10# Vs 20# Braid -- Noticeable Differences For Finesse And Wacky?

[michang5]

I have been using 20# PowerPro Super 8 Slick with my spinning setup. I do use a 10# fluoro leader with it. I've been throwing wacky Senkos and finesse worms lately and caught a PB 5.75 a few weeks ago. Needless to say, I've been very happy with it.

The one bit of concern I have is that I typically have a fair amount of slack-line bow between me and the lure. I find that I'm reeling more often to minimize the bow and I'm worried that I may be overworking the plastic and/or missing bites.

Would a downsize to 10# braid help?

I can't figure out whether the thinner line would be more susceptible to wind, water and gravity, making the bow worse? Or vice versa?

The other issue with switching would be the likely need to downsize my leader, too, increasing costs and gear.

Those that have used both, is it worth switching? Thanks!

P.S. I'm only wondering in relation to finesse tactics and wacky. I have a baitcaster to handle the heavier applications.

[J Francho]

Honestly, if you're worried about maximizing slack line sensitivity, I'd be looking at running straight 6 or 8# fluoro. Fluoro is more dense than braid, and transmits bites through the rod on a slack line better than braid.

[michang5]

Thanks, J Francho. The thought had crossed my mind.

My one experience with running a long length of fluoro was a disaster. It was purely a test, but I spooled on a cast length of 12# Invizx on top of some depleted braid. Even with liberal amounts of KVD L&L, the line just flowered off the size 25-30 spool.

I know a bad test with too heavy fluoro should not color my opinion, but I'm still a bit worried that 6# or 8# fluoro (let's says Invizx again) would peel off the smaller size 10 reel I'm planning on getting.

[J Francho]

I don't go over 6# diameter on a spinning reel that size.  Invisx or Tatsu are what I prefer.

[Raul]

Baits will have a lot better action when tied to thin line, try 4-6 lb fluoro or copoly and the action is incredible.

[Darren.]

As to your 10# and 20# braid question. I use 10# PowerPro in yellow (2# mono equiv diameter). I use 20# on my bait caster. 

 

I've settled on 10# for my spinning gear and use a leader anywhere from 6-15# test. Caught plenty of big bass on all pound tests.

 

For slack line sensitivity, JF is right, but another option is to use a longer leader of fluorocarbon.

 

Some folks use 20 or more feet of leader, like Gary Yamamoto, who says he likes to have the leader wrapped on his spool while fighting a fish.

 

Just something else to consider.

[thehooligan]

I use 10lb braid for spinning with 6lb leaders for finesse tactics. 20lb on the baitcasters with 8-10lb leaders.

I'd give the 10lb a shot.

[michang5]

Thanks, all. I'm going to pick up a spool of 10# braid and a spool of 6# Invizx.

 

I should have some flexibility with these in the arsenal:

• 10# PP S8S braid
• 20# PP S8S braid
• 6# Invizx
• 10# Seaguar Red Label
• 15# Invizx (for baitcaster)

[SirSnookalot]

I think 10# braid may get little more of bow than 20# because it's thinner and lighter, but it might not be too significant.  I use 10# slick on 1 combo and reg 10# PP on another using leaders about 20".  I try and keep the wind at my back and the rod low to the water, aids in reducing the bow and keeping the line straight, a bullet weight may help some too.  However positioning yourself with the wind at your back isn't always possible to do.

[Naplock]

Being one the most inept people on the planet when it comes to tying leader knots, I mostly gave up trying, unless I am using very small diameter line(s).

Hehe

As I start to fish more, and variable types/techniques, I know I'll have to get at least a functional proficiency at it, but for now I use straight braid/Flouro. In each case I tend to use lighter test choices.

[Wayne P.]

I use superline for spinning gear finesse presentations in the 8# mono equivelent diameter and add a 20# fluorocarbon leader sometimes as weight to overcome the floatation of the braid with weightless finesse and trick worms wacky style.

Works for me in all water conditions.

