Measuring Line Question

[camovan]

I have never really used backing on lines but was thinking about starting this. I have a new reel coming in today that I want to spool with 65# braid and I want to use only 75 yards of that as the top shot (150 yard spool). So how do I measure out or calculate the amount of backing to put on before switching to the braid? I was just planning on walking out the 75 yards of braid to measure that but I am stumped on exactly how much of the backer to use.

[roadwarrior]

00 Mod has posted a practical solution:

 

Attach a 1/2 oz weight to the cheap line you are using for backing. 

Cast out as far as you can on grass. Put your rod down and walk

off the line all the way to the weight. That's two casting distances.

Cut the line and attach the braid, then fill your spool.

[J Francho]

You can get one of these: http://www.basspro.com/Berkley-Line-Counter/product/10220051/

[Goose52]

This almost takes longer to type than to do...but, if you have the room to walk-out the line then:

 

Walk-out until you have the 75 yards of braid and cut the line. Tape an end of the braid to your spool and crank all that onto the reel. Then, using your knot of choice (uni-uni, etc.) tie on your backing. Crank that on until the spool is full and cut the backing. THEN, walk the combined backing and braid out. Go to the backing end of the line, secure to the spool (arbor knot), then crank it all back in.  You will have the perfect amount of backing and the spool will be full.  This works with braid since you don't have a problem with coiling/memory like you would with flouro.  Of course, you need to have an area to walk all the line out (I use my 100 ft driveway and use pylons at each end - you can also go to a park, football field, etc., if you don't have room at home). 

 

After some trim-backs, knot tying, etc., when your spool level gets low, you can walk-out all the line, attach the braid end to the spool again, crank it all back on, add more backing until the spool is full, than walk it all back out, reverse the line, crank it back in, and the spool is full again with the braid on top.  You will probably only need to add to the backing once - after that you will have only 30-40 yards of braid left (less than a cast-length) and you can then pull that 30-40 yard section, use it for backing on another reel, and install your second 75 yard section of the 65lb.

 

Folks will say this is too much work...but it really only takes about 10 minutes to do.  I do have an advantage in that I have 50ft and 100ft markers on my driveway so I have known distances for measuring, along with a set of pylons, so I can easily walk- out and reel-in line in short order.

 

[WRB]

Pull line between your hands until your arms are fully extended, one arm span, measure that Length. Example 60 inches.

If you want 75 yards of line removed, pull off 45 arm span lengths; 75 yds = 225 ft or 2,700 inches divided by arm span inches (60). Once you know your arm span, it's fast and easy.

Tom

[seekonkBass]

You could always do the math based on how many inches per crank your reel retrieves. So if you have a 125 yard reel spool that retrieves at 26" per turn it takes approximately 173 full cranks to retrieve 125 yards. So 50 yards is 40% of the capacity while 75 yards is 60% of the capacity. Therefore 69 cranks will spool up 50 yards of line on to your spool and 104 cranks will spool the remaining 75 yards on to your spool. Pretty simple.

If you're not a big fan of math let me know how many yard your spool holds and the retrieve rate in inches and I'll do the math for you

[WRB]

You could always do the math based on how many inches per crank your reel retrieves. So if you have a 125 yard reel spool that retrieves at 26" per turn it takes approximately 173 full cranks to retrieve 125 yards. So 50 yards is 40% of the capacity while 75 yards is 60% of the capacity. Therefore 69 cranks will spool up 50 yards of line on to your spool and 104 cranks will spool the remaining 75 yards on to your spool. Pretty simple.

If you're not a big fan of math let me know how many yard your spool holds and the retrieve rate in inches and I'll do the math for you

How many inches of line is recovered at 50% spool capacity with a reel rated at 26" per handle revolution?

Tom

[J Francho]

How many inches of line is recovered at 50% spool capacity with a reel rated at 26" per handle revolution?

 

Sounds like a job for algebraic calculus!

[seekonkBass]

How many inches of line is recovered at 50% spool capacity with a reel rated at 26" per handle revolution?

Tom

I get your point but the difference will be negligible and would vary slightly based on line diameter. However, with the spool being small in diameter to begin with and the fact that an exact amount is not a make or break event the variance should be less than a yard with either the backing or final product.

