Line Issues

[S. Sass]

I bought a Lews MR1Sh from of all places Walmart. I practiced with it in my yard for 2 weeks using Stren 12lb no problems. I used different weight dummy lures and all testing because I am a rookie on baitcasting. Ok so Friday I know I am going to a place with heavy moss and all kinds of cover and I say to myself I sure would like to refill this spool before I go fishing. Admittedly I had 2 birdsnests I could not get out and had to cut and it was not completely full to start with from what I have read. I was well below the beveled edge with only 125 yards on it. So anyway I go to Walmart (I live in a small town BassPro is 2hr drive) and look at all the line and it appears the only 150 yard braid is some SpiderWire Stealth Glow-Vis Braid 50lb test. OK I read and read and see how to spool braid and I put it on. I make sure to load the spool as I have read and its looking awesome nice and even on the spool but its dark by now outside and i cant test it. 

 

This is where the fun starts. We leave early Saturday morning and get to the pools I start by setting my reel and everything is fine I cast probably 2hrs with it no issues. Then I switch to a spinnerbait and make the appropriate settings and now its a nightmare. Not every time but random maybe every 3rd or 4th cast the line starts coming off good but then mid cast its making a mess of the spool then it finishes by unwinding the mess before the lure hits the water. Obviously not every time does it complete the cast as the "mess" sometimes turns into a birdsnest depending on the random way the line balls up in the reel. My fishing partner who uses baitcast was stumped as well. He tried it with no luck either. We played with every setting tightening loosening different lures try to change the weight to see how it effected it. I bet we spent 45 minutes to an  hour just trying to fix my reel. I was so disgusted. Does anyone have any ideas?

 

I was so ready to toss the reel in the pool but I just bought this Mojo Bass rod and this reel I didn't want to toss $160 that was on its first tip just yet. I mean I was casting 40 yards just beautiful for a couple a hours before what happened? I haven't given up but this sure didn't help my ego. haha

[d-camarena]

Either your line dug into itself, or your tension knob is to loose and you need to adjust it or your brakesp

[d-camarena]

But i think you line dug into itself. Were you throwing heavy lures at one piont?

[Jon G]

I also think your line was digging in. Just start peeling some line off until you feel the dig in "come free"

[Turtle135]

The other posters may be right about the line digging in but it sounds to me that part of the issue is that you are depending more on the setting the brake controls than allowing your educated thumb to control small over-runs during the cast.

 

I never re-adjust any brake settings when I switch from one lure to the next. I have been fishing with level winds since 1980. Reels today are much easier to cast due to better engineering but your thumb is still an integral part of getting the most from your baitcaster.

[papajoe222]

Like turtle, I rarely adjust the tension settings on my baitcasters. Then again, most are technique specific, so I'm throwing basically the same thing. I do have a new reel with 30lb. Stealth that I have to constantly adjust the tension a bit tighter on, especially with lures with more wind resistance like buzzers.

Some reels are like that, I guess.

[AdamsEye]

If you were casting well, and the line still flared my hunch is the line was going on the reel to slack/limp.

 

What were you throwing before the spinner bait, and what kind of winds were you fishing?

[blckshirt98]

I'm guessing he switched from a heavy/aerodynamic bait that keeps it's speed fairly constant throughout with a parabolic trajectory, to a lighter spinnerbait that's hitting a lot of air drag midway through the cast and dropping, like a hockey stick trajectory.  Once you see the spinnerbait slow down and start to fall, thumb the spool to keep it from nesting.

[WRB]

Spinnerbaits, like buzz baits, have a lot of wind resistance due to the blades catching air in mid flight and the lure slows down fast. What happens is the reel spool doesn't slow down fast enough and a backlash results.

Train your thumb to keep the spooled line from springing off the spool by keeping the thumb about 1/16" above the spool after releasing thumb pressure to make the cast.

The other alternative is use the spool tension knob to increase braking by tightening it where the lure falls with slight tension, not a free fall. This will reduce casting distance a little and help prevent back lashing.

You don't need to pick out a backlash by pulling off line after getting a birds nest. What you do is this; put your thumb on birds nest loose spool line and wind the line back onto the reel keeping thumb pressure on the spool.

After the lure back, now put the reel into free spool and pull line off with light thumb pressure until you are past any loops or loose line. You may need to pull out a few loops, do that easy and slowly. No more cutting out a backlash.

