Understanding Vegetation

[Chowderhead]

Hoping that I can get some insight from the Board on what I experienced at a small pond this past weekend. Since I am just getting back into fishing after a 25+year layoff, I just have not spent enough time fishing to know what this means, if anything. Just a few acres in size, I fished this pond last year (May - November) pretty regularly.  No LMB of any significant size, but always decent numbers in the 1 to 2 pound range.  With the crazy warm February days we have been having in Omaha, the ice is largely gone off the pond and I wanted to get a jump on a new year of fishing. 

 

When I arrived at the pond, the surface was covered in weeds, vegetation, etc... to the point where it was difficult to find any open water casting areas.  My question to the Board: Is this normal for a pond just after ice melts off.  I was at this same pond just a few weeks ago as part of my "scouting out can't wait to start fishing again" trip, and there was still ice/snow on there and I did not the weeds.  I am guessing this was left over weeds from late last fall (I last fished the pond on November 28th), but just don't know what to make of it.  What will happen to the vegetation that is there now on the surface -- where will it go? I tried to get the close up shot to show that down in the water, the vegetation is really green. I am guessing it is already starting to grow...?  Also (if you can tell from my amateurish photography skills), would this be considered relatively clear water? 

[Paul Roberts]

That's algae. Probably a filamentous algae.

 

Normal? Not really, this early in the year. It suggests to me that there was a runoff event that washed in a LOT of nutrients, as in fertilizers. Is there agricultural land nearby? Possibly a feedlot?

 

Risks for bass? Probably not, unless it's shallow and you get a really hot summer, which could result in a summer kill by bacteria feeding on dead algae and depleting 02. Those mats will block light from reaching other aquatic plants in the pond. If this continues, winterkill could be a risk too, for similar reasons -02 depletion -feeding bacteria rather than fish.

[jr231]

1oz (maybe 3/4) tungsten weight. Followed by a Texas rigged rage bug. You'll be right back in the fish. 

[Chowderhead]

9 hours ago, Paul Roberts said:

That's algae. Probably a filamentous algae.

 

Normal? Not really, this early in the year. It suggests to me that there was a runoff event that washed in a LOT of nutrients, as in fertilizers. Is there agricultural land nearby? Possibly a feedlot?

 

Risks for bass? Probably not, unless it's shallow and you get a really hot summer, which could result in a summer kill by bacteria feeding on dead algae and depleting 02. Those mats will block light from reaching other aquatic plants in the pond. If this continues, winterkill could be a risk too, for similar reasons -02 depletion -feeding bacteria rather than fish.

You are correct, the pond is adjacent to farm land on one side, with a business close by on the other side. I don't know the actual depth, but from what I have figured out it is a fairly shallow pond.

 

I went over and looked around this morning and the weeds have opened up some (had a rain storm last night), but now I am seeing small bait fish (shad?) floating belly up near the shore. By my quick count, must have been several dozen. 

[scaleface]

The pond down the street looked like that a few years ago .I caught several big bass out of that muck . I had  it to myself because no one else figured out how to fish in it .

[Paul Roberts]

2 hours ago, Chowderhead said:

You are correct, the pond is adjacent to farm land on one side, with a business close by on the other side. I don't know the actual depth, but from what I have figured out it is a fairly shallow pond.

 

I went over and looked around this morning and the weeds have opened up some (had a rain storm last night), but now I am seeing small bait fish (shad?) floating belly up near the shore. By my quick count, must have been several dozen. 

I try to hit my circuit of ponds at ice-out after heavy winters -much snow on ice- to check for winterkill. It's the shallow ponds with lot of vegetation that are at highest risk. I get there as close to ice-out as I can bc carcasses rot and sink very quickly. Th3e odor of a strong kill, and accompanying gulls, can be a tip off too.

 

Some ponds have been devastated some years. When I see other fishers plying those waters I let them know. Sad thing is that large fish tend top succumb first. Fortunately, severe winters are not that frequent here. Kills aren't always complete either. Partial kills may only affect one end of a (largish) pond. And the culling effect of a partial kill can reduce competition and pave the way for rapid growth following. One devastating kill I experienced resulted in the culling of huge numbers of stunted bass -I had a 100 fish day there once, of gaunt 10inchers. Three or so years later it was giving up good numbers of chunky 15-16"ers. One year I came upon a partial kill that boded well for the coming years (and it panned out) but among the casualties of that partial kill was one of the few 20+" bass I knew of in my ponds. That hurt. That's an 8 to 10 year old fish here. When you do the math, it hurts even more.

