Curado Gone!!

[curtis9]

I think curado 50e was always $199. They didn't change the price when they changed the color and the name. The 200e increased from $179 to $199.

[curtis9]

I'd like to see a 5:1 and 7:1 gear ratio in a new 50 sized curado.

I'd also like to see them offer tuning options, like spools and handles.

[tomustang]

Probably be better off burying the curado name and coming out with a new name.

[VolFan]

I agree with Tomustang. Too many opinions and emotions in "Curado." Put it to bed and have a truly new product.

[Crankinstein]

I agree with Tomustang. Too many opinions and emotions in "Curado." Put it to bed and have a truly new product.

 

I could go for that as long as they made the new design with some unique features to allow it to not just be another Curado with a new name. I like how Daiwa brought the TWS into the Tatula for that price range so maybe Shimano will take a feature from one its higher end reels and offer it in this price range too, within reason ofcourse. Maybe a new break adjustment like the Metanium and Antares have where the break has its standard internal break adjustment with the side plate off but also has a small dial on the bottom for small adjustments. I could see them also offering some wide ranges in gear ratio and size as well which would bring up the size 50 option we've been discussing. I think what I'm getting at is if they make a completely new reel I would like to see it have a "signature feature" otherwise its just going to be a revamped Curado.

[bootytrain]

I'd like to see a 5:1 and 7:1 gear ratio in a new 50 sized curado.

I'd also like to see them offer tuning options, like spools and handles.

If I'm not mistaken you can put the core 50 gears into a curado/chronarch 50 and get 7:1, and the Aldebaran 5.8 gears should fit too

[curtis9]

If I'm not mistaken you can put the core 50 gears into a curado/chronarch 50 and get 7:1, and the Aldebaran 5.8 gears should fit too

 

I think that's correct, but that's an extra $30-40 to by the gears, plus cost or time to change them out.

 

I'd like to see the other gear options available stock.

[rockchalk06]

I could go for that as long as they made the new design with some unique features to allow it to not just be another Curado with a new name. I like how Daiwa brought the TWS into the Tatula for that price range so maybe Shimano will take a feature from one its higher end reels and offer it in this price range too, within reason ofcourse. Maybe a new break adjustment like the Metanium and Antares have where the break has its standard internal break adjustment with the side plate off but also has a small dial on the bottom for small adjustments. I could see them also offering some wide ranges in gear ratio and size as well which would bring up the size 50 option we've been discussing. I think what I'm getting at is if they make a completely new reel I would like to see it have a "signature feature" otherwise its just going to be a revamped Curado.

 

I could do without all of that over the Micro Gearing. I wish they would bring that to every reel they make.

[QUAKEnSHAKE]

I could do without all of that over the Micro Gearing. I wish they would bring that to every reel they make.

 

Im not certain but would think micro gearing requires x-ship as well. The x-ship gives the extra support need to hold the smaller teeth in place to keep from stripping.

[rockchalk06]

Im not certain but would think micro gearing requires x-ship as well. The x-ship gives the extra support need to hold the smaller teeth in place to keep from stripping.

 

Could be, I'm not sure on how it works. I've had a couple people tell me its super quiet in the high speed reels.

[bootytrain]

Im not certain but would think micro gearing requires x-ship as well. The x-ship gives the extra support need to hold the smaller teeth in place to keep from stripping.

Xship does not require micro gears. Micro gears is just the size of the gear teeth. "X-Ship provides improved gear durability. By supporting the pinion gear on both ends with bearings, the pinion gear maintains precise alignment with the drive gear. This means the gears will stay in the same position under the heaviest loads. The added benefit is that friction between the spool shaft and gear are eliminated. This will enhance the casting performance of the reel with lighter lures, and allow for longer casts." That's from shimanos website which about sums it up.  You wont feel the x ship until the reel is cranking under load.  I can tell you this much, X Ship, micro gears with Shimanos HEG is the real deal.  I was fighting a 3lb largemouth with the Metanium and while I was cranking it in on one of its runs the sensation was so smooth that I thought I had my drag off, so I looked down and saw that line was indeed coming in my drag was tightened down. I think the reason it works so well is the long shaft spool design Shimano uses. Daiwa imitated this design on the Tatula and call theirs "Air Rotation".

