Shamano, Not The Quailty They Used To Be???

[tomustang]

Components made decades ago in southeast asia have left a sour taste in the publics mouth, it's still taking time and raising questions about newer products that get announced. I've seen American products made worse off than imports now.

[outdoorsman110]

I don't see myself straying from Shimano reels any time soon. While not "old" by some standards, I have a Citica 201D that has never been opened up, except for some oil on the worm gear and spool bearings, and it is still smooth and quite. IDK if it's just me, but Shimano reels don't often feel the smoothest new out of the box as some others, they seem to have a " break in" period, but they sure do get smooth, and stay trouble free (if you take care of them) for longer with less maint. than any other reel brands I have ever owned. Just the opposite in my case were Daiwa reels, best feeling reels straight out of the box, but were very fussy with what oil I lubed them with, and performance generaly faded with use. I am not talking super high end Daiwa stuff, but not low end junk either, and I had enough of them (TD Fuego, TD Advantage, TD Tierra, Exceler) that acted the exact same way to think it was just how they where/are. Pure fishing stuff (Abu/Pflueger) treated me a little better, I don't have a bad thing to say about the Revo's or Presidents I owned.............there only problem is they are not Shimano's LOL. I have never had good luck with most big chain store branded stuff, at least with reels. I don't have any thing bad to say about Gander Mtn, or BPS rods, owned a few and they were fine, but, like the Abu/Pflueger stuff, there problem is they are not St Croix's, which is my prefered brand, but thats another topic. And...........this may surprise some people, the reels I like best and still keep around and use besided my Shimanos are Quantums. The oldest and most used/abused reel in my boat is the previous generation Accurist 501PT, it's a tank. 50lb braid, on the flipping stick, drag locked down, never been opened up, just cleaned off and oiled. Finish looks like crap, but I'll use it till it dies. I also have another, with 50lb braid, on my frog rod, same exact reel, just not as old. NIB for $50 on ebay........can't beat it, will also use till it dies. Both of these reels have gotten smoother/better casters as they age too. When they do die, I probably will replace them with Shimano's, but I will think about Quantum if I can find a deal on one.

As far as the new Shimano line up goes. I can't wait to get my hands on one, but being the cheap skate I am I will buy the G series Citica's and Curado's when they go one sale in the future when the H series comes out. Givin Shimanos recent history that should be in about 3 years LOL. I have also never seen a loss of performance, quality, or value when they change series, IMHO, they know better than to try and pass off inferior products as new and improved. You wait............I have seen it every time they come out with a new reel, people always complain that they won't be as good as the last, but every time, they end up being better.

Pflueger makes the BPS reels.

[Stasher1]

Pflueger makes the BPS reels.

It's my understanding that BPS' reels are made in the same factory as some of the Pflueger reels, but they are not made by Pflueger.

[Deadeye-1]

Hey gang. Been away for a weekend get-away with my wife. Having read through all the posts thought I'd answer/clear a few things up.

First off, if you noticed, the threads title was in the form of a question--- not a statement. I currently own at least 5 Shamano Reels and have used them since I first discovered them in the heck I don't know late 70's early 80's. They are all spinning, as that was what I was into at the time.and still use some today.

So I don't know if I am bold or not doing research by asking members of this forum, several that I know of that do reel repair, for their opinons on the newest version of Shamano Reels. The Plastic Drag Gear was brought to my attention by a customer that wanted to look at each one before he purchased. I did feel as though for myself the newer reels did not have as smooth of a turn as the older version did on the baitcasters.

As someone posted different is not nessasarily as bad thing. In time what seems worse may turn out to be much better.

In any case, thanks for the replies and your opinons.

[craww]

"Pflueger" hasnt made their own reels in your lifetime outdoorsman.

[J Francho]

Plastic drag gear? Are you talking about the clicker assembly? Why would that even be an issue? In fact, I'd call it a FEATURE. In 99.99999% of reels, this part is all riveted, and cannot be repaired or replaced. Shimano's set up easily replaceable. I've seen ratcheted spool supports made of aluminum (CI4), machined steel, stamped steel, etc....never heard of them wearing out.

[J Francho]

Pflueger makes the BPS reels.

No, the same company that makes Pure Fishing reels made many of BPS's reels. AFAIK, they've moved on from that, though.

[outdoorsman110]

No, the same company that makes Pure Fishing reels made many of BPS's reels. AFAIK, they've moved on from that, though.

Blahhhh. Oh well.. They're still quality reels I think, they aren't shimano but the Bass pro version of the Pflueger Arbor is great!