I only use a max length of 4' with the fluorocarbon line since I don't want the leader on the reel at any point.

Senkos are a non issue since they are so heavy.

My preferred superline is either Daiwa Samurai or Daiwa Saltiga.

[Fishes in trees]

If you use a visible braid line (I like Fireline Crystal, but there are other visibility lines out there)  You can get away with a lot of slack because the line works kind of like a strike indicator does when you are fly fishing.  You will see the line on the water move long before you will feel anything and then you just tighten up quick and set the hook.  For the most part, slack line on braid is a good thing in that it lets your bait fall unimpeded.

[michang5]

Thanks, everyone. I was able to put together my new setup today: new-to-me Stradic 1000FI with new St. Croix Premier 6'6". Spooled on 10# PowerPro Super 8 Slick (yellow) with a few yards of backing.

As suggested, I started with a very long leader of 6# Invizx. I honestly couldn't tell if the bow was better or worse because I couldn't see the line. It was so thin!

In addition, in the shallow water I was fishing I couldn't see the high-vis yellow sticking out of the water as I've been used to. I lost my bite detector.

As I oftentimes rely on seeing the braid swim away or tick to know when I have a fish on, I had cut the leader back.

It's still a few feet longer than I'm used to (about 14' vs. 8'). I had to leave, but I plan on testing this length of leader tomorrow.

I'll report back on bow, bite detection and overall performance.

P.S. The long leader of Invizx would flower off my spool if I wasn't careful. I tried to match the line direction and sprayed KVD L&L during spooling, but it didn't help. Obviously the L&L only had a short time to work, but again, I can't see how having a full size 10 spool of Invizx wouldn't be hard to manage.

[SirSnookalot]

Thanks, everyone. I was able to put together my new setup today: new-to-me Stradic 1000FI with new St. Croix Premier 6'6". Spooled on 10# PowerPro Super 8 Slick (yellow) with a few yards of backing.

 

I think you spooled it up the right way.  Shimano 1000 is going to hold 95 yds of 10# braid, that's up to the top, at the bevel is going to be more like 80 yds.  A few yards of backing or none at all is the way I'd go.  We all have our preferences and mine is not to use a long leader, do not like a knot going thru the top guide especially on a rod like a 6'6 where the eye sometimes is on the small side.  My leaders are about 20", if I plan on changing lures I'll use a duolock snap, worm or jig no snap.  I know a lot of people use long leaders so they don't have to retie as often, whether I tie line to leader or use a swivel I don't think it takes much time to attach a new one.  The shorter leader will prevent any coiling on the spool, no need for a line conditioner, which I've never seen any advantage on braid.  Not a recommendation, just the way I do it.

[Oregon Native]

I believe if your not a line watcher your going to miss a lot of bites....period. With that said I use a six to sevenish foot leader (fluro) (10# power pro main). I have used from 6 to 10 lb leaders also on this line with great success.

Tight Lines

[michang5]

Update: Really no difference in terms of bowing/slack line between 10# and 20% braid. Length of leader between 8-14' didn't make much difference either.

Got my first wind knots with the 10# braid when I snagged, jerked and snapped the line at the lure. Advantage: 20#.

I was able to get a bit more casting distance with the 10# line, but that could have easily been the differences in rod and reel brands and reel size. But I'll say advantage: 10#.

I brought in three good fish (3.5, 3.0, and 4.0) with no noticeable strain on the braid or 6# leader.

So other than being able to spool more 10# on a size 10 reel, I don't think there is a strong reason to buy and carry both lines. I suspect I will only buy 20# braid moving forward and carry 6# and 10# fluoro for different leaders.

[SirSnookalot]

The best thing about my stradics is that I've never ever had a wind knot with about 5 years of almost daily use. I don't use my 4000's in freshwater, loaded with 15 and 20# PP braid I think using lures a bit heavier and a different casting motion has something to do with the wind knots.  I get wind knots almost every time I freshwater fish, lighter lures, more snap casts and smaller spools could be the culprits, line size didn't seem to be too relevant. 