[WRB]

I get your point but the difference will be negligible and would vary slightly based on line diameter. However, with the spool being small in diameter to begin with and the fact that an exact amount is not a make or break event the variance should be less than a yard with either the backing or final product.

How about nearly 1/2; most low profile bass reels with 6.3 to 1 ratios having 26" retrieve rates are about 13" at 50% spool capacity. I would say that is significant.

The average 26 + 13 = 39 / 2 = 19" (18.5" ) per handle rotation may get you closer to an ball park number. Just pulling your string a little.

Tom

[seekonkBass]

So the retrieve rate is only accurate when the spool is full?

[seekonkBass]

How about nearly 1/2; most low profile bass reels with 6.3 to 1 ratios having 26" retrieve rates are about 13" at 50% spool capacity. I would say that is significant.

The average 26 + 13 = 39 / 2 = 19" (18.5" ) per handle rotation may get you closer to an ball park number. Just pulling your string a little.

Tom

I'll just sit over here an let the adults speak... Let me know if ya need me. Lol

[J Francho]

So the retrieve rate is only accurate when the spool is full?

 

The ratio is constant, but the circumference changes, therefore so does inches per turn (IPT).  As you cast line out, the circumference decreases, and so does the retrieve rate.

[WRB]

I'll just sit over here an let the adults speak... Let me know if ya need me. Lol

Don't let it get to you, it wasn't fair to bait you. Everyone is equal, we are just fisherman at the end of the day.

Tom

[camovan]

OK, so there is no easy way, got it!  LOL

 

  

00 Mod has posted a practical solution:

 

Attach a 1/2 oz weight to the cheap line you are using for backing. 

Cast out as far as you can on grass. Put your rod down and walk

off the line all the way to the weight. That's two casting distances.

Cut the line and attach the braid, then fill your spool.

 

This is without a doubt the most practical approach. 

 

 

You can get one of these: http://www.basspro.com/Berkley-Line-Counter/product/10220051/

 

The line counter idea won't work because I have no idea how much to count off 

 

This almost takes longer to type than to do...but, if you have the room to walk-out the line then:

 

Walk-out until you have the 75 yards of braid and cut the line. Tape an end of the braid to your spool and crank all that onto the reel. Then, using your knot of choice (uni-uni, etc.) tie on your backing. Crank that on until the spool is full and cut the backing. THEN, walk the combined backing and braid out. Go to the backing end of the line, secure to the spool (arbor knot), then crank it all back in.  You will have the perfect amount of backing and the spool will be full.  This works with braid since you don't have a problem with coiling/memory like you would with flouro.  Of course, you need to have an area to walk all the line out (I use my 100 ft driveway and use pylons at each end - you can also go to a park, football field, etc., if you don't have room at home). 

 

After some trim-backs, knot tying, etc., when your spool level gets low, you can walk-out all the line, attach the braid end to the spool again, crank it all back on, add more backing until the spool is full, than walk it all back out, reverse the line, crank it back in, and the spool is full again with the braid on top.  You will probably only need to add to the backing once - after that you will have only 30-40 yards of braid left (less than a cast-length) and you can then pull that 30-40 yard section, use it for backing on another reel, and install your second 75 yard section of the 65lb.

 

Folks will say this is too much work...but it really only takes about 10 minutes to do.  I do have an advantage in that I have 50ft and 100ft markers on my driveway so I have known distances for measuring, along with a set of pylons, so I can easily walk- out and reel-in line in short order.

 

This is probably the most accurate way to do it, the space isn't an issue so I will probably go this route.

 

Pull line between your hands until your arms are fully extended, one arm span, measure that Length. Example 60 inches.
If you want 75 yards of line removed, pull off 45 arm span lengths; 75 yds = 225 ft or 2,700 inches divided by arm span inches (60). Once you know your arm span, it's fast and easy.
Tom

 

The 75 yard part of the problem is the easy one

 

You could always do the math based on how many inches per crank your reel retrieves. So if you have a 125 yard reel spool that retrieves at 26" per turn it takes approximately 173 full cranks to retrieve 125 yards. So 50 yards is 40% of the capacity while 75 yards is 60% of the capacity. Therefore 69 cranks will spool up 50 yards of line on to your spool and 104 cranks will spool the remaining 75 yards on to your spool. Pretty simple.