Tom

[S. Sass]

But i think you line dug into itself. Were you throwing heavy lures at one piont?

 

 

I also think your line was digging in. Just start peeling some line off until you feel the dig in "come free"

Well initially that was our thought but after numerous times of peeling line each time going further and further into the spool thinking its back to nice wound line and getting the same result we dropped that notion.

 

The other posters may be right about the line digging in but it sounds to me that part of the issue is that you are depending more on the setting the brake controls than allowing your educated thumb to control small over-runs during the cast.

 

I never re-adjust any brake settings when I switch from one lure to the next. I have been fishing with level winds since 1980. Reels today are much easier to cast due to better engineering but your thumb is still an integral part of getting the most from your baitcaster.

 

 

Like turtle, I rarely adjust the tension settings on my baitcasters. Then again, most are technique specific, so I'm throwing basically the same thing. I do have a new reel with 30lb. Stealth that I have to constantly adjust the tension a bit tighter on, especially with lures with more wind resistance like buzzers.

Some reels are like that, I guess.

OK I am a rookie so bear with me. What are you calling the "brake control"? The blue knob beside the handle?

So far in my limited use I have found that I really don't move the blue knob. But I don't know the exact weights on the lures I use so I just do the little drop test to make sure its not way off. Of course I have yet to tie on a worm and I know that will be different.  I understand using your thumb but this is like crazy if I keep thumbing it enough to stop this I will kill any distance because this is not a minor little over run. At least this is the way i see it. Applying my thumb as a brake in the middle of the cast hard enough to stop the blowup I am having is not going to fare well with any distance.

If you were casting well, and the line still flared my hunch is the line was going on the reel to slack/limp.

 

What were you throwing before the spinner bait, and what kind of winds were you fishing?

I thought that as well so I made a specific effort that the line went back on the reel with some resistance. Not making it dig in. I mean I made sure the line was taught to the lure by raising my pole or stepping back before i started reeling line back on. I still got the same result. 

 

I'm guessing he switched from a heavy/aerodynamic bait that keeps it's speed fairly constant throughout with a parabolic trajectory, to a lighter spinnerbait that's hitting a lot of air drag midway through the cast and dropping, like a hockey stick trajectory.  Once you see the spinnerbait slow down and start to fall, thumb the spool to keep it from nesting.

I started out throwing the 3" 5/8oz Spro Aruku Shad I had zero issues with it as I stated before. Then I went to a 1/2 oz Spinner bait with the KVD Jr Chunk. This worked fine for about 15 minutes and then the issues started. So I went up in size to a 3/4 oz Spinnerbait and the issues continued. I cant imagine it is when the spinnerbait starts to slow down. This is doing the nesting when the lure hasn't made it 30 feet. The lure should still be sailing full speed at that point? 

[S. Sass]

Spinnerbaits, like buzz baits, have a lot of wind resistance due to the blades catching air in mid flight and the lure slows down fast. What happens is the reel spool doesn't slow down fast enough and a backlash results.

Train your thumb to keep the spooled line from springing off the spool by keeping the thumb about 1/16" above the spool after releasing thumb pressure to make the cast.

The other alternative is use the spool tension knob to increase braking by tightening it where the lure falls with slight tension, not a free fall. This will reduce casting distance a little and help prevent back lashing.

You don't need to pick out a backlash by pulling off line after getting a birds nest. What you do is this; put your thumb on birds nest loose spool line and wind the line back onto the reel keeping thumb pressure on the spool.

After the lure back, now put the reel into free spool and pull line off with light thumb pressure until you are past any loops or loose line. You may need to pull out a few loops, do that easy and slowly. No more cutting out a backlash.

Tom

Yeah I understand but these lures were not that far off the tip of the rod possibly 20 feet maybe even 30 feet and as hard as I was throwing they shouldn't have been slowing down at all. There was a ever so slight breeze and it want even constant. I didn't consider it a factor as it might have registered a 1 or maybe possibly a 2 mph for a split second and I wasn't throwing into the breeze. I will listen to all the thumb ideas and practice them but like I said my friend who uses baitcast reels for years couldn't cast it either. So I was thinking it was more a mechanical thing not a person thing.

