To All You "Ned Rig" Users

[wdp]

Just saw that Z Man has come out with a new Shroomz jig head. Looks like it has a little beefier hook and a different type bait keeper than the original Shroomz. I've read some comments in other threads that some people don't like the bait keeper on the original. Any thoughts? Anybody tried em yet?

 

http://www.tacklewarehouse.com/Z_Man_Ned_Lockz_HD_Jig_Heads_5pk/descpage-ZNLHD.html

[Bluebasser86]

Finesse fishing and "a beefier hook" don't really seem to go hand in hand to me. I haven't seen one in person, but that keeper looks like it would be extremely difficult to get a Zman bait to stay up on to me. 

[MickD]

I agree that it looks like it will be almost impossible to get the grub onto that hook.  The barbs look much like those on my favorite darter head jig, and I had real trouble getting a Z man minnow onto it without screwing up the orientation on the jig.

[Jig Man]

You would have to burn a hole in a TRD to get it to even go on that keeper.  I have the Midwest Finesse mold and even the wire keeper is worthless so I filled it in with silicone.

[Tim Kelly]

I find the wire keeper on the midwest mold works fine, you just have to pinch a bit of the TRD and stretch it over the wire to get it over the wire. Once it's in place it holds pretty well.

[wdp]

I've got the same thoughts. I'm not a big fan of "screw on" type bait keepers for regular plastics. Always kinda of a pain to get em just right. Can't imagine how hard it'll be to get the Elaztech material on that thing.

 

The bigger hook I don't mind. I've had the normal Shroomz hooks bend out fighting fish that were only a pound. 

[Team9nine]

Not surprising they came out with this for all the non-"Midwest Finesse" Ned Rig guys who can't ( or don't want to) follow instructions  The keeper probably isn't an issue since most won't be using them with Zman plastics anyway. Kind of inevitable, like the Big TRD was. it's all about the money for Zman ? 

[Cgolf]

24 minutes ago, Team9nine said:

Not surprising they came out with this for all the non-"Midwest Finesse" Ned Rig guys who can't ( or don't want to) follow instructions  The keeper probably isn't an issue since most won't be using them with Zman plastics anyway. Kind of inevitable, like the Big TRD was. it's all about the money for Zman ? 

This is what really bugs me about the Ned rig thing. 

 

Where are these instructions/rules? Most of us really don't care, we just want to catch fish and if a certain style bait works with a specific jighead and retrieve we will use it. 

 

For example if I fish a half Zinkerz on a proper gopher head and use a straight in retrieve polishing the rocks I am Midwest finesse fishing, but use same plastic and retrieve with a slider head I am sliding. 

 

Some would say that the 1/16th ounce fireball jig I sometimes use which has a shorter shank than my mushroom head jigs would disqualify my setup as a Ned rig. 

 

I know now some of you want to preserve Ned's way of fishing and that is awesome. There are many of us out here that will tweak it to our situations and try to catch fish more efficiently in our areas, and that should be fine too. I have said this before that Zman, who now appears to be the company associated with the Ned rig, has really done a bad job keeping the true definition of the Ned rig out there. 

[Team9nine]

53 minutes ago, cgolf said:

This is what really bugs me about the Ned rig thing. 

 

Where are these instructions/rules? Most of us really don't care, we just want to catch fish and if a certain style bait works with a specific jighead and retrieve we will use it. 

 

For example if I fish a half Zinkerz on a proper gopher head and use a straight in retrieve polishing the rocks I am Midwest finesse fishing, but use same plastic and retrieve with a slider head I am sliding. 

 

Some would say that the 1/16th ounce fireball jig I sometimes use which has a shorter shank than my mushroom head jigs would disqualify my setup as a Ned rig. 

 

I know now some of you want to preserve Ned's way of fishing and that is awesome. There are many of us out here that will tweak it to our situations and try to catch fish more efficiently in our areas, and that should be fine too. I have said this before that Zman, who now appears to be the company associated with the Ned rig, has really done a bad job keeping the true definition of the Ned rig out there. 

