Lance......

[shootermcbob]

Lets sum it all up here: 1-doping is never ok in any sport or circumstance 2-two athletes that are similar but one dopes the doper has a distinct advantage 3-all athletes that dope should be banned on a second failed test 4-lance is a pompous arrogant *******-applies to many others as well but not gonna list them all 5-lance did do a lot of good for cancer research but that does not negate him cheating to gain notoriety 6-I wish I was out fishing instead if discussing lance on an Internet forum 7-I am hungry 8-my chipotle corn chowder is almost done cooking

Yes, that about sums it up.

[K_Mac]

Raider I admire your passion, and I respect your right to believe and say what you want. I could not disagree more with the "Victory or Death" world view. Winning is good, but a life well lived is of infinitely more value. 

[Raider Nation Fisher]

Raider I admire your passion, and I respect your right to believe and say what you want. I could not disagree more with the "Victory or Death" world view. Winning is good, but a life well lived is of infinitely more value.

Well thank you sir. However Im afraid we are gonna have to agree to disagree on this one. I feel life can be well lived while striving for nothing but the utmost honors and achievements of being victorious. Its all a matter of perspective. I strive for perfection in my sport. I sacrifice and suffer in the pursuit of it. The lengths I will go to, to achieve it would baffle you. Will I ever reach it? Of course not. Life is too short and only one man has ever been perfect and he isnt here anymore. However I do not act foolish and throw a temper tantrum if I lose. I accept that I am not to point yet that I feel I should be and work twice as hard for the next time. One learns from their failures and will be stronger from them. I think I lead a good life. I dont lie, steal, do drugs, drink or do other reprehensible acts. I just think that one can lead a good life and still strive for Victory in all things.

[Brian Needham]

just joining in this.....yeah Lance is a POS for lying all this time and all that.....but can't be mad just cause he cheated better than everyone else.

 

with that being said, he lost ANY shred of respect I would ever give him(doping or not) when he said the ONLY reason he was cured of cancer was SOLELY the advances of modern medicine.

[flyfisher]

In the cycling world dopers win no matter how hard you train. I think this past tour was the first in a very long time that a person who doped didn't win.

What sport do you play and what was your highest level achieved, just curious.

[K_Mac]

Raider when you get to my age you understand that there will be victories and losses along the way. Striving to be be the best and pushing past barriers has enabled me to do things I didn't think I could do, yet some of my most important life lessons have been learned in defeat. As others have said here, success is not measured in wins and losses, or dollars in the bank. Living and playing with heart, integrity, and honor are the real measure of a man IMO.

[Brian Needham]

, Add Lance to the list with Tiger woods, Pete Rose, Michael Vick, Dennis Rodman, Mark Maguire, jose Conseco, rodger clemens, tanya harding, lawrence taylor, o.j. simpson....ect, you get the idea.

Great athletes that will not be remembered for how good they were at their sport.

You can probably add Terrell Owens to the list too...lol

 

LOL...YOU LEAVE PETE OUTTA THIS!  He deserves the HOF more than most the people already there! LOL

 

whoops, well that's a WHOLE 'nother can of worms there....

[flyfisher]

I agree. Charlie hustle really shouldn't be on the list.....

[Broke bass fisherman]

Until we as a society say no more this will continue. In high school football in Alabama the players take supplements. This isn't something that's discussed you just do it. So you get 30 young kids who learn at a critical time that taking supplements to enhance my body is appropriate and not wrong in any sense. Why? So they can win football games for a little Podunk town that most of them won't ever make it out of.

We put out athletes on such high pedastals that the only place they can go is down. Remember when Michael Jordan was the laughing stock of the nation for trying to play baseball? Until we lower out expectations how can we expect these athletes to quit doping.

Baseball revenues where in a slump then what not one, not two, but three people go chasing the HR record. Funny not a single commentator said anything about the statistical improbability of three people getting that close.

We applaud and reward those who succed, those who don't are cast out to ESPN, Fox and the like destined to become annoying commentators.

We as a society are just as guilty. We allow this to happen and like the cycling authority turn the other way.

P.S. might have broken the soapbox with that rant.

[flyfisher]

Can you define supplements?

Also everyone laughed at Jordan because he sucked and only got a shot because he was Jordan.

I agree that people want the highlights etc...but society isn't to blame for someone taking PED's. it is your choice and your conscience you have to live with if you cheat. The other piece about baseball is that while it was against the rules to use PED's they weren't testing, which is dumb all on its own, so people ran with it much like romanowski in the nfl who said he never cheated but he also never hesitated to be one step ahead and take whatever he could that was legal.

[Broke bass fisherman]

Creatine was specifically what they where using. Which is a PED. Legal as it is.

You make good points about baseball, but that is the point I was referring to. They didn't want to test because of the race to the record.

[Quillback]

I wonder how Lance avoided getting the PED enhanced huge noggin like Barry Bonds?  Must have had better advice on what to take.

 

Lance taking PED's, does not bother me so much in that it was in a sport where apparently they all did it, at least the top riders.  What is wrong, very wrong, is that Lance vigorously denied taking PED's, and sued (and won) friends, and team mates.  Some of these people were just average folks and Lance destroyed their lives and took everything they had.  I'm hoping some prosecutor somewhere takes Lance to court on criminal fraud charges, and I hope he gets 20 years in the pen.  Maybe he'll share a cell with Bernie Madoff, another lying piece of garbage that took people's life savings.

