NED head hook failing?

[Comfortably Numb]

Hooked into a nice one with a Ned rig off my dock at Lake Monticello yesterday. One jump and it was gone. When I reeled in, all that I had was the weight and the worm. The hook had snapped off. It appeared to have broken where the barb to hold the worm on had been soldered to the shaft of the hook. The area also looked rusty. Anyone with a similar experience? They were Z-Man brand head and TRD bought from Tackle Warehouse.

[frogflogger]

yep - I learned to not leave the bait on the hook - the salt corrodes away the hook - hopefully zman will do something about this issue.

[Russ E]

I have heard several people having this issue.

I switched over to Arkie brand mushroom heads. Walmart carries them.

The hook is slightly larger and it has a better bait keeper.

My hookup to landing ratio is also much higher with these heads.

[CTGalloway21]

yeah, I also quit using the Z-man stuff.  Big Bite Baits has a nice hook and the Owner Block Heads will be great once released.  Going to use the Roboworm Ned baits now as well.  

[moguy1973]

Get all the salt out of the Zinkerz or TRDs first by stretching them out before you put them on the hook.  I've had one Zman head and half Zinker last me over 100 fish and several trips without it breaking doing this.

 

The problem does lie within how Zman puts the bait keeper on the hook.  In order for them to weld the keeper onto the hook the hook has to be bare.  It seems they don't always powdercoat this weld and that tends to rust first since it is unprotected.  Tape off the bend of the hook and the point and give it a blast of black Krylon and I bet it helps keep them from rusting.

[NYWayfarer]

The only thing that has broken on the Z-man jigheads I have are the baitkeepers. I am constantly pulling on the TRD's to straighten or adjust them on the hook so they sit properly and the little wire keeper snaps off eventually.

 

Like @frogflogger says don't let the TRD sit on the hook as is will corrode. I dry mine or spray them with KVD line and lure conditioner after use.

 

I find the hooks on these jigheads to be stronger than they look. I hop them on the bottom when fishing which always seems to get them hung up. I have pulled up huge branches and straightened the hooks without breaking them when trying to get them unstuck.

[Scarborough817]

i agree with @NYWayfarer i have pulled up branches and haven't broken one off the only time i did was when i accidentally left a trd on the hook for a couple weeks and it snapped when stuck on a branch 

[moguy1973]

2 minutes ago, NYWayfarer said:

The only thing that has broken on the Z-man jigheads I have are the baitkeepers. I am constantly pulling on the TRD's to straighten or adjust them on the hook so they sit properly and the little wire keeper snaps off eventually.

 

 

The first thing I do when I get a new pack of these is break the keeper off with a pair of pliers.  I always superglue my bait to the head anyways so the keeper just gets in the way and fouls the bait.

[IndianaFinesse]

I know i sound like a broken record, but what rod/line/drag setting were you using?  Those hooks just don't fail unless used with to heavy of gear, unless the strength is compromised in some way (rust and simply being thrown into a dock to hard to many times are common issues).  I don't personally use zman heads anymore, I started pouring my own on #4 and #2 owner lite wire hooks to save money and get a better jighead.

[gim]

I was going to ask if what setup you were using too.  Those neds are light wire hooks so sometimes they just break if your drag is set too tight.  I found that out the hard way and a straightened a couple of them on large fish and lost them.

[Big Swimbait]

Since I switched to Mike's, I have never had a problem. That Owner hook is awesome!

 

http://www.siebertoutdoors.com/Morel-Jig-Head-1022.htm

 

[The Bassman]

I use the morel head and it works great except for the keeper. It needs to be sharper.  Can't keep the baits stuck.  My experience with 'shroom heads is that the hooks are very brittle and break even without corrosion.  Still looking for the ideal ned hook. I'm starting to think the whole mushroom thing is unnecessary as I swim rather than jig the bait.

[IndianaFinesse]

1 minute ago, The Bassman said:

I use the morel head and it works great except for the keeper. It needs to be sharper.  Can't keep the baits stuck.  My experience with 'shroom heads is that the hooks are very brittle and break even without corrosion.  Still looking for the ideal ned hook. I'm starting to think the whole mushroom thing is unnecessary as I swim rather than jig the bait.

I have the same mold mike uses to pour the morel with, and I've found that you've got to push pretty hard on the plastic and work at it to get the keeper to bite into the elaztech. I might try sharpening the keepers on my next batch though, I hadn't thought of that before. Try putting a dot of super glue on the keeper, pretty much holds elaztech on indefinitely

[The Bassman]

I used to do the super glue thing with gopher heads with the lead keeper cut off.  Worked OK but I got to where I don't like messing with the glue.  The bait still comes loose after several fish and even though it can be reglued when wet it's a PITA.

