Seibert Morel jigs

[Cgolf]

I have sadly written off gopher tackle for getting anymore mushroom jigs. 

 

So will be getting some Seibert morel jigs and a couple of swim jigs to try for Christmas. 

 

How good are the morel jigs for Ned rigging, even though it has a #1 hook. I know the diehards will struggle with this, but I have been looking and all I can find in Ned style jigs is a #1 hook or bigger. The Zman jigs might have smaller hooks, but have a bad rep and are much costlier than other options. Really getting the feeling that moving forward a #1 hook will be the norm. 

[Siebert Outdoors]

I prefer the size 1 hook for the trd. This is one set up i use for smallies on St Clair.  The hook holds up.

[fishwizzard]

There are some sellers on ebay who sell ned heads with smaller hooks, but of the few I have tried, none are super great.  Gopher seemed to be the perfect balance between strong/brittle, but they are too unreliable these days.  If they go under for good I hope they sell their equipment to someone who will keep making them.  Right now I am back to the Zman heads, the hooks are brittle, but I have yet to break one on a fish, only pulling out snags.  

 

I don't like #1 hooks as I feel that they "roll" more on a super slow retrieve and hang up more.  The ones Seibert uses are strong as heck though, in my informal "bend" tests they take a lot of strength to bend out.  I am going to give the Power Ned a try this coming season and will use the Morels and full size Hula Stickz.  

[IndianaFinesse]

I'm a #4 and sometimes a #2 hook guy, but I can attest to the fact that the owner 5318 hooks that @Siebert Outdoors uses are very sharp, light wire, and plenty strong enough-but they will still bend out enough to sometimes free a snagged lure.

[Cgolf]

35 minutes ago, IndianaFinesse said:

I'm a #4 and sometimes a #2 hook guy, but I can attest to the fact that the owner 5318 hooks that @Siebert Outdoors uses are very sharp, light wire, and plenty strong enough-but they will still bend out enough to sometimes free a snagged lure.

I have been to for most of my ned rigging, but man finding them is getting very tough. I am going to give the Morels a shot and see how they work and of course the swim jigs to see if what everyone has been saying is true.

 

Just wish that there were more commercially available #2 and #4 hooked mushroom head jigs.

[Bluebasser86]

I think you'll like them just fine. I haven't used a #1 size but the #2 I normally use isn't that much smaller and they've worked great. 

[smalljaw67]

16 hours ago, IndianaFinesse said:

I'm a #4 and sometimes a #2 hook guy, but I can attest to the fact that the owner 5318 hooks that @Siebert Outdoors uses are very sharp, light wire, and plenty strong enough-but they will still bend out enough to sometimes free a snagged lure.

The Morel jig from Seibert Outdoors is a 5313 hook, not a 5318, there is a huge difference between the two hooks. The 5313 is a 1X strong and has a large bite with a cutting point while the 5318 is a light wire hook with a normal bite and it has a needle point. As for Gopher tackle, they use a few different types of hooks but there heavy hook models start at 3/32oz and all of their smaller sizes are made with light wire jig hooks. I think Fishwizzard knows what he is talking about but is using the wrong terminology making it difficult to understand. Gopher doesn't use magic or a special hook, they use standard light wire hooks but their head uses a collar with small double barbs, the puts some weight on the hook shank which helps the bait fall straighter is the worm is rigged slightly off center, that is why he experiences "roll" with other heads. As for the hooks being brittle, well not really brittle but flexible, the Aberdeen style hook is meant to have flex so it can be straightened out on a snag, the Z-Man hook is brittle, there are a lot of examples on the internet showing numerous breaks on the hook shank. I believe that happens on the Z-Man heads because of that keeper being welded on the hook, it may be affecting the temper and instead of the hook having some flex it just becomes brittle. The Gopher heads as I said before, use standard hooks in their smaller size jigs, they are Gamakatsu 114s and Mustad 32746/32755, these are the ones that would be the same as the Owner 5318 and they are also the type of hook guys complain about bending out. The light wire hooks are sticky sharp and if your set up is balance you shouldn't bend them out except for hung on a snag but braided light and heavier powered rods have a tendency to get anglers in the habit of using too much force which is why the hooks will bend out. The size #1 I believe is the perfect compromise in hook size, the larger bite will result in fewer lost fish but it is still allows the worm to move more than a larger hook which can help in drawing strikes. The purpose of the rig is to have a subtle action, almost do nothing but if you watch on of these in clear water using a 1/0 hook versus a size #1 or #2, you'll see there is a big difference in how the worm falls and behaves. The 5313 that is used on the Morel Jig is probably the best universal hook you will find, it is strong enough that a heavier rod and line isn't going to bend the hook out so easily, it can be bent but it takes a lot more force than any light wire hook. The other thing is that even though it is a 1/X strong hook, it is still super sharp and the wire is still light enough that it allows more finesse oriented anglers the ability to get positive hook ups with light line, I use 6lb line and have not had an issue with losing fish or hooking them and I can even reel set with a light powered rod. I'm sorry for the long rant but there are a lot of misconceptions with hooks and sometimes just having the power of suggestion is enough for someone to shy away from something that is good just because of someone else's perception without any real world experience.

