More On Structure...

[papajoe222]

So let me see if I understand y'all!

Y'all are perfectly willing to run over any bass not holding in shallow water in order to get to shallow water when the bass may or may not be shallow.

Interesting concept!

I think I'll stick with fishing my way from deep to shallow & not spook anything!

Yes, if you work from shallow to deep, but not if you work deep to shallow.  If, like me, you begin your search shallow and work your way deep you may or may not run over the top of fish that are holding deep. Two things I keep in mind. First is that I don't approach the destination of the fish using the same route from deep to shallow that they would (or I think they would). Second I'm looking for active fish first. If I'm lucky enough to find them shallow and active, there is no need for me to continue my search. It's over.  If not, I continue my way deeper along the structure until I contact fish. At that point I would stop as my search has ended.  The only reason for me to move once I've located fish willing to take my offering, is if the fish move. When they do, I know that their next stop will either be a spot just shallow of where I am, or deeper along the structure (which is normally what happens). 

Starting deep and working shallow also works, but in doing so you may be missing out on actively feeding fish even though you are catching less active fish.

Either way you are using the structure as the basis of your search.

[Catt]

Yes, if you work from shallow to deep, but not if you work deep to shallow. If, like me, you begin your search shallow and work your way deep you may or may not run over the top of fish that are holding deep. Two things I keep in mind. First is that I don't approach the destination of the fish using the same route from deep to shallow that they would (or I think they would). Second I'm looking for active fish first. If I'm lucky enough to find them shallow and active, there is no need for me to continue my search. It's over. If not, I continue my way deeper along the structure until I contact fish. At that point I would stop as my search has ended. The only reason for me to move once I've located fish willing to take my offering, is if the fish move. When they do, I know that their next stop will either be a spot just shallow of where I am, or deeper along the structure (which is normally what happens).

Starting deep and working shallow also works, but in doing so you may be missing out on actively feeding fish even though you are catching less active fish.

Either way you are using the structure as the basis of your search.

So deep water fish are inactive & don't feed?

[papajoe222]

If they have forage available, of course they aren't and yes they do. What I'm refering to and the way I use the system, is in search of fish that travel from deep to shallow in their search to feed. 

If you don't locate fish actively feeding in deep water, do you stay there or move? If you do move, don't you have a system that you follow or do you just randomly move around in your search? I've seen pics of some of your fish and I seriously doubt that.

[Catt]

There are 24 hours in a day; of those how many do you think bass are actively feeding?

When do bass become active feeders?

Is it when they arrive at the feeding area or is it when they decide to start their movement towards the feeding area?

Just because bass are shallow is that proof they are actively feeding?

I think we believe we are fishing for "active" fish far more than they actually are!

There are three areas where we can target bass, their home, their feeding/spawning area, or the breaks/breaklines connecting the two.

I target all three

[papajoe222]

No, just because fish are shallow does not mean they are actively feeding. "There are three areas where we can target bass, their home, their feeding/spawning area, or the breaks/break lines connecting the two." Spoken like a true student and practitioner of structure fishing.

Our reasoning is the same, you and I just go about putting it to use In the opposite direction. You could say that I'm literally 'bassackwards'.

[Catt]

Which would be a better approach?

Idle the boat straight up into shallow water & search just the shallows for "active" fish?

Or should we fish our way into the shallows?

I choose the later; now I've targeted their home, breaks/breaklines, & feeding areas.

FYI: Not only have I studied everything Buck taught I spent eight hours a day for five days in a classroom with Mr. Perry himself as teacher. Before class I talked structure, during lunch I talked structure, and during breaks I talked structure. By the end of the seminar Mr. Perry was probably glad to get rid of this Cajun.

[Team9nine]

I don't view it as a case of which is the "better" approach, as each has their merits. If I'm not very familiar with a piece of structure, I'll always tend to start shallow first. On structures I know very well, and also know exactly which paths and breaks the fish tend to use from experience, I'll frequently start deeper, right on those key areas (spots on a spot) as you suggest. To that end, and papajoes point, if I know the structure that well, I'm not going to drive right over any key deep/transition areas to get to the shallows. I'm coming in from the flat side or along the shoreline. But I would personally never limit myself to doing it just one way or the other (deep > shallow; shallow > deep) every single time out, regardless. I really think it depends on how familiar with a lake and/or structure you are, as well as the prevailing weather and water conditions. Whatever works for you on your waters...

 

-T9

[A-Jay]

I don't view it as a case of which is the "better" approach, as each has their merits. If I'm not very familiar with a piece of structure, I'll always tend to start shallow first. On structures I know very well, and also know exactly which paths and breaks the fish tend to use from experience, I'll frequently start deeper, right on those key areas (spots on a spot) as you suggest. To that end, and papajoes point, if I know the structure that well, I'm not going to drive right over any key deep/transition areas to get to the shallows. I'm coming in from the flat side or along the shoreline. But I would personally never limit myself to doing it just one way or the other (deep > shallow; shallow > deep) every single time out, regardless. I really think it depends on how familiar with a lake and/or structure you are, as well as the prevailing weather and water conditions. Whatever works for you on your waters...

 

-T9

 

X2

 

Another great option.  Fishing from a shallow draft craft (canoe) I do this a good majority of the time; especially at night.  Local waters are deep & clear and most have very little in the way of shoreline cover to hold fish.  The first & second break lines hold a good majority of the fish, early & late in the season.

  When fishing on or near the bottom is the deal, fishing "Up the breaks" allows for good coverage of these spots with less possibility of alarming the fish of my presence.  And if & when a particular break or depth is identified to be where the best bass are striking the bait, a parallel presentation can be employed which will help keep a bait in the right place longer.

 

This has proven to be an excellent presentation approach for jerk baits and even some topwater action in this clear water as well.  We'll see how it works with big swim baits this season.

 

A-Jay

[Mr_Scrogg]

I think I can add something!!!!

Fish don't always have to be feeding to catch them. A bite and a strike are different things. (Just read that one)

[DRH2O]

I was wondering if someone was going to bring up Up vs. Down... That alone is going to pretty much require one approach or the other.

 

For me personally, determining factors like, how well I know the structure, whether I want to fish Up or Down, water clarity, wind, etc. are going to play a big role in how I approach it.

 

I might come at it from the main basin, pulling a jig or something off the breaklines to let them drop. I might creep in the shallow right next to the shore from the side and cast out to swim something up to bump those lips or ledges. I might troll right over the top of a breakline, either parallel or perpendicular to it.  I might even be cruising along dropping markers to sort out where I'm going to focus once I'm done mapping.

 

The fact that I fish out of a kayak most of the time also skews my approach because I have a serious stealth advantage (IMO). I might approach the same spot differently from a full size boat. Still, the point I'm making is that one size does not fit all.

 

This might confuse the newbie to structure fishing though, who is just trying to grasp and iron out a systematic approach to figuring it out and is again being given too many options without the experience to judge which situation calls for what. Someone new to the game might be better served by worrying less about whether starting in the shallows or in deep water is "right" and just focusing on making sure that they're fishing this piece of structure in a methodical manner that allows them to identify and isolate the "spots on the spot."

 

~Denny

[cyclops2]

 I just follow the fish finder if the are no docks & boats.