Relevency Between # Of Bearings And Reel Quality

[wackyy_worms]

I was always curious about how much the number of bearings has to do with the actual quality of the reel?

When I was first getting into bass fishing and making my first reel purchases I really really paid major attention to the number of bearings inside of the reel.

It played a major part in my purchase.

 

For example the first spinning reel I bought was an okuma stratus 2500. The reel was on sale for 40$ and had 9 ball bearings. I thought this must of ment that the reel was of excellent quality. Although I got lucky and I love the reel and still use it to this day, Im sure I could of bought a reel with less bearings that was better quality.

 

I also noticed when I first started shopping that shimano, although expensive reels and good quality, had a low BB count compared to other reels in their price range.

 

So my question is how much attention do you guys pay to the number of BB when making a purchase? What number of bearings would you find to be sufficient and everything over that number just an added benefit?

 

 

tight lines everybody

-Ryan

[tomustang]

It's another marketing tool.

[wackyy_worms]

It's another marketing tool.

thats what I figured, Ive felt reels that were more smooth than ones that had more bearings.

although I must say their tactics worked when i was first starting out haha

[aavery2]

Let me give you an example of how bearing count plays little in the difference.  Take a reel like the popular Daiwa Tatula, it has 8 bearings installed from the factory.  For $5 I can purchase 4 additional bearings and add them to the reel, two in the levelwind and 2 in the knobs on the handle.  Now it's the same reel,  a little smoother on the retrieve side  after replacing plastic bushings with bearings and the bearing count is now 12.   While in my eyes the upgrade from bushing to bearings is worth the little money required, it actually does very little to improve the performance of the reel, but now the bearing count looks more impressive to the uneducated.

 

A good quality reel will use quality bearings in the right places, a cheap reel with a high bearing count is just that, it does not transform what is a poor reel into something special.

[rippin-lips]

You can have a 10 bearing reel and 4 of them are in the handle knobs. 2 of them in the level wind and that leaves 4 in the actual reel. Yes, bearings in the knobs are a nice feature but not necessary. Same with the level wind. I don't notice any of my reels being much smoother that I've done this too.

^^^ he's faster at typing than me.

[Tywithay]

Bearings mean very little. The old Calcutta B had 3 or 4 bearings and lasted forever. If you take a cheap Chinese reel and put 12 cheap Chinese bearings in it, it's still junk. Quality of craftsmanship, materials, and components, is far more important.

[ColdSVT]

Quality of bearings over quanity...

[wackyy_worms]

Bearings mean very little. The old Calcutta B had 3 or 4 bearings and lasted forever. If you take a cheap Chinese reel and put 12 cheap Chinese bearings in it, it's still junk. Quality of craftsmanship, materials, and components, is far more important.

 

 

You can have a 10 bearing reel and 4 of them are in the handle knobs. 2 of them in the level wind and that leaves 4 in the actual reel. Yes, bearings in the knobs are a nice feature but not necessary. Same with the level wind. I don't notice any of my reels being much smoother that I've done this too.

^^^ he's faster at typing than me.

 

 

Let me give you an example of how bearing count plays little in the difference.  Take a reel like the popular Daiwa Tatula, it has 8 bearings installed from the factory.  For $5 I can purchase 4 additional bearings and add them to the reel, two in the levelwind and 2 in the knobs on the handle.  Now it's the same reel,  a little smoother on the retrieve side  after replacing plastic bushings with bearings and the bearing count is now 12.   While in my eyes the upgrade from bushing to bearings is worth the little money required, it actually does very little to improve the performance of the reel, but now the bearing count looks more impressive to the uneducated.

 

A good quality reel will use quality bearings in the right places, a cheap reel with a high bearing count is just that, it does not transform what is a poor reel into something special.

never even thought about bearings being places other than the actual reel itself. good points!