[The Bassman]

Makes sense that super glue on a hook with a keeper would hold better than what I just described.  Thanks @IndianaFinesse. Still think there's a better way to ned with another type of jig. Gotta research that.

[fishwizzard]

The best solution I have seen, is tying a small fly fishing hook onto the shank, but obviously that is a little labor-intensive.  

 

The new Z man heads with the lead keeper on the shank hold very well.  Once the plastic has all the salt washed out of it you do have to reset it every couple of cast, but it generally only slips small fraction of an inch away from the head.  

 

I still find a hook to be too big and too thick for the tackle I like to fish them on, so I'm probably going to stick with buying Gooher heads and just gluing my plastics on.  

[Comfortably Numb]

Cadman makes these for me and they work great. 1/8 and #1 Mustad hook. Hook up percentage is really good. They do not hold plastic on the best and you cant use elastec baits with that style keeper. I never tried glue but will. The whole mushroom head deal is BS to me.

So are these new Zmzn heads for elastek? I have no idea how anyone can fish a non weedless/snagless head

[IndianaFinesse]

2 hours ago, fishwizzard said:

The best solution I have seen, is tying a small fly fishing hook onto the shank, but obviously that is a little labor-intensive.  

That sounds like a really good idea, would a #8 or #10 hook be small enough?  I might try modifying my mold to fit a small hook as a keeper along the shank, but I'll try it out on one of the larger cavities that I don't use first, just in case.

[WRB]

19 hours ago, 1201vilbig said:

Since I switched to Mike's, I have never had a problem. That Owner hook is awesome!

 

http://www.siebertoutdoors.com/Morel-Jig-Head-1022.htm

 

Looks like snipping the barb off just past the bend shorting it would improve sliding the soft plastic over it. Good looking jig and excellent hook choice.

you can make a soft plastic keeper by coarse spiral wrap using 20 lb mono and super glueing the half hitches and spiral wrap on the hook shank. Clip off the line ends after the glue dries leaving about 1/16" spike. 

The broken hook the OP posted looks more like a over heated wire then corrosion, the brown spots being flux from silver soldering.

Tom

 

[fishwizzard]

1 hour ago, IndianaFinesse said:

That sounds like a really good idea, would a #8 or #10 hook be small enough?  I might try modifying my mold to fit a small hook as a keeper along the shank, but I'll try it out on one of the larger cavities that I don't use first, just in case.

I don't remember what size the picture I saw used, but I found it while googling "ned rig jigheads" or something like that. 

[Bartucca7]

On October 30, 2017 at 8:03 PM, gimruis said:

I was going to ask if what setup you were using too.  Those neds are light wire hooks so sometimes they just break if your drag is set too tight.  I found that out the hard way and a straightened a couple of them on large fish and lost them.

 

Rod power is medium lite, action is fast with fairly loose drag.  Using a bait caster with 10 pound flourocarbon.  I don't really think the gear or setup was the issue.

On October 30, 2017 at 9:06 AM, moguy1973 said:

Get all the salt out of the Zinkerz or TRDs first by stretching them out before you put them on the hook.  I've had one Zman head and half Zinker last me over 100 fish and several trips without it breaking doing this.

 

The problem does lie within how Zman puts the bait keeper on the hook.  In order for them to weld the keeper onto the hook the hook has to be bare.  It seems they don't always powdercoat this weld and that tends to rust first since it is unprotected.  Tape off the bend of the hook and the point and give it a blast of black Krylon and I bet it helps keep them from rusting.

 

[Bartucca7]

Thanks for the advice.  I will spray a little rustoleum on the keeper weld and make sure I stretch the worms before I put them on the hook.  If all else fails I will change the hook brand.

[NYWayfarer]

23 hours ago, Comfortably Numb said:

So are these new Zmzn heads for elastek? I have no idea how anyone can fish a non weedless/snagless head

I fish them all the time with limited snags from my kayak. 90% of the time I can get them unstuck by simply paddling past the bait and pulling from the opposite direction from where it got stuck.

 

I hop it along the bottom of the river where I fish just past the weedlines and laydowns or deeper water for Smallmouth. Anywhere that has heavy vegetation is not the place you want to use this type of lure anyway.

[WRB]

You can use the old school weedgards; small rubber band stretched over the hook eye and under the hook barb. Dental rubber bands are the right size with lots of colors to choose from.

Tom

[QUAKEnSHAKE]

My weedless shroomz seem catch more weeds than my regular shroomz