Mini macro's 3mm guides?

[Palomar]

Hey fellas rod builder here, well I've only built three and love it. I got a question, what do you guys think of the Baston mini macro's 3mm guides??

All i've herd is "Try them"

so anyone got an oppinion on them? would they work on spinn rodds well?

Thanks

[ernel]

Yes they will work. I would however reccomend sticking with the Fuji guides. The Batsons are a little taller, but the Fujis have a longer foot to wrap. The Fuji 4mm guide is smaller and lighter than the Batson 3mm to boot.

Yes you can build a spinning rod using size 3 & 4 guides for the running guides. You can actually build the whole rod using smaller guides. If you go with a "M" style guide, which has the ring higher off the foot. You can actually start off with a size 16 butt guide and transistion down to the "micro" running guides.

Just keep in mind that if you are using a leader, then all your knots and such will need to pass through the guides as well.

Eric

[I Love BassResource]

 I love the batson's, but I do prefer fuji tops.  I've used the batson 3mm on all of my builds since last fall and I have zero complaints.

[elduderino]

i just did a bunch of spinning and casting rods with the batson micros, really like then.  I'm typically an alconite user, so this was a deviation from the norm. I used all ALPs guides to stay concistent and turned out some very lightweight rods. The one i've been using for personal use - i have been very happy with the performance.

Only thing i will say is - if you fish any sort of rigs that you would tie a leader  (like using a uni-uni knot) you should step up to a size 4 or 5 guide, the size 3s do not pass knots very well.

[Palomar]

They are very odd looking, I usually don't use a leader. I have not made up my mind yet

[BigBassGuy]

I just recently started switching over all my rods to micro guides and am very impressed so far. The first rod that I tore down and rebuilt was one of my 7' 6" Fenwick Techna AV Telescoping Pitching Sticks. It was a very tip heavy rod that I need to counterbalance with about 1 1/2 oz in the butt. After taking everything off and adding the micro guides I will only need to add a quarter to the rear to get it to balance perfectly.

Here it is next to the exact same rod with the old guides on it.

I have been so impressed that I will be doing this to all my rods over the next year.

[ernel]

Here are a few links to show how small these guides really are. Looking at a photo will still not prepare you for actuall swize once in hand.

The first 2 show the difference in size between a Fuji and Batson 3mm guide.

http://www.rodbuilding.org/photopost/showphoto.php/photo/8119

http://www.rodbuilding.org/photopost/showphoto.php/photo/8120

This last one is the one that you can see best how small they really are.

http://www.rodbuilding.org/photopost/showphoto.php/photo/5531/cat/506/page/

Eric

[ejtaylor822]

I haven't used the Batson's but a lot of people love them because of the higher ring is easier to work with finish and keeps the line off the blank better. However, I have used the fuji 4's quite a bit of late and found that as long as thin coats are used is not a problem. I like the longer foot of the fuji.

My advice: try a couple a couple of each and see what you like, then, let us know your results .

Eddie

[elduderino]

best part about the batson's is the price. swampland has them for something like 80c a guide. After using them i see no reason to pay the extra money for an alocnite - with a guide as small as 3 - any weight savings between the two materials is beyond the threshold of human sensitivity.

here is a breakdown of the batson single foots for reference... they are not sized exactly the same as fujis (ie a 3mm batson is not the same as a 3mm fuji).

There's also a very easy way to wrap these little guys outlined here:

http://rodbuilding.org/read.php?2,300464

-justin

[Palomar]

I'm not a member of rodbuilding.org yet, but how much have these really taken off, I have not seen any long time(say 20 plus years) rod builders comment about them or use them in builds posted, seems only newer builders use them. I wonder why is that?  

[SPEEDBEAD.]

I'm not a member of rodbuilding.org yet, but how much have these really taken off, I have not seen any long time(say 20 plus years) rod builders comment about them or use them in builds posted, seems only newer builders use them. I wonder why is that?

I'm gonna go out on a limb here, but maybe they operate under the "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" mantra.

Newer builders might be trying to find what works for them or is visually appealing.

I can say with a 100% certainty that I have seen the rods that Booten built with these guides on them and they are FRIKIN SWEET looking.  I had to do a double take when I first saw them to make sure it wasnt just a blank with a reel seat glued on. They fish very well also, as Jimzee can attest.  

Very stealthy.

[elduderino]

Micro guides are nothing new. They've been around for ever on ultralight rods as well as some technique specific setups used in Europe and Asia. In the last 15 years or so, rods (bass rods more specifically) have undergone a marketing shift towards being as light as possible.

It used to be that you had to keep paying more and more $$$ to shave off each gram of weight - using higher modulus graphite, titaninium guides etc... well - micros get you that weight savings and they 1/10th price of a set of titanium guides.

As for why you don't see "veterans" embracing this, well - i've seen plenty of respected builders using them as well as read multiple articles about the pros/cons written by them. I think any of them will tell you that in any situation, use the smallest possible guide that will effectively and efficiently do the applicable task. In cases for bass fishing, in nearly every situation - a size 6 (standard single foot size) is more than sufficient, so why not a 3 or 4?

I think its not so much the builders are not embracing them, but the buyers of custom rods might have some trepidations about spending big bucks on something that is not the industry norm - cuz lets be honest - if you came to me and said "I want X, Y and Z so its as light as possible" and i told you "X, Y, Z will cost you 350 bucks... i can do "A, B, C" and make it lighter for 200 though."

You'd probably be skeptical.

[flechero]

Lots of the "well seasoned" builders use them...  I see their comments with some frequency on RBO.

[ernel]

Speedbead,

If you want to see what the "veteran builders" are saying, then next time you are on rodbuildiong.org, just use the search feature with all dates selected with the words "micro maniacs". You will get at least 40 pages of reading.

The proof is in your hand after you build one. If you have the option of building a 7' rod with 8 BLAG 6J guides that adds 1.384 grams on the last 2/3 of the blank, or build the same blank using 9 BLAG 4J guides that weigh .45 grams, which would you choose? One of the folks over on RBF figured it up to be something like  72% weight savings on average by using micros.

It is not just about a more sensitive rod. It is also about a more efficient rod. It is also about weight reduction in the correct location, not just overall weight reduction. (It is however nice to build 8' rod and only add 1.7 oz including cork, reelseat, guides, tip, thread, and epoxy.)

Building with micros is NOT FOR EVERY build. There are certain situations where it will not be the better build. Sometimes the reel, line, or knots will not allow the use of anything smaller than a 6 or even an 8, but that doesn't mean that it is a bad build. That is why you test cast prior to wrapping. If you can get 1/4 oz to go 95 feet with a 6J, and can only get 88 feet with a 4J, then the 4 is not the right guide.

I will step off the soap box now.

Eric

[SPEEDBEAD.]

I'm not a rod builder, Eric, so I am not really sure.

I thought they were a new trend; I didnt know they had been around for a while.

[Pitchinkid]

I can also attest to Bootens rod with the Micro guides. I love them. Now if we can only get E21 to sell Carrot Blanks to put the Micro guides on. Talk about a light rig.

[Palomar]

well Now I'm more intrested than ever about them

[ernel]

Speedbead,

The first paragraph was the only part I was directing toward you. The rest was just me reading the rest of the posts and responding in general. Did not mean it to sound like it was all toward you. So please do not take offense.

Eric