Wolfie Posted July 13, 2015 Posted July 13, 2015 Ok so I was pre fishing a tourny saturday and ran into a local slamming fish, good fish too he told me he was texas rigging a kinky beaver in deep weeds (10-18')and told me the color with an 1/8 oz tungsten weight so all I had was a sweet beaver which is similar in profile but different and less apendages and a 1/4oz tungsten weight I caught a few fish 4 my avg was about 3.25lbs good fish for up here in michigan. But in those weeds i had a terrible time distinquishing bites from weeds anyone got any tips? I talked to the guy later he told me he worked at the tackle store up the road so i stopped on my way out and he was there he figures I got a lot less bites because of the different bait he says kinky beaver does 10 fold better than the sweet beaver and the weight. I fish jigs usually skipping docks on a baitcaster so I watch line and try to feel but in those deep weeds I feel lost. Any help would be much appreciated sorry Quote
Super User A-Jay Posted July 13, 2015 Super User Posted July 13, 2015 Hello and Welcome to Bass Resource ~ Hard to say from here what the whole deal is / was but the lighter weight (1/8 oz) may allow a bait to lay on top of the vegetation instead of burying all up in it. Also I'd be using braided line. A-Jay 2 Quote
Wolfie Posted July 13, 2015 Author Posted July 13, 2015 Why braid over flouro? What pound test? Its clear up here 5-6' visibility also how do you know if your snagged on weeds or got a bite? Quote
Super User RoLo Posted July 13, 2015 Super User Posted July 13, 2015 Welcome to the forums Wolfie, I concur with A-Jay, which is to say, the difference in weight may be more significant than the difference between a Sweet Beaver and Kinky Beaver. Why braid over fluoro? I'll enter that debate via the low road: "Why fluoro over braid?" Roger 1 Quote
papajoe222 Posted July 13, 2015 Posted July 13, 2015 I, also welcome you. A-Jay is right on the money about the weight. The 1/8oz. was just enough to give his kinky beaver a slower fall and keep it on top of the weeds. Your sweet beaver has more plastic and combined with the heavier weight was both falling faster and likely penetrating at least the tops of the weeds. When it comes to distinguishing bites from weeds, try this. Hold your rod tip between 11:00 & 12:00 and use your reel to move the bait short distances. A weed will transmit slow resistance that increases as you reel. A bite will either be a tap (or multiple taps), loss of contact with the bait, or just a heavy, mushy feeling. 1 Quote
Wolfie Posted July 13, 2015 Author Posted July 13, 2015 Welcome to the forums Wolfie, I concur with A-Jay, which is to say, the difference in weight may be more significant than the difference between a Sweet Beaver and Kinky Beaver. Why braid over fluoro? I'll enter that debate via the low road: "Why fluoro over braid?" Roger Thanks for the welcoming as far as flouro over braid it seems to me flouro is more sensitive on slack and due to water clarity also with a light weight like that im afraid braid wont have the right fall Quote
Super User Darren. Posted July 13, 2015 Super User Posted July 13, 2015 Welcome aboard, mate! 1 Quote
Wolfie Posted July 13, 2015 Author Posted July 13, 2015 I, also welcome you. A-Jay is right on the money about the weight. The 1/8oz. was just enough to give his kinky beaver a slower fall and keep it on top of the weeds. Your sweet beaver has more plastic and combined with the heavier weight was both falling faster and likely penetrating at least the tops of the weeds. When it comes to distinguishing bites from weeds, try this. Hold your rod tip between 11:00 & 12:00 and use your reel to move the bait short distances. A weed will transmit slow resistance that increases as you reel. A bite will either be a tap (or multiple taps), loss of contact with the bait, or just a heavy, mushy feeling. Sounds good thanks for the welcoming I'll give it a shot I am pretty new to bass been fishing about 4 yrs is there a rod you recomend for this technique? I have 3 to choose from that i own already erither a crucial worm and jig 6'9" a duckett ghost 7'mh or quantum smoke 7'mh ? I need as much help with this as i can I have a tourny there next week saturday Quote
Super User A-Jay Posted July 13, 2015 Super User Posted July 13, 2015 Why braid over flouro? What pound test? Its clear up here 5-6' visibility also how do you know if your snagged on weeds or got a bite? I'm in MI as well (Otsego County) and the vis here is alway twice that. The Braid choice for me is a personal preference that revolves around the fact that it floats, has No Stretch, & Cuts through the weeds. A-Jay Quote
