Lure Training (Zara Spook)

[Felixone]

So, I have decided that one of the lures I intend to learn this year is the Zara Spook.  The spot I fish the most has mainly bucket fishermen using live bait.  There are usually a couple people out on kayaks (small pond, no gas motors allowed).  I typically see these guys fishing soft plastics, and maybe a spinnerbait or two.  However, I have yet to actually see anyone using a Zara Spook.  I expect that some of the reason is the pond doesn't seem to do great with topwater.  I have caught a few on a buzzbait, but nothing on a popper or frog.  Since I have heard so much about the spook and I don't see many people using them I thought it might be a great bait to try now that I finally have a rod stiff enough to be able to throw the larger baits.

 

The pond is creek fed, and pretty shallow, but there are a few deeps spots (about 15' at the deepest, with most of it being probably around 5-10').  The water is relatively clear (little suspended matter), but is heavily tannin stained.  Depending on the color of the lure I can typically see 3'+ below the surface. There is a lot of grass in the pond however which makes things like bottom lures, and cranks difficult.  The pond is highly pressured given it's size which is why I am looking for "different" types of lures to try (apart from just expanding my skills).  I do know from personal experience that this pond holds some very large bass.  Since the pond is so close to my house I tend to use it as a training ground though.  I figure if I can catch bass out of this pond I should be able to catch them just about anywhere.

 

I typically fish from a kayak but have been known to spend lunch breaks shore fishing.  Currently I have a baitcaster setup that can support lures from 1/4 oz - 1 oz.  It is currently spooked with fluorocarbon, but I am about to have to replace it after a few bad backlashes and constant lure changing while I taught myself to use the new reel.  I also have 2 spinning reels, the rods support up to 5/8 oz. lures.  One is spooled with 20 lb braid, the other with I think 14 lb mono.  I really don't like the type mono I have on there and plan to re-spool that reel as well.

 

This brings me to my questions.

 

Given what you now know, and with the idea that I want to learn to use a topwater walking bait this year, what rig would you recommend.  I mainly see people talking about walking baits and baitcasters so I assumed that I what I would use unless someone has a good argument for using the spinning gear (it would limit me to the smaller spooks though).  Regardless of which rig I use what line would you recommend?  I know that fluorocarbon sinks, as does copolymer I believe.  I am pretty sure braid sort of floats, and with mono it definitely floats.  I really like braid, but I have heard negative things about using braid in a baitcaster (mostly about clearing backlashes).  I have also heard that braid isn't always the best for topwater as it has no stretch and cause you to yank the bait from the fishes mouth.  Does the fact that fluoro sinks really affect topwater lures that much?  Is braid really that bad for topwater?  Should I simply be looking at mono?  If I should go with mono what is a good brand with minimal memory?  For that matter should I forget about the baitcaster all together and just use a spinning reel and limit myself to the lighter baits?

 

I apologize in advance for the craziness of this post, I do tend to get a little compulsive about stuff.  Last year I spent way too much on fishing equipment that I never use so this year I am trying to be a little more careful with what I purchase.

[Choporoz]

What was the question?

 

I say tie on a spook and start walking it.  For me, its a lot easier in a boat than from shore or a kayak.  In fact, I'm a LONG way from walking anything from a kayak.  Try it with all your current set-ups and see what works for you.  For me, its hybrid on a baitcaster, but I've done it with spinning rods, too....just not as well. 

[scaleface]

I find that old time pistol grip 5.5 to 6 foot casting rods work best for walking baits. Spook legend Charlie Campbell uses a 5.5 foot  rod . A lot of people [ but not all ] who recommend long rods with long handles have never tried a short rod .

[Dvigs16]

I think people say to use a bait caste because you can reel it in so much quicker and therefore cast it back out quicker, if you miss a fish. As for the braid, because it has no stretch you could set the hook quicker when you hook up so far out, usually your gonna get hit right off the bat and if there is stretch there's a better chance the bass spits your bait out or you don't get a proper hook set. To me you throw the spook on a baitcaster with the highest ratio you own or can afford, with a 7+ ft rod and 15 to 25lb braid.

[Dvigs16]

I find that old time pistol grip 5.5 to 6 foot casting rods work best for walking baits. Spook legend Charlie Campbell uses a 5.5 foot  rod . A lot of people [ but not all ] who recommend long rods with long handles have never tried a short rod .

That's an interesting theory! I would think the longer the rod the better angle you would have to do the walk and hook set... A short rod would almost appear to be giving yourself a disadvantage... But I guess I shouldn't rip it before trying it. You've intrigued my horizon, I'll have to try it someday.