 

Agree with what you're saying, especially the part about Zman in all this...and the part about most people not caring. I understand that modification and evolution is the nature of the game. Makes some of us sound like curmudgeons. 

 

Look at it from the other side though when we constantly have to listen to/read people complain about their hooks are too small or weak, they're always bending out, it won't work in my weedy pond, The problem is it always gets hung in brush - what about a weedless version, my 3/16 oz head works fine, and I can then throw it on my baitcasters, why can't I just use any jighead, etc., etc., on and on. Gets old listening to gripes from people wanting to modify the system to fit their needs, but who don't seem to have even a rudimentary understanding of the original system, and that all these "problems" were never problems to begin with. They only arose when you tried to do something with the Rig that the system was never intended to do in the first place.

[Scott F]

There is a review of the new mushroom jig head and it says the Elaztech plastics stay on very well. Of all that posted here saying the plastics won’t go on the jig, has anyone actually tried it?

[Tim Kelly]

It won't grip them if you just push the trd on, you have to pinch the trd where the barb will go and stretch it over the barb. Once you've lifted the elastech over the barb it won't come off for a long time.

[WRB]

It's very unlikely a light wire hook will bend out from fighting a bass on finesse tackle.

Hook bending is usually angler caused when trying to unhook a bass.

Ned Rig is a fineese presentation designed to catch numbers of bass according to the man it's named after. The Z-Man plastic doesn't tear easily allowing more small bass to caught per hour, the goal of the Ned rig.

I am not a Ned rig fan and catch numbers of bass using other finesse presentations that are more effective for me and use light wire hooks without bending them.

Z-Man is trying to offer bass anglers what they want and that is how you grow a business.

Tom

[wdp]

Sorry guys. Didn't mean to cause a heated debate. I really don't care if it's a true Ned Rig or not so long as it catches fish. Kinda why I put it in quotation marks in the title. ?

 

I just remembered reading complaints in a few other threads about some not liking the original bait keeper & about hooks bending. Thought this might be a solution to some users. Kinda wanted opinions if anybody has tried these new Shroomz yet. And if they're worth trying. 

 

I'm prob not fishing it right either. I just started trying it a few months ago. I've used a M F rod with braid. Might be why I've had a few hooks bend. Dang thing sure does catch fish tho, especially when nothing else seems to be working. 

 

And yes @Team9nine you are a curmudgeon. ? Just kidding. You seem like a good guy & I really enjoy your posts. ?

[Team9nine]

Haven't seen many reviews yet. Heavier hook will be appreciated by many I'm sure. Lots of complaints about the original metal welded keeper, so not surprising they went with a different design. I'd have to believe it works fine with their plastics since they designed it - I'll never find out though 

[OCdockskipper]

The complaint about bending hooks and the "need" for beefier Shroomz hooks illustrate Team9nine's point.  

 

If you are using light gear with light line and have your drag set correctly, you will never bend a hook.  I have caught bass over 8 lbs and catfish over 15 lbs on Shroomz hooks and never had one bend.  These fish pull drag of course, but that is why you pay for that feature on a reel.  You spent a lot of money on that rod & reel, let it do its job to help fight the fish instead of horse it in.

 

However, if you decide to "customize" a Ned rig and use heavier gear or line and set the drag at a point beyond what it should be, then you may bend a hook.  You can choose to solve that problem by using a beefier hook, but that ends up creating other problems with the presentation.  The solution that doesn't create other problems was to not make your customization.

 

What ends up happening is folks start throwing 1/4 oz Big TRD's on 15lb test with a baitcaster and then chime in that those Ned Rig aficionados must be fishing on some loaded lakes, because the results this "customized" rig get are nowhere near the other Ned Rig claims.  Well, you can use a lawnmower to trim a hedge but if you do, don't complain to Toro that you lopped off your foot...

