a new federal permit that would allow the use of herbicides to kill the plants is complicating matters.

 

http://www.timesfreepress.com/news/news/story/2011/may/31/waging-war-water-weeds/50893/

 

And haha, no, fisheries biologists don't know more about me when it comes to hydrilla and bass. It's so simple. Where there's hydrilla, there's many bass of all sizes, from small, happy and fat ones to those absolutely giant sized fish and the entire lake absolutely thrives. Like I said, this has played out exactly in this way on so many lakes, it's beyond being a simple coincidence now. 

 

Hydrilla has never made a lake worse for bass fishing. 

 

Hydrilla is great. Long live hydrilla. 

 

But you know, I'll look forward to seeing some of your trout pictures on this site sometime later on, flyfisher. 

 

Here's a link to an austinbassfishing.com thread that shows "before and after" pictures of the damage the grass carp have done in Lake Austin. These pictures show how much of the reeds the grass carp ate after they ate all of the hydrilla and other grasses in the lake.

 

This is the damage grass carp can do to any lake. This is why Briery Creek has poor vegetation now, because those grass carp can and will eat anything they can get into their mouths.

 

http://www.austinbassfishing.com/forum/conservation-ethics/56522-lake-austin-grass-carp-before-after-photos.html

 

 

I did read the entire thread and your commentary which again is based on anecdotal evidence not actual facts.  

I also appreciate your ignorance to fly fishing as well, just goes to your lack of knowledge on subjects you are willing to talk about.  A simple internet search for flyfishing and bass could clear this lack of knowledge up though.

Oh and there are lakes that I fish that the fishing has been harmed but the introduction of Hydrilla and other aquatic vegetation and they stocked some grass carp and miraculously the fishing has improved.  See, anecdotal evidence that goes against what you are preaching as fact.

[TnRiver46]

16 hours ago, 5-20 said:

68Camaro, thanks for talking with these people.

 

It's just sort of bizarre that these fisheries biologists we have in Virginia are saying hydrilla is bad for the health of water systems. Just sort of unbelievable. 

 

EVERY lake that has hydrilla it ends up producing not only giant bass but also many healthy and fat bass. Fishing isn't "easier" because people fish the grass edge. Fishing becomes BETTER because there's so many bass, thanks to the increased amount of baitfish and feeding opportunities. 

 

Water clarity always improves. There's decreased erosion in the lake because of the grass growth. The entire food chain benefits from hydrilla. 

 

Hydrilla is just a huge canopy with tons of room to swim underneath the canopy. It grows in small clumps and then branches out on top of the water.  

 

Anyone familiar with the last 30 years of bass fishing has seen this played out at so many reservoirs.

 

a. A lake has typical fair to decent bass fishing, maybe even good fishing.

 

b. Hydrilla's found in the lake. For the next 5-10 years bass fishing becomes increasingly better until its possibly off the charts, producing new lake and state record fish.

 

b. People have a problem with hydrilla for whatever reason and either kill it off with grass carp or chemical spraying.

 

c. Bass fishing ends up becoming poor to mediocre for as long as the grass carp is in the lake and there's no vegetation. 

 

Amazing how some fisheries biologists can disregard all of the evidence that comes from tournament results, websites and other readily available information. 

 

Two recent examples include Lake Austin and Lake Chickamauga in Tennessee. Lake Chickamauga was never known as a giant bass fishery until hydrilla was found in the lake several years ago. Now it's an absolutely amazing fishery kicking out many 10-14 pound bass including a NEW STATE RECORD 15.3 pound bass in 2015. The previous state record was set in 1954. More than fifty years ago.

 

This is what the fisheries biologist in Tennessee said:

 

Chickamauga has been producing giant fish in the last several years due in part to TWRA stocking programs and the return of aquatic vegetation.

