Cecil The Lion

[the reel ess]

I almost never hunt. But I have no moral issues with it and I'm not trying to disparage it. I'm just not into it. 

 

What are some opinions of the hunters on this board regarding the dentist who shot the lion in Zimbabwe? Was it legal-I know he paid for the privilege. If so, do you think it's moral? Is it necessary to thin the lion population? Do natives eat the meat? Do you have a problem with people killing the king of the jungle?

 

Just curious what hunters think of the issue.

[Bluebasser86]

I have no problem with lion hunting, but the way they went about it sounded very unethical to me. Not only dragging a bait to get it out of the area where it was protected, but then taking 40 hours from the initial shot until the finishing shot tells me it was a very poorly placed arrow to begin with. Most likely that lion only had a year or two left in his life, and usually their end is much more gruesome, but the people who are worked up to a froth over the deal don't care about that.

[clayton86]

It's the pro hunters faults in my opinion yes the dentist shot it but them guides/pro hunters do all the work and tell you what you can and cannot shoot. I haven't read up on the ordeal for all the details just heard little snippets on the radio and TV. I'm gonna end it there before it gets political and what not as I think there are some other issues that this is overshadowing and people need better priorities then to get worked up over a lion in Africa that does not affect us one bit and there are issues here in our soil that does affect us.

[DogBone_384]

I hunt deer. Personally I won't kill anything I won't eat. Killing Cecil, to me is wrong, but rules don't seem to apply a whole lot anymore.

Different strokes for different folks.

[the reel ess]

If the pics weren't posted in social media we would never have heard of this.

 

How often are deer lured from one place to another with food plots or even corn on the ground to be killed?

[the reel ess]

I hunt deer. Personally I won't kill anything I won't eat.

Yeah. Nugent says the locals eat that meat. But I've always felt like that about hunting. If you won't eat it, you shouldn't shoot it. The locals would probably prefer he shot something with hooves if he's going to give it away.

[F14A-B]

I haven't dove into all the details, however what I know is, it seems this was anything but hunting.

Killing is more the truth.. Simply put they have been trying to hide every action ( they = hunting party/guides) and the hunter/dentist is on the run.

Seems open & shut to me.. That is NOT hunting.

I'm a hunter, of free ranging truly wild animals in accordance with law. I support hunting & hunters. This is anything but hunting. Anyone remember Noel Feather?

[gardnerjigman]

I have no problem with lion hunting, but the way they went about it sounded very unethical to me. Not only dragging a bait to get it out of the area where it was protected, but then taking 40 hours from the initial shot until the finishing shot tells me it was a very poorly placed arrow to begin with. Most likely that lion only had a year or two left in his life, and usually their end is much more gruesome, but the people who are worked up to a froth over the deal don't care about that.

Totally agree. Was it ethical? Not at all. Will I lose sleep over it? Not at all. A killed protected lion doesn't affect me in the least and I'm surprised/disappointed at the attention/outrage this is bringing out. We have people buying and selling kids, drugs, etc in our cities, I'm sure we can find better things to focus our efforts on.

[Bluebasser86]

Yeah. Nugent says the locals eat that meat. But I've always felt like that about hunting. If you won't eat it, you shouldn't shoot it. The locals would probably prefer he shot something with hooves if he's going to give it away.

Having grown up in the position of depending on what you shoot to have something to eat, they may "prefer" one over the other, but if the third option is going hungry you'll eat whatever you can get. 

[TwoCan]

It doesn't sound like it was ethical but really, who the h*** cares? I can tell you surely people in Zimbabwe don't care. They have one of the most corrupt governments on the planet, most people don't know what clean water is, most of you third-world problems. A dead lion is the least of their problems. Here's the synopsis; the lion is cute, it looks cuddly, therefore we shouldn't kill it. Why don't people fuss over the hundreds of thousands of fish that are filleted every year? Because they're not cute.

 

The conspiracy theorist in me has another thought as to why this is such a big deal, but that's a conversation to have over a beer.

[Lund Explorer]

Bwana spends Fifty Thousand Dollars to have someone else bring a lion within range of his bow and arrow, by any means, and then he blows the shot.  Throwing all of the legal issues aside, I have to wonder if this guy planned to have a full skin mount made to hang in his trophy room, just so he could relive the thrill of his great hunt, and brag to his friends of his hunting prowess. 

