Super Tuned Reels

[j bab]

You guys who super tune their reels...

Would you recommend any upgrades to a 2016 Zillion SV TWS to make it more smooth or pitch better?

I'm about to order 2 of the reels, and I know that they'll be some of the best reels out there for this application, but in theory if I were to want to perfect an already excellent reel, what would you recommend?

[.ghoti.]

Before spending money trying to make a new reel better, do a complete tear down, clean and lube. You will be surprised by the improvement. At that point you can decide what to upgrade. Or not.

[J Francho]

The only upgrades that you could make would be cosmetic.  A complete tear down, de-grease, clean, and lube by a pro will make it even better.

[rippin-lips]

Send it to Ian Shields. He's hands down the best in the business for reel tuning. Getting the brake inductor tuned is a good start. I sent him 6 of my sv spools to be tuned and polished. Definitely a big improvement over stock. 

[Jig Man]

Ian has worked on some of mine and put Boca bearings in them.  Big difference.

[.ghoti.]

30 minutes ago, rippin-lips said:

Send it to Ian Shields. He's hands down the best in the business for reel tuning. Getting the brake inductor tuned is a good start. I sent him 6 of my sv spools to be tuned and polished. Definitely a big improvement over stock. 

Brake inductor tuning? Do tell.

[rippin-lips]

2 hours ago, .ghoti. said:

Brake inductor tuning? Do tell.

The softer inductor spring is swapped out for a stiffer one. SV spools have been known to have the inductor get stuck in the out position basically making it a fixed inductor. Until you remove the sideplate and twist the inductor to get it to go back to normal. This fixes that issue and also changes the braking profile of the spool making it even better yet. On the spools I had the mod performed on it really woke them up when compared to a stock sv spool used in the same reel. The stock spool is pretty great already but it's definitely an improvement on the sv. 

[Redlinerobert]

Send one to Ian and leave the other stock.  Do a side by side and you'll  soon send Ian the 2nd reel.

[QUAKEnSHAKE]

2 hours ago, rippin-lips said:

The softer inductor spring is swapped out for a stiffer one. SV spools have been known to have the inductor get stuck in the out position basically making it a fixed inductor. Until you remove the sideplate and twist the inductor to get it to go back to normal. This fixes that issue and also changes the braking profile of the spool making it even better yet. On the spools I had the mod performed on it really woke them up when compared to a stock sv spool used in the same reel. The stock spool is pretty great already but it's definitely an improvement on the sv. 

Ive had my SV105 spool inductor get stuck at the outward position but didnt know it was known issue. Is there a part # for the stiffer spring or what reel that uses a stiffer spring I can order myself to do swap?

[crypt]

where is this Ian Sheilds you speak of?

[rippin-lips]

15 minutes ago, QUAKEnSHAKE said:

Ive had my SV105 spool inductor get stuck at the outward position but didnt know it was known issue. Is there a part # for the stiffer spring or what reel that uses a stiffer spring I can order myself to do swap?

That was the one reel I seemed to have the most issues with. I don't know what spring he used. Just one of the many things he's figured out over the years. 

16 minutes ago, crypt said:

where is this Ian Sheilds you speak of?

He is in Alabama. He goes by e_bassfisher on the other forums. I'm sure you can get his info with a quick google search. 

[j bab]

@rippin-lips have you ever upgraded your bearings? The model Zillion I'm referring to has 4crbb+4bb+1rb, are the CRbb's any good or would you swap them? Honestly I don't know much about the placement of bearings in the reel. If I'm sending it to this guy should I have bearings added to the knobs or does that require new knobs? What about the worm gear? Does a carbontex drag add or take away from the strength?

[rippin-lips]

17 minutes ago, j bab said:

@rippin-lips have you ever upgraded your bearings? The model Zillion I'm referring to has 4crbb+4bb+1rb, are the CRbb's any good or would you swap them? Honestly I don't know much about the placement of bearings in the reel. If I'm sending it to this guy should I have bearings added to the knobs or does that require new knobs? What about the worm gear? Does a carbontex drag add or take away from the strength?

CRBB = corrosion resistant ball bearing

The stock bearings in the reel will be fine. You can add a pair of zpi sic spool bearings. They're really nice but not required.

You can add knob bearings without replacing the knobs. Up to you if it's worth it.

The worm gear bearing upgrade is up to you. I do it but don't notice any improvement. To me a bearing is better than a plastic bushing though. 

Carbontex drag washers are a nice upgrade. Not really gaining any pressure but they are smoother. That reel might have carbon drag washers stock. 