"Chickamauga Lake is kind of the perfect storm right now," says TWRA Biologist Mike Jolley. "The habitat aquatic vegetation has done well, and you've got a good forage base. It's a rich environment right now and there's no doubt that the current TWRA stocking program levels out some poor year classes," 

 

Link to the article the quote came from: http://www.wrcbtv.com/story/28105648/pending-state-record-bass-caught-on-chickamauga-lake

 

 

 

 

And then they issue permits to let private companies kill grass with granular herbicide......... it's a vicious cycle 

[soflabasser]

19 hours ago, flyfisher said:

Are you a fisheries biologist?  I'd also venture a guess that the Fisheries biologist who is responsible for managing the lake knows a lot more than you do about the health of the lake.  Everything you posted is anecdotal "evidence" at best and using tournament results isn't always the most scientific approach to answering a problem.  I also noticed that the article you quoted mentioned aquatic vegetation, not specifically hydrilla.  

Well said @flyfisher. I think most bass fishermen agree with what their state fisheries biologist does to improve the fisheries. Hydrilla is a invasive species and it can grow out of control, I have seen it several times in my home waters. The triploid grass carp in Florida help control the hydrilla, and these carp should help control the hydrilla in other bodies of water where they are stocked in. I much prefer having these sterile carp control the aquatic vegetation than having chemicals sprayed in the water to kill aquatic vegetation.

[5-20]

11 hours ago, flyfisher said:

I did read the entire thread and your commentary which again is based on anecdotal evidence not actual facts.  

I also appreciate your ignorance to fly fishing as well, just goes to your lack of knowledge on subjects you are willing to talk about.  A simple internet search for flyfishing and bass could clear this lack of knowledge up though.

Oh and there are lakes that I fish that the fishing has been harmed but the introduction of Hydrilla and other aquatic vegetation and they stocked some grass carp and miraculously the fishing has improved.  See, anecdotal evidence that goes against what you are preaching as fact.

What anecdotal information? I am the one producing links and other sources of information that show a direct correlation between heavy grass carp stocking and hydrilla eradication and the resulting damage to the bass fishery and body of water. I can produce other reports produced by biologists that say having a presence of hydrilla, around 10-30% is very healthy for the lake. 

 

You’re the one who is saying “lakes that I fish have been harmed by hydrilla...”

 

What lakes are they? 

 

I am pretty sure I said somewhere in this thread that when grass carp are stocked, it may be a necessary evil in some lakes but should be done at the absolute minimum recommended rates. Many biologists still do not seem to understand how much those carp will eat and how to stock lakes incrementally with small numbers of carp to ensure the continued presence of hydrilla. 

 

I’ll produce some other links tomorrow. Not for you, flyfisher because I think you might be someone that doesn’t really have a dog in this fight — it sort of seems like you’ve put forth very little actual effort to try to understand this situation better, other than by arguing with me using rather empty statements — but for the greater bass fishing community of Virginia so we can all continue to understand this issue better and help our biologists understand how to manage hydrilla in the lakes predominantly used by the bass fishing community. 

 

 

 

[flyfisher]

You have posted links with anecdotal information and i did some research myself and found studies that show the opposite.  Correlation also does not equal causation.

If you are this passionate about hydrilla maybe you should make it an actual study for a doctoral dissertation as it sounds like something you are passionate about and all these fisheries biologists are wrong, according to you at least, and this would be your opportunity to prove yourself as the one who is right.  Then this information could be utilized to eradicate the grass carp that you are so against.  

As far as the lakes I am referring to they are the ones on AP hill.

[Logan S]

On 12/14/2017 at 10:07 PM, 5-20 said:

The Board of Game and Inland Fisheries is meeting on Wednesday, January 17th at 9:00am at 7870 Villa Park Dr. Suite 400 in Henrico, VA if any of you might be interested in trying to make a difference.

 

Are YOU going?  I get that you think you're helping but it seems a little misplaced from someone that admittedly hasn't even lived in the state for over 10 years.  

 

If hydrilla appears in a lake it's almost guaranteed that the governing body for the lake is going to attempt to eradicate it - they always do.  If the plan is to eliminate hydrilla and introduce/encourage native grasses I think it's a good idea.  It CAN be a problem to both the lake infrastructure and bass fishing if hydrilla is left to grow unchecked.  