 

I don't think the new curado will have micro gears but I wouldn't be surprised if it has X Ship which would be awesome.

[Smallmouth Hunter]

Xship does not require micro gears. Micro gears is just the size of the gear teeth. "X-Ship provides improved gear durability. By supporting the pinion gear on both ends with bearings, the pinion gear maintains precise alignment with the drive gear. This means the gears will stay in the same position under the heaviest loads. The added benefit is that friction between the spool shaft and gear are eliminated. This will enhance the casting performance of the reel with lighter lures, and allow for longer casts." That's from shimanos website which about sums it up.  You wont feel the x ship until the reel is cranking under load.  I can tell you this much, X Ship, micro gears with Shimanos HEG is the real deal.  I was fighting a 3lb largemouth with the Metanium and while I was cranking it in on one of its runs the sensation was so smooth that I thought I had my drag off, so I looked down and saw that line was indeed coming in my drag was tightened down. I think the reason it works so well is the long shaft spool design Shimano uses. Daiwa imitated this design on the Tatula and call theirs "Air Rotation".

 

I don't think the new curado will have micro gears but I wouldn't be surprised if it has X Ship which would be awesome.

Air rotation is NOT the same thing as x-ship. It is not the same thing at all. Air rotation is the single bearing supported pinion gear. X-ship is a double bearing supported pinion gear. Daiwa has never made a reel with a double supported pinion gear. Air rotation is simply what Shimano has been doing for years where there is one bearing on the inner side end of the pinion gear.

 

X-ship is shown in the right side gear set.

Couldn't find a great picture, but on the left there is a set of gears that are standard HEG gears. Not sure what reel they are from, but I would guess a curado, chronarch, or citica. Notice how the end of the pinion gear (end with the notches for spool pin) is flat so it will fit in the bearing.

 

X-ship is shown in the right along with micro gearing. The end of the bearing with the notches for holding the spool pin is flat like the left side gearset because it fits into a bearing. Notice how the other end is slightly elongated. This also fits into a bearing. The pinion gear is thus supported by two bearings; one on each end to insure precision.

 

Now here is a picture of the tatula's air rotation single bearing supported pinion gear:

There is no way that this pinion gear could possibly be supported by another bearing because there is just no room for it. The end of the pinion gear that is not shown in the above pic is the bearing supported end. This is a copy of what Shimano does in their curado/chronarch e, citica e, g series reels, etc.

 

To conclude: X-ship = 2 bearings; Air rotation = 1 bearing, what shimano has been doing for years.

[bootytrain]

Air rotation is NOT the same thing as x-ship. It is not the same thing at all. Air rotation is the single bearing supported pinion gear. X-ship is a double bearing supported pinion gear. Daiwa has never made a reel with a double supported pinion gear. Air rotation is simply what Shimano has been doing for years where there is one bearing on the inner side end of the pinion gear.

 

X-ship is shown in the right side gear set.

Couldn't find a great picture, but on the left there is a set of gears that are standard HEG gears. Not sure what reel they are from, but I would guess a curado, chronarch, or citica. Notice how the end of the pinion gear (end with the notches for spool pin) is flat so it will fit in the bearing.

 

X-ship is shown in the right along with micro gearing. The end of the bearing with the notches for holding the spool pin is flat like the left side gearset because it fits into a bearing. Notice how the other end is slightly elongated. This also fits into a bearing. The pinion gear is thus supported by two bearings; one on each end to insure precision.

 

Now here is a picture of the tatula's air rotation single bearing supported pinion gear:

There is no way that this pinion gear could possibly be supported by another bearing because there is just no room for it. The end of the pinion gear that is not shown in the above pic is the bearing supported end. This is a copy of what Shimano does in their curado/chronarch e, citica e, g series reels, etc.

 

To conclude: X-ship = 2 bearings; Air rotation = 1 bearing, what shimano has been doing for years.