[BobP]

I think the use of a plastic versus metal part in a reel is an engineering design decision by Shimano Japan, not anything to do with the factory in Malaysia - and by the way, I've never had a plastic part in any Shimano reel I own go bad, ever. I bought a Japanese domestic market Shimano Biomaster spinning reel 6 years ago and it was made in Malaysia. The reel has worked perfectly and is still smooth as butter. I think the Abu Revos are also made in Malaysia and you don't hear much grousing about quality in that line either. Bottom line, you have to take every reel on its on merits regardless of who made it or where it was assembled. Can Shimano screw up? Of course! I'm not suggesting anyone take any reel on faith. But in my mind, they are still the gold standard in bass reel quality.

[outdoorsman110]

This is why my favorite reel company is Ardent.

[BrianSnat]

From purely a spinning standpoint I see an improvement. I have mostly older Shimanos, 10-20 years old,and recently picked up a few new Shimanos (1 Spirex and 2 Syncopates). As much as I liked my older reels, the new ones are far smoother in every respect and feel a lot more solid. Time will tell if they will last as long, but right now I like them so much more that I'm considering slowly replacing my older Shimanos. I love the Spirex and the Syncopate is a great reel for the money.

[Raider Nation Fisher]

Ain't had a single problem with ANY of my Calcutta reels. I've got them all the way up to the DC. And sized from a 50 to a 400. These are the most durable hardiest reels I've ever owned or used. Shimano got me for life when I bought my first one of these reels. Plus anything were to go wrong the service center for Alabama is a mile from my house, and cleaning and repair is free. They stand behind these reels, so why would I care where they make it. Or maybe its just this series they stand behind?

[jtj0026]

Shimano makes excellent higher end products but they down graded some product in recent years... for example, Crucial and Clarus rods and Curado 200 reels. But keep in mind that there are a lot of excellent gears out there that are not tagged with names like Shimano and Daiwa. I for sure go for varieties and have fun'

[Hooligan]

Shimano makes excellent higher end products but they down graded some product in recent years... for example, Crucial and Clarus rods and Curado 200 reels. But keep in mind that there are a lot of excellent gears out there that are not tagged with names like Shimano and Daiwa. I for sure go for varieties and have fun'

Uhh, what? Downgrade on Crucial and Clarus? Check again, champ. They upgraded both substantially this year with the new rods. They're both higher grade of graphite and resin, and they both got a component boost as well. They have better guide frames and better reel seats. They have better finish and fit on the rods. If you're definition of downgrade is moving from cork to EVA, you're sorely mistaken and have some in-depth reading to take care of.

Lastly, the Curado might be thought of as a downgrade, but it's just putting it back in line where it should be and the Chronarch back to were it should always have been. The $300 Chronarch is something, while a beautiful and wonderful reel, should never have been. Think back to days of old and it's never been a $275+ reel. The reels are back in line with where they should be. Don't think the Curado is the quality it should be, which is still one of the best values around IMO, buy a Chronarch.

[South FLA]

Lastly, the Curado might be thought of as a downgrade, but it's just putting it back in line where it should be and the Chronarch back to were it should always have been. The $300 Chronarch is something, while a beautiful and wonderful reel, should never have been. Think back to days of old and it's never been a $275+ reel. The reels are back in line with where they should be. Don't think the Curado is the quality it should be, which is still one of the best values around IMO, buy a Chronarch.

Chicken and egg argument.

When I heard what was going on to Shimano's Curado and Chronarch line, I scooped up the later models quickly, knowing that they were "better" than the next model year. Shimano's mistake might have been upgrading quality and in-turn price on the models, effectively taking them out of the competitive price range, but by slightly lowering quality and dropping price point significantly they have made some buyers, such a myself take note. I would agree on your statement of buying the Chronarch, but why not just say, buy an Ebay new condition Curado E series and save. As time goes by, it will be a moot point however just like the chicken or egg.

[Capt.Bob]

I am the biggest Shimano fan on the water, 3 Calcutta's, 2 Curado's, 1 Castaic, 4 Stradic MgFB's and 1 FBM, 4 Stradics, 3 Sustain's, 5 Symetre's. Those are just the ones I own now, minus one Castaic and 2 Curados, The 200 and both 400B Calcuttas are safe, BUT??? the Calcutta would be hard to beat!

I just bought a new St. Croix Avid for a crankbait finess rod, a AV69MLXF, Love it! But when I bought the new reel for it, of course a Curado G7, and I was very dissapointed to say the least, Maybe if I didn't own enough QUALITY reels to compare it to I would have been Happy. The one Curado I already had was a 200BSF and It was DEFINIETLY A BETTER MADE REEL, right down to the centrifical brake design, I sold the G7 after one days use and talking to a fellow rod builder and autorized Shimano reel repair tec for a local huge tackle outlet. He said Bob buy one of these Lew's and try it, I'll give you a week and if you aren't happy, bring it in and I'll give you that G7 you sold for it even up.