 

I don't know if grass carp are a good idea or not...I generally hate the idea of putting them in anywhere...But normally it's homeowners associations or 'friends of the lake' type groups that push for them for aesthetic/non-fishing reasons and not DNR.  If DNR is proposing it themselves I'd trust their judgement.

[5-20]

Any of you guys ever fish Santee Cooper? Ever hear about the incredible fishing and the devastating decline. 

 

The decline only came after several hundred thousand grass carp were stocked in the lake. 

 

The impact of the carp was felt by the majority of the fish in the lake and not just the bass. Fishing for bass, Stripers, and cats all fell off the charts. 

 

Its been making a bit a bit of a comeback the last couple of years. 

 

Why? Maybe it’s just a coincidence but the grass has started to come back too. 

 

Biologists are just like anyone else. They aren’t infallible. They aren’t perfect. The field is just like every other career sector with people in it that make perplexing, unfounded and sometimes just downright terrible decisions. 

 

The bass fishing community in every state should at least try to stay involved and make a difference if possible. 

 

Being able to fish a beautiful lake or reservoir full of hydrilla with the chance to catch a 30-45 pound bag anytime you go out is once in a lifetime experience and I feel so lucky I had that chance for several years when I had lake Austin in my backyard. I may not live in Virginia right now but that doesn’t necessarily mean I won’t come back some day and I still care very much about the fishing in Virginia. Not many states can produce a 16+ lb fish. If I ever move back, I would hope the potential’s still there for that to happen. 

 

[SWVABass]

I didn’t see anywhere that people are saying not to stay involved in the post. Are aquatic plants good for bass... yes. Is hydrilla the plant for this most biologist and land management and wildlife management organizations will say no. It’s not native. 

 

If you want to help that lake lake get involved. If not a member already join BASS and talk to the conservation director. I joined to help my home lake that has no vegetation. Are we going to introduce hydrilla no, we are looking to help restore native plant species. I can understand your frustration about the carp, but to battle for a non-native invasive is ludicrous.

[5-20]

6 hours ago, Swbass15 said:

I didn’t see anywhere that people are saying not to stay involved in the post. Are aquatic plants good for bass... yes. Is hydrilla the plant for this most biologist and land management and wildlife management organizations will say no. It’s not native. 

 

If you want to help that lake lake get involved. If not a member already join BASS and talk to the conservation director. I joined to help my home lake that has no vegetation. Are we going to introduce hydrilla no, we are looking to help restore native plant species. I can understand your frustration about the carp, but to battle for a non-native invasive is ludicrous.

 

So sad. I really don’t mean to offend you but it almost seems as if you’re just as unaware as a lot of other people about the tremendous benefits of hydrilla. 

 

Take a look at this thread about what hydrilla did for the potomac river. This is coming from a scientist who studied non-native species in the Potomac river for over 30 years. 

 

Do me a favor and read replies #6 and #9, too. 

 

http://scducks.com/forum/showthread.php?8832-Hydrilla-the-Savior

 

You guys... this is supposed to be a bass fishing site... hydrilla has done so many fantastic, absolutely amazing things for so many waterways. 

 

Lake Austin with hydrilla was a pristine and clear lake with 12-14 feet of visibility. 

 

Now, with zero grass in it, it barely has a foot or two of visibility. It’s a muddy mess. People are saying there’s a really funny odor to the water. And, again, the fishing is terrible. 

 

Hydrilla can be managed correctly. 

I’ll post some other threads about how some fisheries biologists are starting to understand and accept the presence of hydrilla and trying to manage it correctly so it has a sustainable presence in whatever body of water it appears in. 

 

You know your last statement is sort of bizarre. You’re not willing to accept that hydrilla is a fantastic resource even if its a non-native plant but you’re willing to stand by idly while biologists introduce a different non-native species that have proven to be an incredibly destructive force, grass carp. 

 

 

 

 

6 hours ago, Swbass15 said:

I didn’t see anywhere that people are saying not to stay involved in the post. Are aquatic plants good for bass... yes. Is hydrilla the plant for this most biologist and land management and wildlife management organizations will say no. It’s not native. 