 

On to less moribund talk...

I've fished and done well in algae covered ponds, like scaleface, using frogs and at one pond years ago, with a bucktail keel-hook streamer and fly tackle. That was FUN! The blow-ups left holes in the algae and I could look back across the pond at my backtrail and count the number of catches by the holes and drag lines.

[scaleface]

3 minutes ago, Paul Roberts said:

 

 

I've fished and done well in algae covered ponds, like scaleface, using frogs and at one pond years ago, with a bucktail keel-hook streamer and fly tackle. 

 

I used a weightless Yum Wurm with a big heavy hook .  The bass cant even fight , they have to be drug entangled in several pounds of moss .

[Chowderhead]

On 2/21/2017 at 7:14 AM, Chowderhead said:

I went over and looked around this morning and the weeds have opened up some (had a rain storm last night), but now I am seeing small bait fish (shad?) floating belly up near the shore. By my quick count, must have been several dozen. 

 

Here are some pictures of the dead bait fish.  Did not see any bass or bluegill floating, and did not notice smell of dead fish.  Not sure if this is normal or if something else is going on.

On 2/20/2017 at 9:41 PM, Yeajray231 said:

1oz (maybe 3/4) tungsten weight. Followed by a Texas rigged rage bug. You'll be right back in the fish. 

 

On 2/21/2017 at 7:20 AM, scaleface said:

The pond down the street looked like that a few years ago .I caught several big bass out of that muck . I had  it to myself because no one else figured out how to fish in it .

 

I would love to learn how to fish the muck, but my equipment and confidence is just not up for that at this point.

[NCbassraider]

It has been such a warm winter in NC we are seeing bottom and surface algae that we typically don't see until early summer which is disturbing.  I have been out on the boat every day this week and can see it spreading daily. It was close to 80 again today.  It's going to be a messy summer on the water here.

 

The real problem with the mats you have in those pics is they will continue to grow as temps warm but if you get a cold spell they will die and sink, and as they decompose, they suck the oxygen from the water and you have a high probability of a fish kill.

 

You may already be experiencing a fish kill from lack of oxygen.  Typically you will see bait fish start dying first.  If you see bait fish at the surface sucking air and making bubbles, that is a tell tale sign. 

[Chowderhead]

7 minutes ago, NCbassraider said:

You may already be experiencing a fish kill from lack of oxygen.  Typically you will see bait fish start dying first.  If you see bait fish at the surface sucking air and making bubbles, that is a tell tale sign. 

 

You described it perfectly.  In addition to the dead fish I saw, I did see other bait fish at the surface "sucking air and making bubbles."  Now I guess I wait and see if the bluegill and LMB start to die off.  I sure hope not.

[NCbassraider]

1 minute ago, Chowderhead said:

 

You described it perfectly.  In addition to the dead fish I saw, I did see other bait fish at the surface "sucking air and making bubbles."  Now I guess I wait and see if the bluegill and LMB start to die off.  I sure hope not.

The pond needs aeration.  A real heavy rain would help otherwise you will be looking at a fish kill.  How deep is it and how many acres?

[Chowderhead]

 

11 minutes ago, NCbassraider said:

The pond needs aeration.  A real heavy rain would help otherwise you will be looking at a fish kill.  How deep is it and how many acres?

 

Guessing at most only around 2 acres and not very deep (maybe 8' at most) -- seems fairly shallow in most spots.  Our forecast is for rain/snow the next few days, though I am not sure it will be any significant amount.

[NCbassraider]

There are some things you can do to save the fish if you are interested.  The easiest is, if you have a power source near by, to buy a cheap fountain pond at Lowes or Hope Depot or a cheap pond aerator.  It doesn't have to be big.  The fish will find the oxygen rich area and crowd around it.

 

I have seen some fountains that run off a 12v marine battery and attach via alligator clips. Any size is better than nothing.

 

You can rent a trash pump that runs on gas that will pull water out of the pond with one hose and spray it back in with another thus aerating on return.  A regular water pump would clog in that pond but a trash pump won't. 