[Felixone]

This all great information, thank you very much for your input.  I definitely have some things to think about.  As far as the rods are concerned all of my rods are 6' - 6' 6".  I have found that to be the sweet spot for me when I am on the kayak.  Any longer and I sacrifice manageability, any short I sacrifice casting distance.  From the kayak I am probably only casting about 75' - 100'.  Of course I am also not great at judging distance from the kayak either so it could be further, but not by much.  I can see how setting a hook from this distance can be difficult with a stretchy line, which is part of the reason I started using braid.

 

Since I currently have a reel spooled with each type of line I will take the advice of picking up a couple spooks and just trying them on each rod/reel to see if that will help me decide on line type.  I suppose in the end I need to just bite the bullet and try using braid on the baitcaster.

 

Thanks again for all the great advice!

[Senko lover]

I threw full-size spooks (3/4 oz.!)  on a medium spinning rod for several months. A bit heavy but you get used to it. It was all I had. Haven't gained any confidence in the Spook but any setup should work.

[kikstand454]

I would venture to guess that 75% of my fishing time is spent throwing a spook from a kayak. Now.....granted. .... this is for inshore fish ( trout and redfish)- but your question is about gear so its applicable.

If youve never walked the dog before- much less from a kayak- then you will probably want to use your spinning reel. Pull off all that mono that you don't like ( or leave it on- whatever) and put a nice copoly on there ( I like 12# yozuri hybrid). Now. ...tie your spook on with either a loop knot of your choice ( I use the rapala knot) or get a small split ring. This will make the walking even easier. But walking a spook is one of the easiest things in the world to do. It just walks. Cast it out, get about of foot of slack in your line, and jerk the slack gently. Reel. Repeat. The spook will do all the work. When the bite happens, and it will, reel down- DO NOT SET THE HOOK until you reel all your slack up and actually feel the fish. Its going to be impossible to do this at first- but you must train yourself to hesitate on a topwater bite if you want to have a good hook up ratio.

In regards to other things in this thread- I find it easier to work a spook from my kayak with a longer rod- but I do find the longer butt section a pain in the. ...well. ..butt. I also prefer a long 7' rod at least in the kayak so I can work the fish around the front of the boat without incident ( I have a 14' tarpon) .

I don't like braid for topwaters. ...ESP walking ones. .. because when the lure swings back on its slack- it often catches the front hook on the line with limp braid. Mono and copoly seem to have enough tension to " get out of the way".

For tannic like waters you are describing- bone, bone chart, gold black back, and fire tiger have been my top colors.

Good luck! The spook is addictive!

[hatrix]

Casting vs spinning doesn't really matter. Pick whatever your comfortable with although if you are still new to casting a spook is a great bait to get practice in since they are the best casting bait flat out. They are a bullet with treble hooks they are basically the perfect shape. You can work spooks tip up or even sweeping to the side as the walk so easily. Braid is fine so is mono or copoly. With braid and spooks sometimes it might be good to run a leader for the stiffness. It will keep you bait from walking over your limp braid with the front treble and fouling your cast.

[RSM789]

Being it is a pond that you are fishing, you may want to downsize to the smaller spook or even the the zara puppy.  The puppy is definitely easier to throw on a spinning rod.

 

Most important is kikstands description of setting the hook.  Without the wait, you will be pulling the lure out of their mouth.

 

Also, after a missed strike, keep the same cadence & give the fish another chance at it.  Rare are the times that a fish doesn't whack a spook a second time.

[Felixone]

Again, this all great advice, and I appreciate it very much.  Just to touch on some of the additional points mentioned...

 

Senko - I did the same late last season when I started trying to learn to fish spinnerbaits.  I actually kind of liked the extra weight with the lighter rod as it seemed I could feel the action of the lure just a bit more.  Of course I imaging it is funny to watch the rod bend while I retrieve.  I am sure it looked like I was always fighting a fish, even though it was just an oversized lure for the rod.

 

Kikstand - Unfortunately I am still better at casting while standing than sitting, but I am definitely getting better.  I know for sure I am better at the soft landings in the kayak than when I am on shore.  I too hate the long "butt"end of the rods.  I have actually been looking at the rods KastKing put out last year specifically for kayaks.  They made the butt end shorter, and even put a ring on the bottom for attaching a leash.  I know some of the guys around here use them and really like them.  I received one of their reels for Xmas and so far I love it.  I am sure other more recognizable brands have similar products, but I also really like the prices.  Also, I think I will probably try a Copoly line first.  I am still not quite comfortable using braid for the baitcaster.  I really like the line, but still want to try a few others.  Also, thanks for the tips on lure colors.  I have to admit when I first started fishing this pond I didn't fully understand lure colors.  I think I am getting better though.

 

Hatrix - Using a leader with the braid is a good idea.  I have actually been contemplating doing that anyway.  Almost all of the local water is very heavily pressured, and most of it is pretty clear (little suspended matter).  As a result I started wondering if my line was giving me away more than it should.  I am going out tomorrow and plan to give it a go to see what the results are.