The first pic shows a standard gear set vs a micro module gear set, not x ship. X ship is basically an extra bearing to support the pinion to keep it aligned under load. Shimano put X ship in the Calcutta D which does NOT have Micro gears. Micro gears came out with the new Antares. The Exsence DC has X ship but NOT micro gearing. You may want to watch this video to educate yourself.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvvBcfwEuic  Because of the long spool shaft Shimano only really needs 2 bearings at the ends of the spools shafts like they normally have and still have a smooth and powerful retrieve.  But the 3rd "x ship" bearing helps a lot under load.

 

Daiwas normally have a short "free floating" spool shaft so that's 2 different spool shaft designs, but in the Lexa and Tatula they went with a long spool shaft like Shimano. And since we are quoting Tackle Tour..

"In one of Daiwa's early "Project T" videos, they introduce the concept of "Air Rotation" by spinning the handle of a prototype Tatula and showing how freely that handle spins without additional assistance. Their marketing material claims this is enabled through more precise, digitally designed and cut gearing. When I viewed this feature, my immediate thought was they probably added another bearing to the pinion gear similar to the recent implementation by one of their competitors. There's little we can do to verify claims of precision gearing, but I did take the reel apart to see if I could find another bearing under the pinion gear. Lo and behold, there indeed are two bearings supporting the pinion which in and of itself could explain that new, smoother, Air Rotation sensation." 

 

 

BTW those "Air Rotation" gears don't look any more precision cut than any other gears, Im gonna assume its just marketing hype by Daiwa.

[iabass8]

Air rotation is NOT the same thing as x-ship. It is not the same thing at all. Air rotation is the single bearing supported pinion gear. X-ship is a double bearing supported pinion gear. Daiwa has never made a reel with a double supported pinion gear. Air rotation is simply what Shimano has been doing for years where there is one bearing on the inner side end of the pinion gear.

 

X-ship is shown in the right side gear set.

Couldn't find a great picture, but on the left there is a set of gears that are standard HEG gears. Not sure what reel they are from, but I would guess a curado, chronarch, or citica. Notice how the end of the pinion gear (end with the notches for spool pin) is flat so it will fit in the bearing.

 

X-ship is shown in the right along with micro gearing. The end of the bearing with the notches for holding the spool pin is flat like the left side gearset because it fits into a bearing. Notice how the other end is slightly elongated. This also fits into a bearing. The pinion gear is thus supported by two bearings; one on each end to insure precision.

 

Now here is a picture of the tatula's air rotation single bearing supported pinion gear:

There is no way that this pinion gear could possibly be supported by another bearing because there is just no room for it. The end of the pinion gear that is not shown in the above pic is the bearing supported end. This is a copy of what Shimano does in their curado/chronarch e, citica e, g series reels, etc.

 

To conclude: X-ship = 2 bearings; Air rotation = 1 bearing, what shimano has been doing for years.

First off this is Xship-The DUAL BEARING support

 

Secondly, Xship is not something Shimano has been doing for years. It's relativity new to shimano within the past few years. Daiwa has been using this dual bearing supported gear (xship) around a decade (that's 10 years incase you can't research that either) before shimano coined it as Xship.

[The Rooster]

Well X-ship apparently isn't very expensive to do because even my cheap $40 Pflueger Trion spinning reel from years ago has a double bearing supported pinion gear inside. Hopefully Shimano isn't building this up and charging a bunch extra for it.

[bootytrain]

First off this is Xship-The DUAL BEARING support

 

Secondly, Xship is not something Shimano has been doing for years. It's relativity new to shimano within the past few years. Daiwa has been using this dual bearing supported gear (xship) around a decade (that's 10 years incase you can't research that either) before shimano coined it as Xship.

I think the "short" free floating spool shaft design Daiwa uses necessitated a 3rd bearing by design, while Shimano could have stayed with a 2 bearing design and been perfectly fine since the spool shaft basically goes from one side of the reel to the other so you could get away with using only 2 bearings. I mean has any Shimano been lacking in smoothness and power before x ship?  X ship just took it up a notch under load. My point is that Daiwa used the long shimano style spool shaft for the Tatula and added a bearing as the picture showed and Tackletour pointed it out in their review as to what they think the Air Rotation sensation really came from. I tend to believe them because Im pretty sure all reels(gears included) have been designed with CAD for the past 20 years or longer. So saying you "digitally designed" your gears makes me think marketing terminology. That being said, I hope the new Curado has X ship! lol

[QUAKEnSHAKE]

Xship does not require micro gears. Micro gears is just the size of the gear teeth. "X-Ship provides improved gear durability. By supporting the pinion gear on both ends with bearings, the pinion gear maintains precise alignment with the drive gear. This means the gears will stay in the same position under the heaviest loads..