 

If you want to help that lake lake get involved. If not a member already join BASS and talk to the conservation director. I joined to help my home lake that has no vegetation. Are we going to introduce hydrilla no, we are looking to help restore native plant species. I can understand your frustration about the carp, but to battle for a non-native invasive is ludicrous.

 

So sad. I really don’t mean to offend you but it almost seems as if you’re just as unaware as a lot of other people about the tremendous benefits of hydrilla. 

 

Take a look at this thread about what hydrilla did for the potomac river. This is coming from a scientist who studied non-native species in the Potomac river for over 30 years. 

 

Do me a favor and read replies #6 and #9, too. 

 

http://scducks.com/forum/showthread.php?8832-Hydrilla-the-Savior

 

You guys... this is supposed to be a bass fishing site... hydrilla has done so many fantastic, absolutely amazing things for so many waterways. 

 

Lake Austin with hydrilla was a pristine and clear lake with 12-14 feet of visibility. 

 

Now, with zero grass in it, it barely has a foot or two of visibility. It’s a muddy mess. People are saying there’s a really funny odor to the water. And, again, the fishing is terrible. 

 

Hydrilla can be managed correctly. 

I’ll post some other threads about how some fisheries biologists are starting to understand and accept the presence of hydrilla and trying to manage it correctly so it has a sustainable presence in whatever body of water it appears in. 

 

You know your last statement is sort of bizarre. You’re not willing to accept that hydrilla is a fantastic resource even if its a non-native plant but you’re willing to stand by idly while biologists introduce a different non-native species that have proven to be an incredibly destructive force, grass carp. 

 

 

 

 

[Turtle135]

Full disclosure, I am not a biologist, a fisheries management specialist nor did I stay in a holiday inn express last night. 

 

Typically lakes and reservoirs that have aquatic vegetation carry more pounds of bass per acre that lakes and reservoirs that do not have aquatic vegetation.

 

I believe part of the reason fisheries management types do not like hydrilla is that it can make it difficult for shore bound anglers to fish. The near shore shallow water can get choked out. Shore anglers complain.

 

Hydrilla up here in Maryland is generally a good thing in lakes and reservoirs that have significant open deep water where hydrilla can not grow. The lake can not get completely choked out. We also have the cold water period where the hydrilla gets completely knocked back every season.

 

[SWVABass]

I totally understand that hydrilla is a benifit to bass. What you are failing to recognize that hydrilla is a invasive species. Just as you totally dislike the idea of the grass carp, hydrilla wrecks native plants and changes an ecosystem. 

 

So the question I have is are you a conservationist or just a bass angler? Non natives may have some positive effects, but the damage they do to an ecosystem can rarely be made right again. We should try to keep our waters as native as possible as conservationist. Here where I am we are actively trying to eradicate salt cedar. Why it is a non native outcompetes and takes over an environment. We have lost miles of shoreline that used to have willows to this plant.

 

again I disagree with the stocking of the carp, but I also am a supporter of native fishes and habitat.

https://www.cdfa.ca.gov/plant/ipc/hydrilla/pdfs/why_hydrilla_is_bad.pdf

here is one link showing some negative impacts. On area that stands out is the amount of dissolved oxygen hydrilla uses at night.

https://www.northeastans.org/hydrilla/ecoleconhydrilla.htm

here is another link again showing the negative effects.

 

[5-20]

3 hours ago, Swbass15 said:

I totally understand that hydrilla is a benifit to bass. What you are failing to recognize that hydrilla is a invasive species. Just as you totally dislike the idea of the grass carp, hydrilla wrecks native plants and changes an ecosystem. 

 

So the question I have is are you a conservationist or just a bass angler? Non natives may have some positive effects, but the damage they do to an ecosystem can rarely be made right again. We should try to keep our waters as native as possible as conservationist. Here where I am we are actively trying to eradicate salt cedar. Why it is a non native outcompetes and takes over an environment. We have lost miles of shoreline that used to have willows to this plant.