[Delaware Valley Tackle]

All the above comments are dead on. Quality bearings supporting the spool are obviously important, as is a good AR roller clutch bearing. Additional bearings can be prioritized:

The only way to be sure where bearings are is to look at a schematic in these spots, 

 

crank shaft base

Pinion gear support (frame mounted)

Crank shaft support (side plate)

pinion gear support (side plate, ala Daiwa & Shimano new Xwrap)

level wind worm gear ends

handle grips

[Maxximus Redneckus]

3BBs all you need in a baitcaster and depending on the reel bushings work good also

[aavery2]

3BBs all you need in a baitcaster and depending on the reel bushings work good also

Interesting thought, where would those bearings be installed at in your reel.

[baluga]

Interesting thought, where would those bearings be installed at in your reel.

 

one to support the drive shaft

two to support the spool shaft

 

you don't count the arb since its a roller bearing not  bb.

[aavery2]

one to support the drive shaft

two to support the spool shaft

 

you don't count the arb since its a roller bearing not  bb.

I going to have to throw a penalty flag on you, the ARB is in the total bearing count on most reels today, and while you are correct about it's type, it is still a bearing.  

You have to decide which one to give up.

[baluga]

I going to have to throw a penalty flag on you, the ARB is in the total bearing count on most reels today, and while you are correct about it's type, it is still a bearing.  

You have to decide which one to give up.

 

If you look closely how reels are advertised :  3 Stainless BB plus 1 ARB.

 

 

you got to back and read maxximus post which you quoted:

 

3BB not 3 Bearings

 

But if you really need to go less.  You can replace the bearing that supports the driveshaft with bushing.

 

There...

 

Technically they will advertise it a 2BB plus 1 ARB.

 

Here's a good example of a plus 1:

 

Daiwa Tatula® Casting Reel

 

• • 7+1 bearing drive
  • T-Wing System – levelwind system for longer casts
  • Magforce-Z Cast Control
  • Infinite anti-reverse
  • 90mm cutaway swept handle

[Jeff H]

I like to have 6 as my minimum in casting reels.  2 for spool, 2 for pinion, 2 for driveshaft.  Have used many fine reels that only had 5 but I like to see 6 now.

[aavery2]

 

If you look closely how reels are advertised :  3 Stainless BB plus 1 ARB.

 

 

you got to back and read maxximus post which you quoted:

 

3BB not 3 Bearings

 

But if you really need to go less.  You can replace the bearing that supports the driveshaft with bushing.

 

There...

 

Technically they will advertise it a 2BB plus 1 ARB.

 

Here's a good example pf a plus 1:

 

Daiwa Tatula® Casting Reel

 

• • 7+1 bearing drive
  • T-Wing System – levelwind system for longer casts
  • Magforce-Z Cast Control
  • Infinite anti-reverse
  • 90mm cutaway swept handle

It's cool, it wasn't meant to be all that serious, was just trying to have a little fun with it.

[baluga]

It's cool, it wasn't meant to be all that serious, was just trying to have a little fun with it.

 

I know... I'm also just having fun.

[Tony L.]

I think that, in general, the "more bearings is better" really is a good rule of thumb. All other things being equal, it probably holds true. When you start getting into more premium gear, though, the quality of those bearings (and of the of the reel components) seems to trump numbers.

[SirSnookalot]

It's the reel itself not the bearings.  Stradic not a lot bearings and very good reel, a cabo has more bearings and it's my favorite in that class, but a Penn captiva has 11 bearings and it's not very good reel, it can be bought for $29.95

[Josh Smith]

Hello,

 

I'm playing with three Abu Garcia Ambassadeur 5000 reels.

 

All are upgraded to 5500 speed.  All are supertuned.  My notes regarding bearings:

 

•  The two with spool bearings installed do not outperform the one on which I retained the bronze bushings.  They might be just slightly smoother than the bushing one, but that's up for debate.

 

•  The bushing reel and the 5000c both have worm gear bearings.  They more easily outperform the reel which retains the plastic bushings on the idler, so much so that the remaining reel with the worm gear bushings is being upgraded to worm gear bearings next week when the parts get here.

 

• All three are being upgraded to cog wheel (turns the worm gear) bushings to cog wheel bearings next week as well.  I've noticed a lot of friction in the cog wheel that could be reduced.

