First step to getting kayak/canoe done

[68camaro]

Been thinking of kayak or canoe for quite some time, goals is to make decision in next 30 - 45 days. This past week end I had delivered a pair of Rhino-Rack RSP27 roof racks and installed onto my Jeep Grand Cherokee. Now all I need is something to put on them.

My base needs are:

• Lightweight
• holds 2 people
• allows accessories/troll motor
• Wide enough and stable enough to stand fishing

The two finalists are a 12' Sportspal canoe and a 12' KC Fishing Kayak, both meet my needs and each has few plus/minus over other. Costs about the same. 

If anyone has experience with either I would appreciate your comments on them.

Thanks

 

[Goose52]

As you know, I have the Radisson 12' canoe, similar to the Sportspal 12' but with a lighter hull weight. I can say that while these 12' boats have two seats...they would be VERY cramped with two people, especially if both are fishing. If a two person capacity is important...you might want to consider the 14' model.

[Darren.]

I agree with Goose, a 12' canoe or kayak would feel
very cramped for two.

So I'd also suggest a minimum of 14' for what you're
looking for. Will add more cost, but it'll be worth it.

I took my (now 11 year old) youngest son with me on
my 12' Native Ultimate-- which is a hybrid yak/canoe--
and while it was do-able, it wasn't optimal.

There's no way in H-E-double hockey sticks, I could 
take another adult in my yak...

[68camaro]

Darren and Goose thanks, I have considered the 14' Sportspal, the only difference in the US made version is 10 lbs over 12'.

The reality is 90+% of time I would be by myself so I figured the shorter would be fine most of time.

Goose, I plan to put troll motor on Sportspal, but for days I leave it at home, how is paddling the 12' sportspal by myself, is it a royal PITA?

Also Goose, How durable is your Canadian version, do you fear tears or rips? How careful to you need to be with it? The canadian version is 14 lbs lighter than US 12', and 17lbs lighter for 14'.  How careful do you need to be?

Darren the KC has a layout a little more friendly for second person, the seat can be pushed way back and another added up front, but point well taken on tightness.

 

 

[Darren.]

3 minutes ago, 68camaro said:

Darren the KC has a layout a little more friendly for second person, the seat can be pushed way back and another added up front, but point well taken on tightness.

That's good to know. At least you are informed.

My canoe was a 16' Grumman, and it was not very
stable. I used homemade pontoons so I could stand.
Taking a passenger was rather simple in the 16'er. 
In fact, I could take two passengers, although it still
wasn't optimal, but it was far better than what I can
do now.

If I were to do it "again", I'd probably try to get a 14'
hybrid canoe/kayak like my Native Ultimate. As it 
stands, I do the trolling motor thing with my 12', and
it is awesome.

Good luck with your project!

[68camaro]

6 minutes ago, Darren. said:

If I were to do it "again",

If I only had a dollar every time I said or though that

[Goose52]

On 2/2/2016 at 8:18 PM, 68camaro said:

Darren and Goose thanks, I have considered the 14' Sportspal, the only difference in the US made version is 10 lbs over 12'.

The reality is 90+% of time I would be by myself so I figured the shorter would be fine most of time.

Goose, I plan to put troll motor on Sportspal, but for days I leave it at home, how is paddling the 12' sportspal by myself, is it a royal PITA?

Also Goose, How durable is your Canadian version, do you fear tears or rips? How careful to you need to be with it? The canadian version is 14 lbs lighter than US 12', and 17lbs lighter for 14'.  How careful do you need to be?

Darren the KC has a layout a little more friendly for second person, the seat can be pushed way back and another added up front, but point well taken on tightness.

 

 

Paddling:  My total distance paddling probably amounts to a couple miles since I planned to motor it from the get-go.  From my limited experience, it paddles OK....but like most short canoes with a wide beam it doesn't track as well as a longer boat.  I can say for SURE that if you are paddling solo you MUST run the boat backwards; in other words you have to sit on the front seat - facing aft. This puts your body weight closer to amidships. The photos below illustrate this - note the position of the boat when I sit on the stern seat...  The photos also show how small the 12' model is even with only one person in it.

Punctures:  All my lakes are mostly open water, although I do have a place that has some standing submerged timber where I could potentially run the boat up on a submerged tree (and did do that once). Otherwise, I just have to be careful on launching/landing to not hit any rocks or underwater structure. So, my water is open, and I do try to be careful not to hit anything. I do have dents and creases all over the bottom of the hull even with that careful usage - the aluminum is that thin. BUT, no leakage, no punctures, no tears after 6 seasons totaling over 350 times on the water. I keep saying that I'm going to keep some Gorilla tape in the boat in the event that I needed a temporary patch but never got around to it.

Sitting in stern seat:

Sitting on front seat - facing aft:

[68camaro]

6 hours ago, Goose52 said:

Paddling:  My total distance paddling probably amounts to a couple miles since I planned to motor it from the get-go.  From my limited experience, it paddles OK....but like most short canoes with a wide beam it doesn't track as well as a longer boat.  I can say for SURE that if you are paddling solo you MUST run the boat backwards; in other words you have to sit on the front seat - facing aft. This puts your body weight closer to amidships. The photos below illustrate this - note the position of the boat when I sit on the stern seat...  The photos also show how small the 12' model is with only one person in it.