[Cgolf]

1 hour ago, smalljaw67 said:

The Morel jig from Seibert Outdoors is a 5313 hook, not a 5318, there is a huge difference between the two hooks. The 5313 is a 1X strong and has a large bite with a cutting point while the 5318 is a light wire hook with a normal bite and it has a needle point. As for Gopher tackle, they use a few different types of hooks but there heavy hook models start at 3/32oz and all of their smaller sizes are made with light wire jig hooks. I think Fishwizzard knows what he is talking about but is using the wrong terminology making it difficult to understand. Gopher doesn't use magic or a special hook, they use standard light wire hooks but their head uses a collar with small double barbs, the puts some weight on the hook shank which helps the bait fall straighter is the worm is rigged slightly off center, that is why he experiences "roll" with other heads. As for the hooks being brittle, well not really brittle but flexible, the Aberdeen style hook is meant to have flex so it can be straightened out on a snag, the Z-Man hook is brittle, there are a lot of examples on the internet showing numerous breaks on the hook shank. I believe that happens on the Z-Man heads because of that keeper being welded on the hook, it may be affecting the temper and instead of the hook having some flex it just becomes brittle. The Gopher heads as I said before, use standard hooks in their smaller size jigs, they are Gamakatsu 114s and Mustad 32746/32755, these are the ones that would be the same as the Owner 5318 and they are also the type of hook guys complain about bending out. The light wire hooks are sticky sharp and if your set up is balance you shouldn't bend them out except for hung on a snag but braided light and heavier powered rods have a tendency to get anglers in the habit of using too much force which is why the hooks will bend out. The size #1 I believe is the perfect compromise in hook size, the larger bite will result in fewer lost fish but it is still allows the worm to move more than a larger hook which can help in drawing strikes. The purpose of the rig is to have a subtle action, almost do nothing but if you watch on of these in clear water using a 1/0 hook versus a size #1 or #2, you'll see there is a big difference in how the worm falls and behaves. The 5313 that is used on the Morel Jig is probably the best universal hook you will find, it is strong enough that a heavier rod and line isn't going to bend the hook out so easily, it can be bent but it takes a lot more force than any light wire hook. The other thing is that even though it is a 1/X strong hook, it is still super sharp and the wire is still light enough that it allows more finesse oriented anglers the ability to get positive hook ups with light line, I use 6lb line and have not had an issue with losing fish or hooking them and I can even reel set with a light powered rod. I'm sorry for the long rant but there are a lot of misconceptions with hooks and sometimes just having the power of suggestion is enough for someone to shy away from something that is good just because of someone else's perception without any real world experience.

I never understood the bending out thing, I actually saved a few jigs that hung on rocks because the hook would give a bit. With a jig it doesn't take much to set the hook, but I grew up panfishing and walleye fishing, so a big hookset wasn't something I did. I have only had one hook bend out on me and it was the light wire spider classic head on a monster, for northern WI, bed bass when she shook her head at the surface. Looking forward to trying the Morels and see how they compare to what I have been trowing.

 

For what its worth I cut the double barbed collar off the gopher jigs and glue the plastics to the head, because the barbs are a pain with elaztech and distort a skinnier stick bait I Ned rig.

[IndianaFinesse]

@smalljaw67my bad, I thought he used the 5318 but you are right it's the 5313.  I personally have a slight preference for the lighter 5318 hook though.

[fishwizzard]

4 hours ago, smalljaw67 said:

 I think Fishwizzard knows what he is talking about but is using the wrong terminology making it difficult to understand. Gopher doesn't use magic or a special hook, they use standard light wire hooks but their head uses a collar with small double barbs, the puts some weight on the hook shank which helps the bait fall straighter is the worm is rigged slightly off center, that is why he experiences "roll" with other heads.

Yea, I should have said "Soft/Brittle", but that still doesn't really express what I meant. The Gopher hooks will resist deformation, but will fail by bending.  The Zman hooks, imho, are less resistant to deformation, but fail by snapping.  

 

I never thought about the weight being on the shank helping with roll/fall, but it makes perfect sense when you think about it.  The new Zman heads have a lead keeper on the shank.  I was turned off by the heavier hook, but I might have to give them another look.  A more far-out option might be the Gene Larew Bass Shooter Pinhead jigheads. They have all the weight on the shank and should give a fall/action like a weighted swimbait hook.  I think they might be too big for a proper MWF lure, but I am curious how they would work on larger finesse plastics.