 

Seeing as how this guy's reputation is now as dead as Cecil is, any other problems he gets is simply salt in the wound!  <pun intended>

[SirSnookalot]

Zimbabwe claims the lion was easily recognizable, professional hunters should have known that.  The government claims the hunt was illegal, when in another country one must play by their rules regardless of what the opinion of how the government is run.  Zimbabwe is attempting to extradite Palmer for trial.

 

This is not a situation of culling the deer population encroaching on expanding civilization.  Not an act of saving the animals from starvation or are they man eaters going into villages.  Nor is it any kind of humanitarian effort to feed people, $50,000. buys a lot of cattle.  The park generates over 1mil in tourist activity, Cecil was a main attraction.   These hunts are for pure pleasure and trophy hunting.  Conservation, more like reducing the population of exotic animals.  There was a hunt for a black rhino at $350,000, not many of them left in the wild.

 

Kind of amazing how people will caress a 2# bass like it's the only fish in the world,  then slaughter an animal and let it die a slow death.  This lion was wounded, then 40 hours later was finished off.

On these hunts I'm always rooting for the lion to win, a real man would be going 2 out 3 falls hand to hand combat with Simba.  

[Thornback]

The killing of Cecil has generated a lot of news and a lot of controversy. We need to step back and ask ourselves a few questions to get a better perspective. Would the lion be in the news if it didn't have a name? Did the dentist know he was breaking any laws? Should the dentist's practice be destroyed because he killed the lion? Did you know in the wild other lions will kill lion cubs? Did you know in the wild hyenas will kill and eat lions? Do you recognize that lions are not on equal with humans? Did you know lions will fight each other and brutally kill each other? Did you know a lion in the wild will live about 10 to 12 years? Did you know lions have killed humans? IMO the dentist and his guides should pay a fine and let the incident be over. No one should go to jail and no one should lose their ability to earn a living.

[gardnerjigman]

The killing of Cecil has generated a lot of news and a lot of controversy. We need to step back and ask ourselves a few questions to get a better perspective. Would the lion be in the news if it didn't have a name? Did the dentist know he was breaking any laws? Should the dentist's practice be destroyed because he killed the lion? Did you know in the wild other lions will kill lion cubs? Did you know in the wild hyenas will kill and eat lions? Do you recognize that lions are not on equal with humans? Did you know lions will fight each other and brutally kill each other? Did you know a lion in the wild will live about 10 to 12 years? Did you know lions have killed humans? IMO the dentist and his guides should pay a fine and let the incident be over. No one should go to jail and no one should lose their ability to earn a living.

.

Totally agree.

[Dwight Hottle]

Never under estimate the power of social media.

[AdamsEye]

This whole topic just ticks me right off, I care far more about all the veterans who need help, the poor children in America getting a second rate education, and don't get me started with politics lol!

 

It's sad to see facebook explode with such compassion over a lion half way across the world, while the same people IGNORE the problems we face here at home.

I find it to be revealing of why America is morally bankrupt.

[Catch 22]

This whole topic just ticks me right off, I care far more about all the veterans who need help, the poor children in America getting a second rate education, and don't get me started with politics lol!

 

It's sad to see facebook explode with such compassion over a lion half way across the world, while the same people IGNORE the problems we face here at home.

I find it to be revealing of why America is morally bankrupt.

 

 

Totally  agree.

 

How many of those hacks would be in line to help  a human being that was killed.

 

Zimbabwe reaps millions and millions from permits to kill big game. Goggle their guides and look at the expenses  involved.People act like its the  first and only lion that has been killed by a hunter.If anyone should be punished and chastised, the guides  need to take the hit which they have  so far.

I keep hearing that the USA/Zimbabwe relations are strained. I guess we didn`t send them enough aid?

 

C22

[F14A-B]

All this talk about lions made me dig thru my DVD collection and watch "Ghost & the Darkness"

It stars Michael Douglas & Val Kilmer.. Based on a true story, mounts of the devil pair of male lions are on display in Chicago...

[Fun4Me]

When are we going to see the food this lion produced?

 

Lion is the fruit of the jungle.

You can BBQ it

Boil it

Broil it

Bake it

Saute it

There's Lion kebabs

Lion creole

Lion gumbo

Pan fried 

Deep fried

Stir-fry

There's Pineapple lion

Lemon lion

Coconut lion

Pepper lion

Lion soup

Lion stew

Lion salad

Lion and potatoes

Lion burger

Lion sandwich

 

That's...that's about it

[Catch 22]

Fun4me.lmao

 

I`d like to try some lion spare ribs with Sweet Baby Ray sauce. 