I bought the middle of the line Tournament MSB 6.4:1,about 30 bucks less than the G7. I am very sorry to say, I thought I would never after the last 20 years ever own another manufacturers reels. That was in the begining of March. I sold the old curado's and the Castaic, and bought the Tournament PRO 7.1:1 and the Team 6.4:1, and have 3 reels that are better than the Chronarch, New or old!! the Lews have a much better build sheet too, 11 ball bearing Chronarch has 6, 14 lbs. drag that is smoother than Butter, chronarch has 11 lbs.and smooth also, Smoother realing, especially with fish on, lighter weight and smaller profile, the TP is 6.7 oz. about the same size as a 50E and half oz lighter, with the same line capacity as the 200 series. I am sorry but I don't manufacture em, I don't fix em, I don't sell em, but I do use them and did use them proffesionally as a buisness, and the Lew's are better reels, cast farther, built stronger, less money and unbelievably smoother, now we will see if they will past the test of time for durability, if they do, they are the best buy and best reel on the planet in a low profile baitcast reel hands down. I should have listened to ***** when he told me to get the Lew's when I picked up my new rod, but like so many, I couldn't be made to believe there could be a better reel than a Shimano, but I know for fact in this size and style there is!! and it cost less. Oh and today we hit Clear Lake, the Team scored Walleye, Smallmouth and Largemouth, you can't believe how it cast weightless soft plastic's, as the bass were on the beds!!! Flawless, and UNBEILEVABLE. Don't try one and you will be happy with your Curados and Chronarchs. I was before the G7 let down!

[0119]

South Fl. I thought that too with the D series. Got a few when the rebate was on marking its end. I was glad because I thought the E was junk in comparison. Sad to say Shimano couldnt keep parts in stock for the D for another year afterwards. So stocking up on soon to be discontinued Shimanos doesnt seem to be a good idea.

Sad to say I cant find any quality in a Lews/Revo/BPS concoction either. Or an overpriced Daiwa that will be discontinued quicker than Shimano gets rid of theirs.

[Hooligan]

Chicken and egg argument.

When I heard what was going on to Shimano's Curado and Chronarch line, I scooped up the later models quickly, knowing that they were "better" than the next model year. Shimano's mistake might have been upgrading quality and in-turn price on the models, effectively taking them out of the competitive price range, but by slightly lowering quality and dropping price point significantly they have made some buyers, such a myself take note. I would agree on your statement of buying the Chronarch, but why not just say, buy an Ebay new condition Curado E series and save. As time goes by, it will be a moot point however just like the chicken or egg.

Fair enough, I understand where you're coming from. But I still maintain that there have been zero downgrades on rods as stated in the post I initially quoted. I'm still awaiting an explanation as to where that thought is coming from.

[Raul]

It all depends on what you consider an upgrade or a downgrade, made in "X" ( place the name of the country you like here ) only means that, made in X country, besides, the guys building the reel only work with what they give them to work, made in X country with quality components maintining the same quality controls they followed in the other country doesn´t mean it will be detrimental; built in X country with poor quality components and poor quality control will mean it´s going to be a poor quality product.

So Shimano not quite what it used to be ? where or what makes you think that ?

Let´s take for example the old venerable Curado B, man were talking about one of the most durable and less troublesome reels ever made, built like a tank and meant to last you a life time at an "affordable" price, back in the early 90´s 120 bucks was a good deal of money, the newer version in features is a much better reel than the B at a slightly "higher" price ( which is not that much if you take in consideration inflation ) so not what it used to be where ? the B had composite sideplates, composite star drag, composite tension knob cap, the new one has composite sideplates, composite star drag and a metal tension knob cap, smaller size, a lot lighter, HEG, Septon grips, about the same line capacity, Super Free ( not available in the B unless you get the SF which was 30 dollars more ) & Dartainum drag. In other words and assuming you got the SF version ( which had less line capacity ) you are paying 10 dollars more when purchasing a new one for a reel that has a big bunch of features, features that you only got if you purchased a Chronarch and all for 160 bones.

Sure, the B was made in Japan but is got several Shimanos made in Malaysia and they are all fine reels.

[0119]

I dont mean this to offend you but location does mean something. Perhaps not for Shimano and Malaysia. Im very happy with the Stradics made there. But compare St.Croix's products made at their new location and their home factory. Same components and blanks. But this site is full of complaints of the new factories misaligned guides and such. Not a bash on one particular country. Be it the mother companies quality control, the training it offers or what.

[Cincy Bach 29]

I have 2 of the 200E7s and 2 of the 200G series. While they do feel different they are still great reels. I also own a Castaic and love that reel for pitching and flipping. But do not let the price drop fool you guys. The only reason it is cheaper is because they listened to what the consumers were saying and a major complain was price. They removed 2 of the bearings from what I've heard and thats about it. But pick one up and give it a feel at the store . You will notice it just feels a bit different than the E series. If I had to pick I'd go with the E, but G shouldn't be completely writen off. If you don't like the G series at the store and prefer the E series just get the new chronarch series.....It's the same reel as the curado E series except for 1 sealed bearing for saltwater.