Braid guys - what's your take?

[J Francho]

42 minutes ago, Rick Howard said:

My thinking was that if you tie floro to braid you only increase your chances of knot failure by adding more knots.

 

If they are two well tied knots, physics says that each knot carries less burden, as the number knots increases.  Hmmm.

I used to make that argument, too.  All the while, fishing for steelhead and salmon using a centerpin, float rigging, and 8# line.  The terminal rig has no less than 5 knots.  The fish sometimes run more than double the line rating.  If there was an issue with knots, that situation would shake it out.

[fissure_man]

4 hours ago, J Francho said:

 

If they are two well tied knots, physics says that each knot carries less burden, as the number knots increases.  Hmmm.

 

Hmmm indeed

 

Your rod-reel-line-knot-hook system is only as strong as the weakest link.  If we accept there is some variance in achieved knot strength, then each additional variable-strength knot you tie in series increases the likelihood that one of them will be weak enough to fail (like Russian Roulette, how many times do you want to spin and pull the trigger?)

 

That said, 100 well-tied knots in a row are just as strong a single well-tied knot, and are stronger than a single poorly tied knot.  So if you tie your knots properly and use appropriate gear and drag setting, knot failure should be a non-issue (salmon/steelhead example). 

 

On the other hand, if you’re really bad at tying and QC-ing knots, to the extent that any given knot may be dramatically weaker than the previous (becoming likely to break under normal fishing conditions), then yes, keeping the # of knots to an absolute minimum may technically help you.  But that doesn’t address the problem - just tie better knots!

 

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In response to the OP:

 

I think there is some pressure on the pros as ‘experts’ to maintain the impression that every part of their presentation is dialed in to the finest, near-scientific detail.  Is it really?  

 

How often do multiple anglers come in after fishing similar (or the same) areas, each having divined a different ‘best’ presentation/line/lure/color?  Even if one caught more than the rest, what was the critical difference?  Rarely is it crystal clear.

 

Experimentation happens most when things aren’t working, but even then, how often are variables tested independently (is it even possible?)?  Maybe Seth tied on the fluoro leader at the same time as drifting onto an active fish, or it coincided with the fish turning on for some (any) other reason.  Maybe it was the line, who knows?  20 lb fluoro is hardly stealthy to me, and much thicker than 40 lb braid.  Was it the visibility? Lack of visibility? Stiffness?  Effect on fall rate?  Water displacement signature?  Sound rubbing on the weeds?  Would 15 lb have worked better, worse, equal?  Would 25 lb have worked at all?  There’s no time on tournament day to even try to answer these questions - when you find a system that works, duplicate it.  Come interview time, state your best educated guesses as fact, mix in ample sponsor plugs, and you're good to go

[BassNJake]

On 8/3/2017 at 3:41 PM, S Hovanec said:

Don't know the situation, but here's a little experiment I did a few years ago.  I fished 2 identical setups on Erie, one with straight braid and one with braid and a 6# floro leader.  The only bites I got were on the rod with leader.

 

I fished Erie a few times for smallmouth where only 6lb floro would get a bite, whether it be on a leader or straight flourocarbon.

8lb floro was too heavy/visible as well as 8 or 6 lb mono, It's my opinion they were "spooked" or more wary of the line.

 

We were fishing in 12-18 ft of water targeting individual groups of boulders way out in no mans land.

So a lot different than flipping weeds.

 

With that being said why do people use as light of a floro leader as they can get away with?

If floro was as invisible as they say, 20lb could be used instead of 6lb and you wouldn't have the break offs.

 

I think floro is harder to see than mono or braid but not invisible.

I also believe it is another tool that has a place and time when it can be more beneficial.

 

[S Hovanec]

53 minutes ago, BassNJake said:

 

 

With that being said why do people use as light of a floro leader as they can get away with?

If floro was as invisible as they say, 20lb could be used instead of 6lb and you wouldn't have the break offs.

 

 

 

 

I don't think it's the visibility, it's the stiffness of the line.  Light line does not impede the action of the bait the way heavier line does.