 

again I disagree with the stocking of the carp, but I also am a supporter of native fishes and habitat.

https://www.cdfa.ca.gov/plant/ipc/hydrilla/pdfs/why_hydrilla_is_bad.pdf

here is one link showing some negative impacts. On area that stands out is the amount of dissolved oxygen hydrilla uses at night.

https://www.northeastans.org/hydrilla/ecoleconhydrilla.htm

here is another link again showing the negative effects.

 

 

I am not failing to recognize anything. Invasive species are introduced into the United States all of the time, both by accident and on purpose. 

 

So, that said, my response to your question is going to appear in the form of another article.

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/relay.nationalgeographic.com/proxy/distribution/public/amp/news/2014/07/140724-invasive-species-conservation-biology-extinction-climate-science

 

I’m not sure any of us can be a pure conservationist in this day and age of climate change. But yes, actually, come think of it... yeah! I am a bass fisherman through and through many times over again!   

 

 

[SWVABass]

All i will say is a can not adopt the stand point that we should embrace non natives based on an article that is an opinion and does not provide research to show a positive effect for native species.

 

hope your lake turns out ok

[68camaro]

The lowland 1700 acre reservoir I mostly fish started noticing a hydrilla problem in 2009, by 2010 it affected 763 acres of the lake. Hydrilla will affect taste and oder of drinking water by messing with waters algae. Since then they created a "Hydrilla Management Team" tasked with managing this problem, their goal is to control hydrilla but maintain 15-20% of aquatic vegetation as a healthy amount for a a reservoir. It seems our county has done a lot of studies and does a monthly hydrilla growth survey so people can compare coverage month over month and year over year, its all pretty interesting.

 

The hydrilla seems to be concentrated on one side and the thought is someone put first plants in there from an aquarium. When you look at the survey maps its amazing how fast the hydrilla grows and takes over a lake, but it's equally amazing how fast carp eradicate the hyrilla, with negative of everything else along with it.

 

Our counties first carp stocking was 10,500, since then they have done smaller releases and plan is to do regular releases but on much smaller level. Carp cost $5 - $15 so it is very expensive and since they don't reproduce you need to restock.

 

One interesting note is we had one cove that was cut off from rest of lake due to bridge repairs, this cutoff nearly all carp from cove except for a few but in two seasons the hydrilla completely covered the 43 acre cove.

 

 

 

 

[5-20]

Swbass15, and the others that are in favor of getting rid of the hydrilla and focusing on the growth of native grasses — I understand and respect your conservationist viewpoint. 

 

However, let me clarify one thing.

 

Once hydrilla gets into a body of water, it’s more likely than not going to be there for a long, long time. It’s very difficult, maybe even impossible to entirely get rid of hydrilla. 

 

Now the problem is, grass carp are not finicky eaters. They eat pretty much every type of vegetation that’s available to them. 

 

Stocking massive amounts of grass carp does nothing positive for the fishery at all. They will eat everything including all of the native grasses and once the lake is barren and the grass carp die off, the hydrilla will grow back again. And during that long period of time — the fishery and body of water will suffer tremendously. 

 

There are biologists that understand this and work towards figuring out how to maintain a healthy balance of grasses, including hydrilla, with a minimal amount of grass carp. 

 

2,800 grass carp in Briery Creek has left the lake without very much vegetation at all. Hoping this has been an important lesson for VDGIF about stocking rates and maintaining a healthy balance of vegetation in lakes that are used mainly by the fishing community without very much pleasure boating traffic. 

 

 

 

[SWVABass]

@5-20 that honestly was your best post yet. I understand your concern with how the grass carp will leave your lake. True it will be hard to eradicate hydrilla. 

 

Thereare native plants that can slow slow hydrilla from being able to regain its foothold one it is knocked backed. That’s what needs to take place after the carp are gone. At least they are not using chemicals, I have seen major fish kills here when water temps didn’t stay high enough.

 

My advice is to get involved maybe not in Virginia but since your in Texas find a way to help lake fork they have there own battle now with giant Salvinia and that will kill your fishery too.