 

• I have one bushing reel in which I've replaced the plastic drive bushing with a ball bearing.  It's much smoother, and the other two are getting the same treatment, again, next week. 

 

When all is said and done, two of the 5000 reels will have six bearings, five of which will run while casting, and one will have four bearings, three of which will run on casting.

 

Currently, the bushing reel is on a 5'6" MH spinnerbait rod.  After polishing the bushings, oiling with light oil, and installing the worm gear bearings, it casts 1/2oz accurately to 35 yards with about 40 yards being maximum.

 

The 5000c with worm gear bearings and drive shaft bearings has approximately the same range and accuracy as the bushing reel.  It is on a 6'6" M rod.

 

The last 5000, the one that hasn't had the worm gear bushings replaced with bearings, is on a 7'0" MH rod.  It won't cast 1/2oz as far as the other MH with the worm gear bearings installed.  However, up that to 1oz, and it will go 50 yards.  I look forward to seeing what it will do once I get the bearings installed in the worm gear assembly.

 

In short, I see three bearings that are likely critical to a reel's casting performance/ease of casting (which is what I'm really after!)

 

Reduce this to no bearings really necessary if bronze bushings are used and the levelwind does not run during the cast, just so long as the reel is lubed correctly.

 

Of course, for smooth operation during reeling, bearings should be used in a couple, few spots.  I've been opening up a lot of reels lately, and some of the smoothest surprised me.  Mostly, they had the fewest ball bearings.  Parts were just worn in well and/or polished nicely.

 

Josh

[OK Bass Hunter]

There is no direct correlation. The Shimano Calcutta B's had, I think, 3 bearings. They were some of the best baitcasters ever produced.

[wackyy_worms]

Hello,

 

I'm playing with three Abu Garcia Ambassadeur 5000 reels.

 

All are upgraded to 5500 speed.  All are supertuned.  My notes regarding bearings:

 

•  The two with spool bearings installed do not outperform the one on which I retained the bronze bushings.  They might be just slightly smoother than the bushing one, but that's up for debate.

 

•  The bushing reel and the 5000c both have worm gear bearings.  They more easily outperform the reel which retains the plastic bushings on the idler, so much so that the remaining reel with the worm gear bushings is being upgraded to worm gear bearings next week when the parts get here.

 

• All three are being upgraded to cog wheel (turns the worm gear) bushings to cog wheel bearings next week as well.  I've noticed a lot of friction in the cog wheel that could be reduced.

 

• I have one bushing reel in which I've replaced the plastic drive bushing with a ball bearing.  It's much smoother, and the other two are getting the same treatment, again, next week. 

 

When all is said and done, two of the 5000 reels will have six bearings, five of which will run while casting, and one will have four bearings, three of which will run on casting.

 

Currently, the bushing reel is on a 5'6" MH spinnerbait rod.  After polishing the bushings, oiling with light oil, and installing the worm gear bearings, it casts 1/2oz accurately to 35 yards with about 40 yards being maximum.

 

The 5000c with worm gear bearings and drive shaft bearings has approximately the same range and accuracy as the bushing reel.  It is on a 6'6" M rod.

 

The last 5000, the one that hasn't had the worm gear bushings replaced with bearings, is on a 7'0" MH rod.  It won't cast 1/2oz as far as the other MH with the worm gear bearings installed.  However, up that to 1oz, and it will go 50 yards.  I look forward to seeing what it will do once I get the bearings installed in the worm gear assembly.

 

In short, I see three bearings that are likely critical to a reel's casting performance/ease of casting (which is what I'm really after!)

 

Reduce this to no bearings really necessary if bronze bushings are used and the levelwind does not run during the cast, just so long as the reel is lubed correctly.

 

Of course, for smooth operation during reeling, bearings should be used in a couple, few spots.  I've been opening up a lot of reels lately, and some of the smoothest surprised me.  Mostly, they had the fewest ball bearings.  Parts were just worn in well and/or polished nicely.

 

Josh

very nice read,thank you for that!