[Darren.]

Update: Really no difference in terms of bowing/slack line between 10# and 20% braid. Length of leader between 8-14' didn't make much difference either.

Got my first wind knots with the 10# braid when I snagged, jerked and snapped the line at the lure. Advantage: 20#.

I was able to get a bit more casting distance with the 10# line, but that could have easily been the differences in rod and reel brands and reel size. But I'll say advantage: 10#.

I brought in three good fish (3.5, 3.0, and 4.0) with no noticeable strain on the braid or 6# leader.

So other than being able to spool more 10# on a size 10 reel, I don't think there is a strong reason to buy and carry both lines. I suspect I will only buy 20# braid moving forward and carry 6# and 10# fluoro for different leaders.

 

Do whatever you're most comfortable with. Not everyone wants/likes to fish 10# test, especially Power Pro given it is only 2# diameter equivalent. That's a seriously thin line.

 

I have had a few wind knots with 10#. They're a pain. Bowing can certainly be an issue, but I (try to) keep the casts low trajectory and put the rod tip down right away.

 

As for "snapping", yes, it can. I've caught some big bass with knots in the line, drag and playing the fish were the solutions. I've also snagged a number of times, but the line is very tough to break on a steady pull. I've straightened hooks on many different leaders. Quick, hard jerks of the line is a different force on the line and can snap it at the knots, or any abraded spots. Of course this isn't 100% of the time. Steady pulls can snap at the knots, too, depends...

 

Just my experiences with the line. 20# goes on my baitcasting gear, light by some standards, but more than strong enough to bring in some big fish, logs, and waterlogged boots. My PB was caught on an older BC I've got that I had spooled with 10lb Fireline + 10lb YoZuri Hybrid leader, caught the 7.5 beastie who came in with another couple pounds of thick salad slop. Lines held up fantastically.

 

You sound like you've got a good plan with what you want to do. That's what's important. Fish like YOU want to, not how I do it. But if you have a few minutes, this might give you some additional insight, from Gary Yamamoto: http://www.insideline.net/weeklynews/2008/08-0529.html. It helped me.

[ww2farmer]

I wacky rig with 10lb braid and an 8lb fluoro leader on spinning tackle, and with 30lb braid, and a 17lb fluoro leader on casting gear in cover. With the heavier line I add a little weight to get it to sink as fast as it would on the light line.

[Wayne P.]

Do whatever you're most comfortable with. Not everyone wants/likes to fish 10# test, especially Power Pro given it is only 2# diameter equivalent. That's a seriously thin line.

 

I have had a few wind knots with 10#. They're a pain. Bowing can certainly be an issue, but I (try to) keep the casts low trajectory and put the rod tip down right away.

 

As for "snapping", yes, it can. I've caught some big bass with knots in the line, drag and playing the fish were the solutions. I've also snagged a number of times, but the line is very tough to break on a steady pull. I've straightened hooks on many different leaders. Quick, hard jerks of the line is a different force on the line and can snap it at the knots, or any abraded spots. Of course this isn't 100% of the time. Steady pulls can snap at the knots, too, depends...

 

Just my experiences with the line. 20# goes on my baitcasting gear, light by some standards, but more than strong enough to bring in some big fish, logs, and waterlogged boots. My PB was caught on an older BC I've got that I had spooled with 10lb Fireline + 10lb YoZuri Hybrid leader, caught the 7.5 beastie who came in with another couple pounds of thick salad slop. Lines held up fantastically.

 

You sound like you've got a good plan with what you want to do. That's what's important. Fish like YOU want to, not how I do it. But if you have a few minutes, this might give you some additional insight, from Gary Yamamoto: http://www.insideline.net/weeklynews/2008/08-0529.html. It helped me.

 

Your analysis is correct about the small diameter lines. The term that applies is "lack of shock strength"

That is why the diameter of a superline should be the determining factor, not the rated strength.