[Delaware Valley Tackle]

10 minutes ago, j bab said:

@rippin-lips have you ever upgraded your bearings? The model Zillion I'm referring to has 4crbb+4bb+1rb, are the CRbb's any good or would you swap them? Honestly I don't know much about the placement of bearings in the reel. If I'm sending it to this guy should I have bearings added to the knobs or does that require new knobs? What about the worm gear? Does a carbontex drag add or take away from the strength?

When compared to stock bearings that have been flushed and properly lubed, the gains of a bearing swap are less significant. Typically the two spool bearings are what's changed. The Carbontex drag is a good upgrade and fairly inexpensive. Max drag will increase but better still they're smoother and consistent. I'd have to see the handle or a schematic to see what the options are. A lot of what you're looking at here is getting into the enthusiast realm and won't do a lot on the Water as far as fish catching. That's fine as long as that fits your goals and expectations. There's a lot of hype around reel tuning that, probably to my own detriment, I shy away from. Anyone wanting to discuss specific scenarios feel free to give me a shout. 

[J Francho]

I find just stretching the inductor springs a tiny bit works fine.  If they're too tight, you'll never get the benefit of the braking.  Too loose, and you'll be in the brakes at the slightest spool rotation.

[rippin-lips]

That's what I was doing at first until I had Ian work on them. It did help out but it's nowhere close to the spring mod when used side by side. At least in my hands and with my casting ability. 

[J Francho]

I guess I'd be worried about totally disabling the Magforce.  Sounds like he's worked out a formula.  Pretty cool.

[.ghoti.]

John, if you want to try it, this is likely the spring:

http://japantackle.com/tuning-parts/spools-casting-reels/tu001003.html

There is also another procedure you may like to try.

Before removing the inductor assembly, make note of where, on the inner surface of the spool, where the nylon blocks ride on the spool. These blocks are what forces the inductor to move against the force of the spring. Polish the inside face of the spool in that area. You will also be polishing the spool shaft at the same time, if you use the right size felt wheel, or brush to do the polishing.

i tried this after observing how the inductor moves when accelerated. I chucked up a spool in my Foredom tool, and accelerated it up to the point where it started to move, and decelerated to see when it would retract. I was just curious to see at what speeds these movements would occur. I found the movement to be very inconsistent. Not at all a smooth exrension and retraction. Rather jerky, in fact. I said to myself, self, you can improve on that. Thus the polishing experiment.

After several disassemble, polish, reassemble and test cycles, I was able to get rid of the jerkiness.  Also the speeds at which extension and retraction occured were much more repeatable. Dont know what the actual speeds were, but were well below the max speed on the Foredom, which is, if memory serves, 18000rpm.

I have done this to three of my reels, one Zillion, one Fuego and one Alphas. I slight improvement was noticable, most in the Alphas. Not, I believe, due to any inherent differences in the reels, but rather, a difference in application. I use the Alphas reels on my lightest power rods, with lightest line, for the lightest baits.

I havent followed this up with more reels. Reel tuning has definitely taken a back seat to rod building at this guy's shop. And, this is really a marginal improvement. But, this may be of interest to the truly afflicted. 

[QUAKEnSHAKE]

On 12/7/2016 at 8:48 AM, .ghoti. said:

John, if you want to try it, this is likely the spring:

http://japantackle.com/tuning-parts/spools-casting-reels/tu001003.html

 

This spring is now in stock and I have one ordered. Will look forward to seeing what difference it has on performance. 

 

http://kenken-020412.blogspot.com/2013/09/sv-spool-fault-and-remedy_3.html

I have fixed my stuck inductor by following this procedure of filling the gap in the poorly toleranced piece.  Trying to get the inductor to stick even by hand (which was easily done prior) is not happening so it does seem to work. 

 

I did take out the Tatula spool and the spring in there feels stiffer than the SV105 spring so might have a couple of options on spring rate.

[rippin-lips]

14 hours ago, QUAKEnSHAKE said:

This spring is now in stock and I have one ordered. Will look forward to seeing what difference it has on performance. 

I can confirm that it's not an hlc spring but it is an improvement over the stock spring for sure. I already had a few that I ordered awhile back. Upgrade but not the magic ticket. It's still softer in spring rate.  

[MickD]

Make sure you know the reputation of the person who is to super tune your reel.  There are a few idiots out there who advertise super tuning but will ruin your reel.  

[new2BC4bass]

27 minutes ago, MickD said:

Make sure you know the reputation of the person who is to super tune your reel.  There are a few idiots out there who advertise super tuning but will ruin your reel.  

 

Or steal parts.  I had my GIGAS spool swapped out on a TD-Z 103HL Type R, but he was banned from this foum and TT years ago.