Wolfie Posted July 13, 2015 Author Posted July 13, 2015 I'm in MI as well (Otsego County) and the vis here is alway twice that. The Braid choice for me is a personal preference that revolves around the fact that it floats, has No Stretch, & Cuts through the weeds. A-Jay Got ya thank you any rod recomendations from the ones i asked above? Quote
Super User RoLo Posted July 13, 2015 Super User Posted July 13, 2015 Thanks for the welcoming as far as flouro over braid it seems to me flouro is more sensitive on slack and due to water clarity also with a light weight like that im afraid braid wont have the right fall "Sink Rate" is governed primarily by Line Diameter rather than Line Density (an angler who trolls is the best source of information). The following is based on a large-scale study performed by Tackletour: 1) Braided line is virtually non-stretch 2) Fluorocarbon stretches a lot, and the difference in stretch between nylon and fluorocarbon is inconsequential. In fact, some brands of fluoro stretch more than some brands of nylon ("nylon" is commonly referred to as "mono") 3) Due to lower water-resistance, fine line offers a more natural delivery than fat line (braid is a fine line; fluoro is a fat line) 4) Fluorocarbon line is susceptible to ruptures & fracturing, hence "Low Knot Strength" (not so braid) Finally, the angling world should really compare "abrasion-resistance" based on an equal volume of material. Comparing the abrasion-resistance of fat line to the abrasion-resistance of fine line is not a fair comparison. Roger 2 Quote
Wolfie Posted July 13, 2015 Author Posted July 13, 2015 "Sink Rate" is governed primarily by Line Diameter rather than Line Density (an angler who trolls is the best source of information). The following is based on a large-scale study performed by Tackletour: 1) Braided line is virtually non-stretch 2) Fluorocarbon stretches a lot, and the difference in stretch between nylon and fluorocarbon is inconsequential. In fact, the difference in stretch between different brands is greater than the difference between fluoro and nylon 3) Braid is a fine diameter line that provides the most natural delivery. Fluorocarbon is a fat diameter line 4) Fluorocarbon is susceptible to ruptures and fracturing, hence "Low Knot Strength" (not so braid) Finally, the angling world needs to compare "abrasion-resistance" based on an equitable volume of line material. Differently put, comparing the abrasion-resistance of a fat line to the abrasion-resistance of a fine line is grossly disparate. Roger Ok but would you worry about fish seeing it thats my main concern is visibility of the fish seeing it Quote
Flippin4Biggins Posted July 13, 2015 Posted July 13, 2015 Ok so I was pre fishing a tourny saturday and ran into a local slamming fish, good fish too he told me he was texas rigging a kinky beaver in deep weeds (10-18')and told me the color with an 1/8 oz tungsten weight so all I had was a sweet beaver which is similar in profile but different and less apendages and a 1/4oz tungsten weight I caught a few fish 4 my avg was about 3.25lbs good fish for up here in michigan. But in those weeds i had a terrible time distinquishing bites from weeds anyone got any tips? I talked to the guy later he told me he worked at the tackle store up the road so i stopped on my way out and he was there he figures I got a lot less bites because of the different bait he says kinky beaver does 10 fold better than the sweet beaver and the weight. I fish jigs usually skipping docks on a baitcaster so I watch line and try to feel but in those deep weeds I feel lost. Any help would be much appreciated sorry I believe it.... I start with a 3/8 jig most of the time and nothing heavier unless wind is an issue. But most of the time I find myself throwing a 5/16 and just rail fish and it's always on the fall Quote
Super User RoLo Posted July 13, 2015 Super User Posted July 13, 2015 Ok but would you worry about fish seeing it thats my main concern is visibility of the fish seeing it Fish in the tuna family..YES (bluefin, yellowfin, bonito, albacore ~ ~). Largemouth bass..NO Smallmouth Bass..I yield the floor to Dwight Hottle ;-) Roger Quote
Super User Catt Posted July 13, 2015 Super User Posted July 13, 2015 I'm in MI as well (Otsego County) and the vis here is alway twice that. The Braid choice for me is a personal preference that revolves around the fact that it floats, has No Stretch, & Cuts through the weeds. A-Jay Welcome, add to the above your Curcial & you're good to! The biggest mistake newbies make is they try to force the t-rig through grass, ya gotta finessee it through. When you fell the t-rig load up in the grass stop! Apply pressure with you rod & shake the tip & allow the bullet weight to nose itself through. If you try to force it through it'll only dig in. As for feeling bites, pay attention to your line, if you cast in 12' & your rig only fall 8', ya got bit on the fall. Or if ya cast into 12' & it takes 15' to reach bottom the bass is swimming with it. I can add plenty more on that subject! 1 Quote