 

Do you think line twist might cause this? I was throwing long casts with the Spro all morning with zero issues are lip less crankbaits known to twist line?  I know I am reaching but either something broke in that reel or I have the weird issue of the year going on.

[Turtle135]

By adjusting the brakes on your baitcaster I meant adjusting spool tension (see #1 in the photo below) and the magnetic brake system (see #2 in the photo below). After some practice you will develop a very light touch with the thumb, just the right amount to prevent any over-run but not so much to kill your distance. As you develop that "educated thumb" you will begin the set your reel much more wide open on the spool tension and brakes.

 

[smalljaw67]

Yeah I understand but these lures were not that far off the tip of the rod possibly 20 feet maybe even 30 feet and as hard as I was throwing they shouldn't have been slowing down at all. There was a ever so slight breeze and it want even constant. I didn't consider it a factor as it might have registered a 1 or maybe possibly a 2 mph for a split second and I wasn't throwing into the breeze. I will listen to all the thumb ideas and practice them but like I said my friend who uses baitcast reels for years couldn't cast it either. So I was thinking it was more a mechanical thing not a person thing.

 

Do you think line twist might cause this? I was throwing long casts with the Spro all morning with zero issues are lip less crankbaits known to twist line?  I know I am reaching but either something broke in that reel or I have the weird issue of the year going on.

 

WRB is exactly right, the spinnerbait catching air is what was causing a lot of your problem, remember, you said that you didn't think it was slowing down enough to do anything, it doesn't take but a tiny bit of resistance and the next thing you know the spool is turning faster than the lure is pulling line and you have a backlash. There is a second part to your problem, and that is the line going back on the spool, remember, you  said you were fine for about 2 hours, what happens is you put the line on your reel, and it was braid and you had some tension on the line to spool it up, right? Well after casting and retrieving, the line is now looser on the spool than it was, and then you take a spinnerbait, that is notorious for catching wind and the next thing you know you have a disaster. There are ways to counteract this, and the best way is the sidearm roll cast, it isn't meant for distance, it is meant for accuracy and that cast keeps the bait low with a nice easy casting motion, the other way is to learn to use your thumb and that will require practice. You learned the basic operation of a casting reel, now you need to learn to use it. Start off in the yard and make the cast like you know how to and then begin by backing off the brakes, not the spool tension, and then use your thumb to feather the line coming off the spool, it will take a little but you'll get it.

[S. Sass]

That all sounds good but it doesn't explain why a avid baitcast user was having the same exact issues I was having with it. I handed it to him and he was like most here kind of thinking it was user error. I am not saying some of it isn't user error but when it started kicking his butt he quit messing with me about how I wasn't holding my tongue right. He gave up on it and thought something was wrong with the reel.

 

The good thing is the sidearm roll cast you speak of is the only cast I learned. I only cast like that because it was simple and on videos I was told it prevented backlash the best. Me being the chicken of backlashes I learned that method.

 

I will double check the line to make sure its not to loose and practice more and see what happens. Thanks for all the advise everyone. 

[Turtle135]

One last thing to consider. If you were having good success with the Stren it might make your learning curve less steep if you go back to using that line for a while. If problem crops up again with that line then there may be a mechanical problem with the reel. If you have an old reel you can roll the braid onto that so you could reuse the braid somewhere down the road.

 

Good luck! don't ditch that combo just yet

 

p.s. - 12, 14 or 17 pound test monofilament line might be the way to go for starters, it is a more forgiving line than fluoro or braid and is relatively inexpensive, that strength mono is a good fit for lipless cranks and spinnerbaits

[blckshirt98]

Another thing to try is try switching lures back to the Aruku Shad.  If it casts with no problems then you know it's not the line digging into the spool and it's the spinnerbait.  If you're still having a tough time adjusting your cast or finding the right settings on your reel to keep the backlashes from occuring, you might want to use a spinning outfit for your spinnerbaits.  No shame in that, especially if it means more time fishing and less time messing around with your gear.

[S. Sass]

Yeah I had already wished I had tied the Aruku back on. That would have eliminated the whole lure debate. But we went fishing and frustration set in after about an hour jacking with it. I am over it now and clearer minds are prevailing. I just had such high hopes going into it and it really sucked having issues like this. I will take it back out and work with it some more somewhere there is a solution I just have to find it.