If you're not a big fan of math let me know how many yard your spool holds and the retrieve rate in inches and I'll do the math for you

 

I'll let you do the math and I will check your work  Seriously is would be a good test to see how accurate the math is vs what I measure.

 

Backing line: Berkley Big Game 20# .018" diameter

Main Line: Power Pro 65# .016" diameter

Reel: Okuma Komodo spool capacity 95 yards .014 diameter line.  Retreive rate 31.5"

 

My guess is 20 yards.  Since this is such a small spool I am not sure it is really going to make a difference here LOL.  I probably should have done the above exercise before posting the thread but too late for that now.....

 

How many inches of line is recovered at 50% spool capacity with a reel rated at 26" per handle revolution?
Tom

 

I really don't think the 50% retrieve at 50% capacity is accurate.  The total diameter of a the spool with 50% line is only going to be fractionally different compared to the total diameter of the spool at 100% full since the bulk of the diameter comes from the spool itself.  Regardless, I will test this tonight while spooling up and report the actual results if it interest you.  I have heard this before but never seen it quantified, so I am interested in the results.

[Brian Needham]

I use 2 reels.

 

measure the distance of line I want

spool that on a empty reel top shot is now on bottom

tie on backing

fill spool till full

 

transfer to reel you are going to use

top shot now on top, with an exact amount.

 

It is a process only for the picky I know. but now I know exactly how much line I use everytime I put on new topshot.and I only have to do it once.  

and since I use Tatsu I don't want to waste any.

 

for round and easy the 00Mod way is the way to go.

[camovan]

How about nearly 1/2; most low profile bass reels with 6.3 to 1 ratios having 26" retrieve rates are about 13" at 50% spool capacity. I would say that is significant.

The average 26 + 13 = 39 / 2 = 19" (18.5" ) per handle rotation may get you closer to an ball park number. Just pulling your string a little.

Tom

 

I'm going to call this myth busted.

 

Here is what I got.

 

First 23 yards:  27 turns or 30.6 inches per turn

Last 23 yards: 26 turns or 31.6 inches per turn

 

Incidentally, I had exactly 23 yards of big game left on the spool so I just used that and filled the reel up without measuring out the braid figuring it was close enough.

[seekonkBass]

I'm going to call this myth busted.

Here is what I got.

First 23 yards: 27 turns or 30.6 inches per turn

Last 23 yards: 26 turns or 31.6 inches per turn

Incidentally, I had exactly 23 yards of big game left on the spool so I just used that and filled the reel up without measuring out the braid figuring it was close enough.

So 53 turns yielded 46 yards spoiled? Darn it I should have wagered something!!!! Lol

[camovan]

So 53 turns yielded 46 yards spoiled? Darn it I should have wagered something!!!! Lol

 

Yes, but there was also about 50 yards spooled in the middle of that.  I only measured the first 23 and last 23 yards.  It's good to know though, I read not to long ago about a tourney angler who pulled some line off his reel to help him slow down and kind of just bought onto it.  It may have made him slow down but it had nothing to do with the amount of line on the reel

[camovan]

I use 2 reels.

 

measure the distance of line I want

spool that on a empty reel top shot is now on bottom

tie on backing

fill spool till full

 

transfer to reel you are going to use

top shot now on top, with an exact amount.

 

It is a process only for the picky I know. but now I know exactly how much line I use everytime I put on new topshot.and I only have to do it once.  

and since I use Tatsu I don't want to waste any.

 

for round and easy the 00Mod way is the way to go.

 

I personally don't think thats overkill at all, I get where your coming from on the need to know the exact number for waste.  Plus like you said, your only doing it once.  My problem is that I don't have 2 of the same reels so I will probably stick to Goose's method or 00Mod's if I am in a hurry.

[SirSnookalot]

It's taken more time to read this thread than it does to respool.  How much 65# braid line does the reel hold?  My guess is less than 150 yds, for 15 bucks I wouldn't bother with backing.  Line gets worn strip off and reverse it, 2 spool ups for 7 bucks each.  Straight braid and no knots is the only way to go, no muss, no fuss , no confusion.

[tomustang]

Braid is cheap nowadays, just wing it