 

Yes that I know and not what I was getting at.

Its that I think micro gears require the use of x-ship to do as you & I stated.

If micro gears didnt have the extra support given by x-ship the gears small teeth might misalign under load.

[Smallmouth Hunter]

First off this is Xship-The DUAL BEARING support

 

Secondly, Xship is not something Shimano has been doing for years. It's relativity new to shimano within the past few years. Daiwa has been using this dual bearing supported gear (xship) around a decade (that's 10 years incase you can't research that either)   before shimano coined it as Xship.

Did you even read the post?? You're telling me I can't research something, and you can't even read a dang paragraph before you start bashing me over something that isn't even true.

You are just repeating what I said.

I clearly stated SEVERAL times that x-ship is a double bearing supported pinion gear. Also, NEVER said x-ship has been used for years, I said they used the single bearing supported pinion gear (which daiwa calls air rotation) for a while now. I think ever since the D series..? Or maybe the SF reels were the first.. Not sure

 

Never knew that Daiwa used a dual bearing supported pinion gear though. I am guessing they use that on reels with a free-floating spool?

The first pic shows a standard gear set vs a micro module gear set, not x ship. X ship is basically an extra bearing to support the pinion to keep it aligned under load. Shimano put X ship in the Calcutta D which does NOT have Micro gears. Micro gears came out with the new Antares. The Exsence DC has X ship but NOT micro gearing. You may want to watch this video to educate yourself.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvvBcfwEuic  Because of the long spool shaft Shimano only really needs 2 bearings at the ends of the spools shafts like they normally have and still have a smooth and powerful retrieve.  But the 3rd "x ship" bearing helps a lot under load.

 

Daiwas normally have a short "free floating" spool shaft so that's 2 different spool shaft designs, but in the Lexa and Tatula they went with a long spool shaft like Shimano. And since we are quoting Tackle Tour..

"In one of Daiwa's early "Project T" videos, they introduce the concept of "Air Rotation" by spinning the handle of a prototype Tatula and showing how freely that handle spins without additional assistance. Their marketing material claims this is enabled through more precise, digitally designed and cut gearing. When I viewed this feature, my immediate thought was they probably added another bearing to the pinion gear similar to the recent implementation by one of their competitors. There's little we can do to verify claims of precision gearing, but I did take the reel apart to see if I could find another bearing under the pinion gear. Lo and behold, there indeed are two bearings supporting the pinion which in and of itself could explain that new, smoother, Air Rotation sensation." 

 

 

 

BTW those "Air Rotation" gears don't look any more precision cut than any other gears, Im gonna assume its just marketing hype by Daiwa.

Very interesting vid. Thanks for the link.

 

Pause it at 3:48. You will see the exact same pinion gear in that photo I posted above. It has a elongated flat section extending from the outer end (end facing away from inside). That is what the bearing rides on. The picture I posted does show x-ship in the right side gear set, and to prove it in case anyone is doubtful, the picture is from a review of the metanium (mm gearing and x-ship).

 

Air rotation can not be a dual bearing supported pinion gear. There is no room for another bearing on the pinion gear anyways:

The shown end of the pinion gear has no flat section for a bearing to ride on. There is another bearing in the sideplate next to this bearing, but it is not exactly supporting the pinion gear, per se.

 

I didn't mean to start up some huge argument, and I think we are all agreeing on the same thing here anyways.