[wdp]

26 minutes ago, Team9nine said:

Haven't seen many reviews yet. Heavier hook will be appreciated by many I'm sure. Lots of complaints about the original metal welded keeper, so not surprising they went with a different design. I'd have to believe it works fine with their plastics since they designed it - I'll never find out though 

Yeah, I'd guess they had to test & make sure it works with the Elaztech material. Sure doesn't look like it'd be easy to thread it on the hook tho. 

 

So, do you not use the ZMan products at all, or just not their Shroomz? What types of jig heads & baits do you prefer?

[Team9nine]

I use Zman stuff, plastics and ShroomZ. Don't need their new jigheads though because I fish all lightweight stuff on finesse outfits. I don't need heavy wire hooks for what I do, and am perfectly happy with the original wire keeper version. I fish the style, not the bait.

[Scott F]

I’ve bent and broken plenty of the shroomz jigs. None of them on fish, all while trying to get them unsnagged from rocks and wood while using 10lb braid. 

[Cgolf]

Another option might be the new Berkley half head jig in 1/16 oz with a size 1 hook which I believe is one size too big to be a Ned which I think is capped at a 2. They are the same size as a sievert morel jig. 

 

As for bending hooks I have used the gopher heads with the cheaper mustad hooks and have never bent a hook on a fish. 

[BrackishBassin]

Only time I've managed to bend out one of the Zman shroom jigs was trying to get it out of the side of a submerged log I found. But I fish them on a med light rod with 15lb braid and a 6 lb leader. No clue how the leader held up, but it did. 

[fishwizzard]

I bought a pack of the new heads and the keeper works extremely well.  It is based on a keeper by...TT Lures I think?  They are an Australian company and had been making heads for Z-man lures down there for years.  

 

I don't like the look of the heavier hook, nor the fact that the heads are way heavier than the standard Shroom heads, but I have yet to fish them.   

[gim]

 

31 minutes ago, fishwizzard said:

I bought a pack of the new heads and the keeper works extremely well

Nice, I ordered a pack of the new nedlockz jig head and I will report how they work after they arrive and I try them.  I had a couple of the original jigs bend out on large fish but it was my own fault because I had the drag set too tight on my reel.

[MickD]

5 hours ago, Scott F said:

There is a review of the new mushroom jig head and it says the Elaztech plastics stay on very well. Of all that posted here saying the plastics won’t go on the jig, has anyone actually tried it?

Yes.

 

[wdp]

1 hour ago, gimruis said:

I had a couple of the original jigs bend out on large fish but it was my own fault because I had the drag set too tight on my reel.

Yeah, think this is my problem too. I'm too lazy to switch up to a true light finesse set up to fish these. I just change up to the Shroomz & TRD using my spinning rod that already has 10 or 15 lb braid. Drag is set pretty high also. 

 

I should add that I've never had a hook completely straighten out & have a fish come unbuttoned. It was more that the hook just bent up a little a few times requiring a little rebending with some needle nose pliers. Kinda makes me a little paranoid tho that the light wire hook would eventually break if I had to rebend it a few more times. 

[Team9nine]

1 hour ago, wdp said:

Yeah, think this is my problem too. I'm too lazy to switch up to a true light finesse set up to fish these. I just change up to the Shroomz & TRD using my spinning rod that already has 10 or 15 lb braid. Drag is set pretty high also. 

 

I should add that I've never had a hook completely straighten out & have a fish come unbuttoned. It was more that the hook just bent up a little a few times requiring a little rebending with some needle nose pliers. Kinda makes me a little paranoid tho that the light wire hook would eventually break if I had to rebend it a few more times. 

 

It might, but it certainly has been weakened. Best to just trash those hooks you've bent and reshaped. It will eventually cost you somewhere down the line if you don't. You can get by just fine with a little heavier rod like a medium, but ideally it will be a little slower action, not a fast or x-fast.