 

This one probably fell off the charts.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtxPdkzmk_4

[Joe H.]

Glad to see everyone is on the same page as me.

[Bluebasser86]

I wonder how many of the people screaming about this lion have any idea how many animals are killed in miles long snare lions by poachers in Africa each year? None of them are lining up to go help those animals. I guess it's like so many of the Hollywood stars here where you get special treatment just because you're well known? 

 

I'm with AdamsEye though, so many other issues in this world and a lion is what people choose to get worked up about? Really? What about all the kids dying of starvation and disease in Africa because of simple things like not having clean water to drink? Or our vets that come home after serving their country and then need their countries help, only to get snubbed on the benefits they were promised. So many things that they should be upset about but instead it's a lion that they'll forget about as soon as the media quits running stories about it 

[SirSnookalot]

There are many injustices through out the world that do need much more attention than they are getting, I'll stick on this topic. 

This lion was lured out of a protected park, any big game hunter and the guides employed would know this.  There isn't much wiggle room, they committed a crime and it's hard to believe they didn't know they were doing it.  The numbers of these animals are shrinking, there are less than 30,000 lions left in the wild.  What a lion does in the wild is nature, has nothing to do with this event.  It's one thing for a government to approve a legal hunt, an illegal hunt is another matter, we cannot control what other governments do.

Many don't seem to care because these crimes are happening on foreign soil.  When it happens here we get outraged, fish being caught out season, size and bag limits disregarded, and over fishing.  An example is Atlantic cod, it's been fished vastly over fished along many other species.  Do we all care, probably not if we don't target those fish as recreational endeavor.  Much of our own personal attitude towards fish conservation is totally self serving, if it isn't a bass it doesn't matter, I think it does.

I have nothing against hunting whether for sport or survival, what Palmer did was neither.  What he did was a commit a blatant crime, there are legal hunts but opted not to go that route.  I can't cut him any slack just because it happened thousands of miles away.

[gardnerjigman]

 "It is deeply distressing that the media hype of the situation is being taken to such levels of sensationalism and we strongly urge who ever is pursuing these avenues to desist from such deplorable actions."

 

Taken straight from the Zimbabwe Parks & Wildlife Management Authorities Website. 

 

Also interesting to read that 4 elephants were killed by cyanide poisoning in the salt licks... also killing a cape turtle dove, a sand grouse and a vulture. 

 

Stop the madness! We should immediatly set up a 1-800 fund them account so they can spend it all on investigating people and making sure the animals are well cared for... Not like there are disease and famine running through the children there... 

 

[StratDude]

The first thing wrong with this is that they have attempted to humanize a wild animal. It eats other animals that it catches. Simple.

And when the guides put the bait out to lure a lion in, they have no way of knowing which lion will come to the bait. Sorry SirSnoookalot, but you make it sound like they knew what his favorite meal was, and prepared it for him so he would be the only one tempted by the smell. The "protected park" was described as not having a perimeter fence around it, which is common for that area due to the large tracts of land.. Try fencing in that much land...

Guides in that area have been using bait sites for years to harvest/hunt/kill lions. It's not a new trend in Zimbabwe that was just recently discovered.

They kill an animal for baiting purposes, hang it over the back of a vehicle with the entrails dangling to put down a scent trail, then drive for a determined distance. Then they hang the bait animal from a tree at the site where they plan/hope to kill the lion..

Seems a lot like how some deer hunters do here in the US.. Either drag a scented rag with estrus doe urine on it, hang it from a limb, and wait nearby for a buck in rut to investigate the scent trail.... OR... Hang a feeder full of corn from a tree and sit in ambush nearby...

It was a lion.. It was shot... Obviously it was a bad hit... But they did manage to find it and finish it off. I'm sure no one just takes off tracking a wounded lion the same way they would track a wounded deer.. Huge difference..

The media has also emphasized the fact that Cecil was wearing a collar.. Big deal. They have also emphasized that his mane was noticeably darker and thicker than the other adult male lions in the area.. That's how he was so easily recognized.. So, if his mane is darker and thicker than the other males', and the shot took place in low light conditions, which has been stated, how could the collar have been visible? A tracking collar fits tight, much different than a necklace worn by a celebrity flashing their BLING..

Think about it...