kingmotorboat Posted July 13, 2015 Posted July 13, 2015 Welcome, add to the above your Curcial & you're good to! The biggest mistake newbies make is they try to force the t-rig through grass, ya gotta finessee it through. When you fell the t-rig load up in the grass stop! Apply pressure with you rod & shake the tip & allow the bullet weight to nose itself through. If you try to force it through it'll only dig in. As for feeling bites, pay attention to your line, if you cast in 12' & your rig only fall 8', ya got bit on the fall. Or if ya cast into 12' & it takes 15' to reach bottom the bass is swimming with it. I can add plenty more on that subject! Catt may I ask how are you able to distinguish the distance it has fell? Quote
Super User Catt Posted July 13, 2015 Super User Posted July 13, 2015 Catt may I ask how are you able to distinguish the distance it has fell? Y'all don't your worm down? Cast into a known depth & count 1 thousand 1, 1 thousand 2, ect! Quote
Wolfie Posted July 13, 2015 Author Posted July 13, 2015 Welcome, add to the above your Curcial & you're good to! The biggest mistake newbies make is they try to force the t-rig through grass, ya gotta finessee it through. When you fell the t-rig load up in the grass stop! Apply pressure with you rod & shake the tip & allow the bullet weight to nose itself through. If you try to force it through it'll only dig in. As for feeling bites, pay attention to your line, if you cast in 12' & your rig only fall 8', ya got bit on the fall. Or if ya cast into 12' & it takes 15' to reach bottom the bass is swimming with it. I can add plenty more on that subject! Otsego is not to far from me im from hudsonville my thing is if im dragging it threw the weedsa and all of a sudden it feels stuck how do you know its stuck in a weed or a fishes mouth I think I can win this tournament if this bite holds good for another 2 weeks but I need to figure out if im getting bit and missing it I only had 4 fish and had a 12.8 bag by myself saturday one small fish 2.15 Quote
Wolfie Posted July 13, 2015 Author Posted July 13, 2015 Y'all don't your worm down? 1/4 oz weight, 3/0 hook, & typical 6" worm falls about a foot a second. So your counting this in your head? Quote
kingmotorboat Posted July 13, 2015 Posted July 13, 2015 Y'all don't your worm down? 1/4 oz weight, 3/0 hook, & typical 6" worm falls about a foot a second. No I never have usually I throw lighter than 1/4 or drastically higher depending on the cover. Quote
Super User Catt Posted July 13, 2015 Super User Posted July 13, 2015 Question #1: set hook Question #2: yes Quote
kingmotorboat Posted July 13, 2015 Posted July 13, 2015 Question #1: set hook Question #2: yes Usually setting the hook in doubt is my go to. I may look like an idiot but I'm going to look like an idiot catching Quote
Super User MIbassyaker Posted July 13, 2015 Super User Posted July 13, 2015 I'm also in MI, but farther south than A-Jay. Most of the lakes I fish have about 5-6 foot visibility, some twice that or more. I frequently use up to 50lb braid around weeds and I have no problem getting bass to strike lures tied on directly. I think about it this way: bass that live around weeds are surrounded by all kinds of stalks, stems, tendrils and other fibers of vegetation. They hunt food in and around and through this stuff every day. To them, even if they see fishing line, it probably just registers as another tendril of vegetation that's in the way. 1 Quote
Super User Catt Posted July 13, 2015 Super User Posted July 13, 2015 Sorry I changed my answer on y'all 1/4 oz - 1' per second I count t-rigs & jigs down, it's something I learned years ago, it tells me if I've been bitten on the fall or if the bass is swimming with it. It is two bites where you may not feel or see anything. Quote
kingmotorboat Posted July 13, 2015 Posted July 13, 2015 I'm also in MI, but farther south than A-Jay. Most of the lakes I fish have about 5-6 foot visibility, some twice that or more. I frequently use up to 50lb braid around weeds and I have no problem getting bass to strike lures tied on directly. I think about it this way: bass that live in weeds are surrounded by all kinds of stalks, stems, tendrils and other fibers of vegetation. They hunt food in and through this stuff every day. To them, even if they see fishing line, it probably just registers as another tendril of vegetation that's in the way. I'm not a believer in bass being spooked by line ever. Reason being if they can't see a hook I don't expect them to see a line or a sinker or for that matter really care. Sorry I got off track here Quote
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