 

RMS - Excellent point.  I went to my local mart of walls the other day and bought three different sizes including the pup.  We had some really heavy rains a couple nights back and the pond I usually fish is nearly flooded out so I am not sure when I will be going back.  Since it was actually very low just prior to the storm, and is not flooded I don't expect the fishing this weekend will be very good there.  Based on reports I am thinking of trying some new water out that apparently spooks and spinnerbaits are killing there right now.  Since I am want to learn the spook and am still learning spinnerbaits this might be a chance to test them out where I know they have been biting recently.

 

Anyway, again thank you all very much for your input and advice!  Hopefully by the end of the season I will be walking the dog like a pro.

[Kevin22]

Ive never done any good on zaras, but spook jr, the xps version, amd cabelas walking dawg are awesome. I use 14# mono, but 10 or 12 will work if it is weed free. 6'6mf casting rod.

I have my best luck with spooks in early morning on bright calm days. Cloudy days and midday fishing a buzzer usually works better.

[Ozark_Basser]

I like to fish spooks on mono. It fouls up too much on braid and the line gets caught in the hooks too often. It's also a lot easier to walk it fast with mono. Just get a rod with a good soft tip and jerk it on slack line. Doesn't take too long to get down.

A spook is one of those baits where the speed I fish it really determines whether I get bit or not. Some days they want it walked as fast as possible or really slow. Some days they only hit it on the pause. I love spooks. Definitely my favorite open water top water bait. They cast a mile so you can cover a lot of water, and they catch bigger fish.

[scaleface]

http://www.in-fisherman.com/midwest-finesse/the-heddon-zara-spook-according-to-charlie-campbell/

[papajoe222]

I like a rod with a short handle because of the way I have to work a Spook (wrist problems). The big advantage to using a short, pistol grip rod is in casting accuracy. For presenting the bait in open water situations, I don't think it matters except to the user.  Stick with mono and go a little on the heavy side for hard topwater baits. If you find you're having problems with the line tangling in the front treble, try thumbing the spool or dropping your index finger on a spinning reel just before the lure splashes down.  The addition of a split ring or use of a loop knot will make a big difference when learning to walk one of these baits and either is essential to working it without moving the bait forward. 

Do a search here on fishing this bait. There are a number of informative articles.

[gulfcaptain]

I fish mono topshots for all topwater baits and braid main line with softer rods to help keep the fish buttoned. And this year decided to improve on my topwater fishing with one simple addition.  Fly Floatant.  Originally got it for fishing frogs and coating the braid to help keep the line up (first 12" and yes it does work nicely), decided to try it on a mono topshot with a popper and it worked great as well keeping the line up on the surface although I did have to re-apply it every so often.  

[hatrix]

If you run straight braid it can be very easy to foul while walking a bait. If you run a leader it's stiffness will keep the line out ahead of the bait so you don't run it over.

[bigbill]

Ok I have six rod setups with me all the time even shore fishing which I mainly do.

1. A topwater setup

6' / 6 1/2' / 7' spinning 14lb/17lb copolymer (Excalibur silver thread)

Spooks, walk the dog- 1-2-3 twitch n pause, hold the rod tip down and reel make the spook run under the surface extract then pause. Poppers

Rebel Pop r 1-2-3 twitch n pause.

2. Crankbaits setup,(hardbaits) larger

6' 6 1/2' spinning 10lb / 12lb copolymer (Excalibur silver thread)

Crankbaits, minnow baits,

3. Small lure setup (lighter smaller)

5'6"- 6' spinning 6lb - 8lb copolymer (Excalibur silver thread)

Small cranks, spinflys, inline spinners(small) 1/8oz / 1/4oz spinnerbaits.

4. Jigs

6' baitcaster 10lb / 12lb copolymer (Excalibur silver thread)

Example 3/8oz football jig green pumpkin, pork trailer.

5. Spinnerbaits

6'6" spinning 12lb / 14lb 3/8oz to 1/2oz spinnerbaits

6. Rig setup "carolina rig"

6'6" spinning 17lb test. Senkos, brushogs, creature baits p'll plastics etc.

The line test does affect the lure action. I like the 8lb copolymer but on longer casts I needed a heavier test line. Actually I'm casting too far into the weeds. The bigger bass bury themselves in the weeds. Fishing from shore it's the only thing I regret.

For the rod length, the line test, wether it's a spinning or baitcaster reel that's your choice.

Learn every lure, the pattern and presentation here. Then go out and practice it.

Decades ago I was spending $50++ a week on livebait when I got into bass fishing heavy. I started using two rod setups.

One livebait and one with lures. Soon the lure setup was catching more fish as I became better and focused more on my presentation.

Focus closely on your presentations and staying motivated, success will follow