Thank you this is very helpful. It does look smaller than I imagine from that angle.  For me alone it would be fine but the second person looks it could get cramped. I think I'll stick with US heavier version but may reconsider the 14'. I do have troll motor but I have a couple small ponds I would even bother with it.

[Goose52]

6 hours ago, 68camaro said:

Thank you this is very helpful. It does look smaller than I imagine from that angle.  For me alone it would be fine but the second person looks it could get cramped. I think I'll stick with US heavier version but may reconsider the 14'. I do have troll motor but I have a couple small ponds I would even bother with it.

If I ever wear out this boat, I might move to a 14' myself, even though I fish solo. 14' would perhaps give me more options on gear and rod storage. I would still get a Radisson, or I've also been looking at a Wenonah that is a very nice boat...

[sully99]

Native makes a tandem FX15 and is also selling the older 14.5 again. Both have everything that you need with no mods needed. Jackson also makes a Kilroy in a tandem now.

[68camaro]

8 hours ago, Goose52 said:

If I ever wear out this boat, I might move to a 14' myself, even though I fish solo. 14' would perhaps give me more options on gear and rod storage. I would still get a Radisson, or I've also been looking at a Wenonah that is a very nice boat...

I looked at the Wenonah and it was high on list until I saw the Sportspal. The 2 non-ultra light Wenonah 14' fisherman models are $1900 (49 lbs) and $2200 (46 lbs). I just don't see the value over the $1,100 14' (58 lb) Sportspal or $1,000 12'er (48 lbs).

Unless I am missing something I just don't think Wenonah's are worth that much more. I can by a lot of accessories for $1,000:)

Chuck

2 hours ago, sully99 said:

Native makes a tandem FX15 and is also selling the older 14.5 again. Both have everything that you need with no mods needed. Jackson also makes a Kilroy in a tandem now.

It does look nice. I am getting too tired to put another in mix or I would look further into this this, at 59 lbs its lighter than I thought it would be.

[Goose52]

Yeah , the Wenonah Fisherman is spendy for sure. AND, I was looking at the kevlar $$$ model. You get the extra length, keep the beam, and it weighs about the same as my 12' Radisson. BUT it IS hard to justify the cost when I can get the 14' Radisson for MUCH less and the weight penalty is only 7 pounds over the 12' model.

It's sorta like the Curado vs. Antares discussions...

[Fishing Rhino]

On ‎2‎/‎2‎/‎2016 at 9:18 PM, 68camaro said:

Darren and Goose thanks, I have considered the 14' Sportspal, the only difference in the US made version is 10 lbs over 12'.

The reality is 90+% of time I would be by myself so I figured the shorter would be fine most of time.

Goose, I plan to put troll motor on Sportspal, but for days I leave it at home, how is paddling the 12' sportspal by myself, is it a royal PITA?

Also Goose, How durable is your Canadian version, do you fear tears or rips? How careful to you need to be with it? The canadian version is 14 lbs lighter than US 12', and 17lbs lighter for 14'.  How careful do you need to be?

Darren the KC has a layout a little more friendly for second person, the seat can be pushed way back and another added up front, but point well taken on tightness.

 

 

After getting used to the trolling motor, I doubt you'll be leaving it home much.  On flat, calm days you'll do fine.  But on breezy days you're going to spend more time paddling to hold position, unless you anchor, or use a good size wind anchor.

You an also back it into the shoreline vegetation to hold it in place, but it's you'll still spend less time casting when you do not use the trolling motor.

I've had the trolling motor fizzle out.  It only took a few minutes to appreciate how much of an advantage it actually provided.

If you're going to mix exercise with fishing, that's one thing.  But if you're primarily interested in fishing, you cannot beat the trolling motor.

[YourBassIsGrass]

If you are looking at the sportspal you will definitely want to go bigger than the 12 for two people. I have the s-15 and am happy with the size and stability. I can shoulder the canoe myself and when I had a car was able to cartop without issue. At 67lbs it isn't light, but it is more than manageable. I am only 5'9" 150lbs. 

As for paddling...if you are going solo, yes it is a pig. However, they do sell the oar lock pins that turn the paddles into oars and you can sit in the center to row the boat. They have those on all their models too so even then s-14 and s-12 can be turned into row boats. I have not purchased those as I too went directly to a trolling motor setup and use that almost 100% of the time. I had a trolling motor die on me last year and my brother-in-law and I paddled about 6 miles round trip through the day. It wasn't fast by any means, but it went where we pointed it and got us to the fish.

Durability, still to be seen. I have had it for one season and so far I have some scrapes with missing paint. I have bumped into standing timber and things while being pushed by current/wind and have zero dents. I am careful with it and don't foresee any serious issues with it. The only real differences other than weight between the sportspal and radisson are the number of sheets used to form the canoe, the keels and the thickness. I don't have any seat time in a radisson to give my 2 cents though.