[basshole8190]

You darn reel guys have got me all kinds of confused over internal stuff inside the reels. give me a reel with high speed ratio that can cast a lure btween 3/8-1&1/2 oz smooth drag and easy to palm and call it a night

[Grantman83]

You darn reel guys have got me all kinds of confused over internal stuff inside the reels. give me a reel with high speed ratio that can cast a lure btween 3/8-1&1/2 oz smooth drag and easy to palm and call it a night

Ha but the bearing placement makes the reel smooth! It confuses me as well lol

[Loop_Dad]

You darn reel guys have got me all kinds of confused over internal stuff inside the reels. give me a reel with high speed ratio that can cast a lure btween 3/8-1&1/2 oz smooth drag and easy to palm and call it a night

 

Yeah you guys are geeks

[bootytrain]

Did you even read the post?? You're telling me I can't research something, and you can't even read a dang paragraph before you start bashing me over something that isn't even true.

You are just repeating what I said.

I clearly stated SEVERAL times that x-ship is a double bearing supported pinion gear. Also, NEVER said x-ship has been used for years, I said they used the single bearing supported pinion gear (which daiwa calls air rotation) for a while now. I think ever since the D series..? Or maybe the SF reels were the first.. Not sure

 

Never knew that Daiwa used a dual bearing supported pinion gear though. I am guessing they use that on reels with a free-floating spool?

Very interesting vid. Thanks for the link.

 

Pause it at 3:48. You will see the exact same pinion gear in that photo I posted above. It has a elongated flat section extending from the outer end (end facing away from inside). That is what the bearing rides on. The picture I posted does show x-ship in the right side gear set, and to prove it in case anyone is doubtful, the picture is from a review of the metanium (mm gearing and x-ship).

 

Air rotation can not be a dual bearing supported pinion gear. There is no room for another bearing on the pinion gear anyways:

The shown end of the pinion gear has no flat section for a bearing to ride on. There is another bearing in the sideplate next to this bearing, but it is not exactly supporting the pinion gear, per se.

 

I didn't mean to start up some huge argument, and I think we are all agreeing on the same thing here anyways.

 

This is the picture that is directly under the picture you posted from the Tackle Tour review of the Tatula where they find the extra bearing lol.. how did you miss that?

 

Micro Module is just smaller teeth for more contact points and does not require x ship.

I wasn't trying to argue either   I just spend a lot of time on the TT forums and Bantam 1 gets a ton of these questions in the shimano support forum and does a lot of explanation on Shimano tech

[Smallmouth Hunter]

This is the picture that is directly under the picture you posted from the Tackle Tour review of the Tatula where they find the extra bearing lol.. how did you miss that?

 

Micro Module is just smaller teeth for more contact points and does not require x ship.

I wasn't trying to argue either   I just spend a lot of time on the TT forums and Bantam 1 gets a ton of these questions in the shimano support forum and does a lot of explanation on Shimano tech

I didn't miss that. Heck, I have taken the tatula apart 4-5 times now and even cleaned that bearing myself. I knew quite well there was a bearing there. Hasn't this is design been used by Shimano for a few years now (since I believe the SF reels)?

 

There is a bearing on the end of the pinion gear that points towards the spool (which the pinion gear obviously rides inside during retrieve), but there is not a second bearing (on the opposite end) which the pinion gear would ride in and therefore, air rotation is not the same thing as x-ship because x-ship is when the pinion gear rides on two bearings.

 

[QUAKEnSHAKE]

What shimano reel has Micro Modular Gearing but not X-ship???

[bootytrain]

I didn't miss that. Heck, I have taken the tatula apart 4-5 times now and even cleaned that bearing myself. I knew quite well there was a bearing there. Hasn't this is design been used by Shimano for a few years now (since I believe the SF reels)?

 

There is a bearing on the end of the pinion gear that points towards the spool (which the pinion gear obviously rides inside during retrieve), but there is not a second bearing (on the opposite end) which the pinion gear would ride in and therefore, air rotation is not the same thing as x-ship because x-ship is when the pinion gear rides on two bearings.

 

 

Just curious, what does that bearing support then? Theres no bearing under the cast control cap?  Im not sure of the older model shimanos because Ive only started using baitcasters recently. But other than the Met, Exsence and Aldebaran BFS, my shimanos only have 2 bearings supporting the spool. One under the cast control and one on the other side in the palming side plate. Im looking forward to getting a Tatula