 

If you have access to a canoe or small boat, simply rowing around and splashing will help.  Bring a friend and a pool skimmer and remove as much of those surface mats as possible.  That will make a huge difference.

[Chowderhead]

21 minutes ago, NCbassraider said:

If you have access to a canoe or small boat, simply rowing around and splashing will help.  Bring a friend and a pool skimmer and remove as much of those surface mats as possible.  That will make a huge difference.

 

This us a great idea and may be my best bet. I will give this a try.

[WRB]

Looks like the pond turned over right after ice out, warmer bottom water brought up all the bottom junk. Let this pond settle down for about 2 weeks.

Tom

[NCbassraider]

 I've never seen a pond that shallow turn over but either way finding a way to aerate and skimming some of that algae is still necessary.  In a pond that small, a fish kill can be devastating and i'd say it's already underway.

 

Once those mats on the surface die, and it appears some are already, they will sink and begin to decompose which sucks the remaining oxygen out of the water and releases nitrates an ammonia which, in turn, feed and grow new algae.  So it's a vicious cycle once it gets going.  Removing as much off the surface is the best way to save the pond.

[Chowderhead]

Follow up - went out yesterday for about an hour. No surface vegetation anywhere on the pond, but did find sections of very green subsurface weeds. Did not see any bait fish or signs of bedding fish (likely way too early for this area). Caught 1 small bass (guessing only 1 pound at best) on a white chatterbait. The coloring did not look that great (very pale coloring) though not sure if that is due to water temps or some other issue. Will try a few more times once water temps warm up. I'm really hoping that this pond still has good supply of healthy fish. 

[geo g]

On 2/20/2017 at 9:40 PM, Chowderhead said:

Hoping that I can get some insight from the Board on what I experienced at a small pond this past weekend. Since I am just getting back into fishing after a 25+year layoff, I just have not spent enough time fishing to know what this means, if anything. Just a few acres in size, I fished this pond last year (May - November) pretty regularly.  No LMB of any significant size, but always decent numbers in the 1 to 2 pound range.  With the crazy warm February days we have been having in Omaha, the ice is largely gone off the pond and I wanted to get a jump on a new year of fishing. 

 

When I arrived at the pond, the surface was covered in weeds, vegetation, etc... to the point where it was difficult to find any open water casting areas.  My question to the Board: Is this normal for a pond just after ice melts off.  I was at this same pond just a few weeks ago as part of my "scouting out can't wait to start fishing again" trip, and there was still ice/snow on there and I did not the weeds.  I am guessing this was left over weeds from late last fall (I last fished the pond on November 28th), but just don't know what to make of it.  What will happen to the vegetation that is there now on the surface -- where will it go? I tried to get the close up shot to show that down in the water, the vegetation is really green. I am guessing it is already starting to grow...?  Also (if you can tell from my amateurish photography skills), would this be considered relatively clear water? 

 

 

As pretty as that looks to some people, I would go somewhere else to fish.  Just picking the junk off the lure constantly would not make it worth it.

[Chowderhead]

Been about a month since my last post in this thread. I have gone back to the pond a few times (including last night) and starting to see things heat up.

 

I am catching decent numbers in the 1 - 2 pound range, and the fish appear to be healthy (good coloration, no disease spots, very active during fight, swim off very quickly, etc...).

 

A positive sign is that I am seeing good number of bluegill and caught a quick glimpse of the "mama" bass of the pond last night. It was only a few feet off shore, cruising back and forth parallel to the bank. It dwarfed the fish I have been catching. 

 

 

[Paul Roberts]

12 minutes ago, Chowderhead said:

Been about a month since my last post in this thread. I have gone back to the pond a few times (including last night) and starting to see things heat up.

 

I am catching decent numbers in the 1 - 2 pound range, and the fish appear to be healthy (good coloration, no disease spots, very active during fight, swim off very quickly, etc...).

 

A positive sign is that I am seeing good number of bluegill and caught a quick glimpse of the "mama" bass of the pond last night. It was only a few feet off shore, cruising back and forth parallel to the bank. It dwarfed the fish I have been catching. 

 

 

 

The spawn is imminent.

[Chowderhead]

On 4/16/2017 at 2:09 PM, Paul Roberts said:

 

The spawn is imminent.

Yes, I was wondering if that is what it was leading up to.