Holding guides in place to wrap...argh!

[Theresamarie1]

Hi rod builders.

Does someone have the best way to hold guides on while trying to wrap them??  I've tried masking tape, duct tape, twisted wire, super glue, hot tip glue and none of these seem to work very well.    I just finished the wrapping on my first rod and this was by far and away, the most frustrating part of the entire process.   The actual wrapping, by comparison, was a piece of cake.   In the end, I resorted to doing a sacrificial thread wrap of the guide starting in the middle of the foot, and then once I wrapped up to that point, I'd cut it off.   In every other case, with every other method I tried, the guide would lift just as the thread touched the end and/or it would push the guide further up the rod.   The hot melt glue just would not allow the guide to sit flat, and my super glue, would not hold well (maybe i have an old or bad batch).  

There must be a better way, and I hope someone can give me a clue, before I start another build.

Regards,

Terri  

[Alpster]

Terri,

Usually the frustration with masking tape is that it is too wide. You can try cutting thin strips with a razor. Also if you want to use glue, try to get the "Flexcoat" guide glue, it behaves better than regular hot glue. Another option is tiny rubber bands, you can either cut them from small rubber tubing , you can get the tubing from a sugical supply. The easiest way is to ask a orthadontist for the bands that go on children's braces. This is a common problem for rod builders and you just have to try different methods till you find one you can live with.

After a lot of rods and frustration I have settled for using "Flexcoat" guide adhesive. I cut a small chip off the stick with a knife and lay it on a piece of tin foil. I use a butane lighter (the kind with a trigger) and heat the glue till it turns clear. Touch the guide to the melted glue and quickly wipe off any excess with your fingers and press the guide in place. It only takes a little bit to hold it in place. I find the less you use the better. If you get a little too much glue on the blank you can heat tip of an ice pick or a big needle and wick the excess away.

You hear a lot of disscussion among rod builders about guide preparation and this a big reason why. If you carefully file or sand the guide feet untill they fit snug and flat against the blank it will be far easier to keep it in place for wrapping regardless of what method you use.

I hope this is helpfull.

Ronnie

[Theresamarie1]

Terri,

Usually the frustration with masking tape is that it is too wide. You can try cutting thin strips with a razor.

Ronnie, I did try that with both the masking and duct tape.   The thread would still either push the guide up the rod or would 'snap' around and push the foot up so the foot sat on top of the thread.  It was maddening until I just did a sacrificial wrap which held the foot down tightly.

Also if you want to use glue, try to get the "Flexcoat" guide glue, it behaves better than regular hot glue. Another option is tiny rubber bands, you can either cut them from small rubber tubing , you can get the tubing from a sugical supply. The easiest way is to ask a orthadontist for the bands that go on children's braces. This is a common problem for rod builders and you just have to try different methods till you find one you can live with.

I didn't have any of those small rubber bands sitting around but I bet they would work good.  You'd think I'd have some laying around having had 2 kids in braces...  I'll look at getting some of that flexcoat adhesive.

You hear a lot of disscussion among rod builders about guide preparation and this a big reason why. If you carefully file or sand the guide feet untill they fit snug and flat against the blank it will be far easier to keep it in place for wrapping regardless of what method you use.

You know the fuji guides were just about perfect in the way they layed on the rod but there was just a bit of a hump at the end of the foot.  Maybe I should have taken a dremel and made it paper thin so there was not tendancy to push the foot with the thread.   Other than that, the guides were pretty much ready to go (or at least I thought).

I hope this is helpfull.

Always very helpful, thank you much!

Terri

[vtbassin]

Hi Terri,

I use the thin cut strips of blue masking tape as Alpster suggested or I tie the guides on with a rubber band.  I have been unable to find very small rubber bands so I just cut a longer one and tie the Guide in place.  The rubber band method I find it easier to move the guides around as needed.

Tight Wraps

George

[vtbassin]

Quote:

You hear a lot of disscussion among rod builders about guide preparation and this a big reason why. If you carefully file or sand the guide feet untill they fit snug and flat against the blank it will be far easier to keep it in place for wrapping regardless of what method you use.

You know the fuji guides were just about perfect in the way they layed on the rod but there was just a bit of a hump at the end of the foot.  Maybe I should have taken a dremel and made it paper thin so there was not tendancy to push the foot with the thread.   Other than that, the guides were pretty much ready to go (or at least I thought).

I use a small hand file on all of my guides to get a smooth/flat transition from the rod blank onto the guide.  You can use a dremel but go slowly.  Do not disreguard the bottom of the guide as you do not want any burrs digging into your rod blank.  Over time a burr can cause a failure.  :'(

George

[Theresamarie1]

Hi Terri,

I use the thin cut strips of blue masking tape as Alpster suggested or I tie the guides on with a rubber band.  I have been unable to find very small rubber bands so I just cut a longer one and tie the Guide in place.  The rubber band method I find it easier to move the guides around as needed.

Tight Wraps

George

George, thanks much.  I must need to do some prep on the guides if the tape works for you guys.   Maybe I'll try cutting and retying rubber bands as well.    This is Dads rod (Christmas present) so I've been frantically trying to find time between work and travel (for work) to get it down.   I'm finally ready for finish now..  I'll make sure to take a pic and post it before putting it in the mail.

[vtbassin]

;D You still have 22 days til Christmas ;D :

[flechero]

Terri,

You must not have prepped the feet as well as you need to.  I say this because when I started, I went through the same thing.  A properly prepped foot will wrap with ease... the thread will just climb right up the foot with NO hesitation.  I have not had any Fuji guides that were good from the factory... in fact all Fuji's except the titaniums needed work on the bottom as well.  I use a chainsaw file for the underside and some fine needle files on the tops.  It sounds like a bunch of work but with a little practice it only takes 30-40 seconds per guide.

I use a thin strip of masking tape to hold them.  One trick is to be sure you make 2 revolutions with the tape, it holds the guides 10 X tighter than if you don't wrap the tape all the way around.

I would not let the dremel out near a guide foot unless you are an absolute pro with it.  That's just me though.

With every rod you build, the wrapping and guide prep get easier.  

[Theresamarie1]

Terri,

You must not have prepped the feet as well as you need to.  I say this because when I started, I went through the same thing.  A properly prepped foot will wrap with ease... the thread will just climb right up the foot with NO hesitation.  I have not had any Fuji guides that were good from the factory... in fact all Fuji's except the titaniums needed work on the bottom as well.  I use a chainsaw file for the underside and some fine needle files on the tops.  It sounds like a bunch of work but with a little practice it only takes 30-40 seconds per guide.

I use a thin strip of masking tape to hold them.  One trick is to be sure you make 2 revolutions with the tape, it holds the guides 10 X tighter than if you don't wrap the tape all the way around.

I would not let the dremel out near a guide foot unless you are an absolute pro with it.  That's just me though.

With every rod you build, the wrapping and guide prep get easier.  

Thanks Flechero,

It's apparent that I should have done more on the preparation.  They just looked so good and flat, much better than I expected.     I have all of the tools too because I do old camera repair and furniture building as well (so not like I'm ill prepared) in the rest of my spare time : .   Well, experience counts for a lot in just about every craft.  Next time I'll know better.   I just bought some rough Cherry for a bedroom set I'm embarking on.

Terri