 

What Lance did is way beyond just taking PED's. 

[Raider Nation Fisher]

Can you define supplements?

Also everyone laughed at Jordan because he sucked and only got a shot because he was Jordan.

I agree that people want the highlights etc...but society isn't to blame for someone taking PED's. it is your choice and your conscience you have to live with if you cheat. The other piece about baseball is that while it was against the rules to use PED's they weren't testing, which is dumb all on its own, so people ran with it much like romanowski in the nfl who said he never cheated but he also never hesitated to be one step ahead and take whatever he could that was legal.

Supplements break down into four main catergories.

Natural. Which is herbs and roots as well as food and what have you. Such as Tribulus Terrestris which is a natural testosterone booster. And foods such as black eyed peas (testosterone booster) and red meat (protein, BCAAs, and creatine). Yes food is a supplement when taken in high enough quantities.

Fish oil is also a natural supplement (Omega 3). Caffeine is a huge one.

Synthesized. Being supplements that are created from foods or synthesized in a lab.

Common ones being. Creatine, whey protein isolate, D-Aspartic Acid, BCAAs (branch chain amino acids), Arginine, etc.

Most sulplements sold at stores contain one or more synthesized supplements with a blend of herbs and roots so as to increase the price. Yes they do work to increase your body systems potential and when taken with exercise and some form of diet can have staggering positive effects. It all a matter of stacking them the right way and dosing them correctly.

Pro Hormones. These are the precursors to actual hormones. Generally testosterone and other Anabolic compounds. They are relatively new and can be extremely dangerous. Due to the sometimes unpredictable effects and side effects they have. You would be better off taking Anabolics instead of Pro hormones. The effects are better and they are probably better for your health. They are legal and can be purchased from most health stores. As with taking Anabolic Steroids these do require PCT (post cycle therapy) after completing a cycle. This is due ro the fact that they will cause certain body systems to stop producing hormones and to counter certain side effects such as gyno.

Anabolic steroids. These ARE hormones. Plain and simple. They are either derived from human or animal hormones. Generally testosterone. They have been around for a long time and have had tons of research done on them. They are the pinnacle of all supplements and are illegal for sports and recreational use. Some examples would be Tren, Anadol, HGH (human growth hormone), Gorilla Test, D-Bol, and others. These supplements do require PCT due to the shutting down of testosterone production in the body and to mitagate the side effects that the massive amounts of test can have on the bodies systems. This is usually accomplished by taking different hormones in smaller doses. There is more information on the effects and side effects of anabolics and on taking them safely. However I dont think Glenn would approve of me giving a lot of that information out on his site. And frankly I dont feel like dealing with the backlash caused by me promoting things such as that. If your interested to find out more. Look them up, the internet is filled with a wealth of information on such things. You asked a simple question and I gave you a half page of information. Im going to go rest my thumbs now.

[Bassn Blvd]

• Every sport has a cheater, be it doping or intentionally doing bad.
• Certain forms of doping is illegal, by statute or by the rules of the game.
• If you decide to break the rules and cheat, then you deserve to suffer the punishment.
• Unless the rule book says it's okay, then It doesn't matter if everyone else does it. Thats just an excuse to try and justify your wrong doing.
• Call it what you will but I will rat out a cheater that is competing against me, even if I win.
• If someone intentionally breaks the rules/law, then they are cheating and do not get to play. PERIOD.
• Lance cheated. Got caught. Game over. 

 

[Raider Nation Fisher]

• Every sport has a cheater, be it doping or intentionally doing bad.
  
• Certain forms of doping is illegal, by statute or by the rules of the game.
  
• If you decide to break the rules and cheat, then you deserve to suffer the punishment.
  
• Unless the rule book says it's okay, then It doesn't matter if everyone else does it. Thats just an excuse to try and justify your wrong doing.
  
• Call it what you will but I will rat out a cheater that is competing against me, even if I win.
  
• If someone intentionally breaks the rules/law, then they are cheating and do not get to play. PERIOD.
  
• Lance cheated. Got caught. Game over. 
  

Just seems kind of stupid to me that all this fury was unleashed five or so years after the last races he did it in. Im not gonna try to defend him anymore. What he did was apparently wrong in everyoned eyes. However this all happened five plus years ago. Why in the world was thid even still being looked at and questioned?

Me personally I think its the fact that he was extremely successful at what he accomplisehed. Even if it was dirty, and certain parties especially that rat Tygart couldnt just let it be. I mean meine Gott the man was put under a microscope and constantly questioned even after he "retired" from the sport. Of course if you have media and USADA constantly sniffing around and trying to prove you cheated, something will eventually come out. This should have died when he left the sport.

[tomustang]

Yup he cheated. He's a giant piece of you know what because of that, the fact he became a false hero for cancer patients that couldn't be at his level of rich/celebrity and survive makes it worse. The fact that kids looked up to him all these years and really showed them that you really can't push to be the best, you just have to cheat for it makes it over the top.

 

It's really sad I've had to see my best friend in his last stages look up to lance and thought of him as a winner, a fighter, and a hero.  Well he never made it to see how lance turned out.

[roadwarrior]

After 5 pages I think everyone has had an opportunity to comment.

Let's move on, this thread is closed.

 

-Kent  a.k.a. roadwarrior

Global Moderator