MisterDeadeye

I pointed out that 4 carrier braid is more likely to catch on things, and it's obvious by looking at the structure of the two. I don't understand your argument. You're just throwing out these one liners as if they mean anything at all. The OP said that no articles they read explained why 4 carrier braid is recommended so often for vegetation and I gave the explanation. It's physics, not an opinion, and I explained the upside and the downside, as well as saying that the difference isn't that big of a deal. What's the point of trying to argue with this?

Sure, abrasion works both ways to some degree, but hardness and surface finish are the main factors here. Go rub a piece of wood against a rock for an hour and tell me how much damage you did to the rock. Take a low grit whetstone and drag it across your arm and tell me how much damage you did to the stone. Go slide on your knees across pavement and tell me about how you totally destroyed the road. I'd argue that 4 carrier braid, or at least a coarse braid, stands up better against grasses exactly because of the coarseness. Where a smooth braid will allow a blade of grass(or whatever kind of vegetation) to rub against it until you pull hard enough to actually cut through, a coarse braid will catch, and because it's a harder material, these waves in the line will naturally dig in to the grass like a saw. You can test this by grabbing a cheese grater and rubbing steel wool up and down. One way, the edges will catch on the steel wool and start to pull it apart. The other way, you'll just be scratching the metal surface very lightly. Every moving thing that comes into contact with another thing is technically abrading through friction. Either way, tests have shown that standard Power Pro has higher abrasion resistance than Sufix 832, and the fact that it's also more abrasive and well suited for vegetation is undeniable. That doesn't make 832 bad, it's just not as good, and I have absolutely no knowledge about the line you're suggesting, so I can't comment on it. The test that I saw most recently suggested that a braid by Cortland(I think) took second place behind PP. Sufix 832 was in the top 5 I believe, but there were only ~15 lines tested.

You actually answered your question about why some people suggest and prefer 4 carrier braid for heavy cover. Because it's coarse, the line works more like a saw. It's abrasive and cuts through vegetation more easily. On the other hand, 8 carrier braid is smoother and rounder so it casts better. I guess it depends on what you consider cover. If you're throwing around wood or rocks, the smoother braid could be helpful because it's less like to catch(like on your finger) and start fraying. Then obviously if you've got grasses or weeds on top or under the water surface, the abrasive nature of coarse braid helps. But don't get me wrong, even something like Sufix 832 will cut through vegetation more than fluorocarbon/mono.

To make it simple, they're carbon fiber. Very similar to graphite(they start out as the same thing), just slightly different in the manufacturing process. It's potentially lighter, more sensitive, and more expensive to produce usually, unless they start out with lower grade materials. Actually, I'm saying they're carbon fiber based on a video on the rod's page, on Okuma's website, that says they're made out of carbon fiber, but they also say that it's carbon fiber wrapped, so it could be largely constructed of graphite and carbon fiber reinforced which makes the result slightly different. Rods that are marketed as being carbon fiber(most graphite rods have some amount of carbon fiber in them, so it's kind of a misnomer), are typically meant to be the best of both worlds. They're supposed to be light and sensitive like a typical graphite rod, but also flexible like a fiberglass rod. The rod you're using probably has a relatively slow action so it will be great for the typical treble hook hard baits like the intended topwater/jerkbaits, as well as crankbaits. Now, despite the fact that technically speaking graphite and carbon fiber are different, all "graphite" rods are composites, meaning they aren't 100% graphite construction. Like I said above, graphite rods use carbon fiber, so the use of the term in their video and the use of the word "carbon" instead of "graphite" could just be the marketing team doing their job. Feel out the action for yourself, but it doesn't really even matter what the composition itself is because rod manufacturers don't release that information. The only thing we can do as consumers is test and compare various rods. Edit: I'm not sure exactly what lures you're using, but I don't like leaders and usually just use straight braid. If you need the stretch, you could always just go full mono or have a leader that's a couple feet long so that it's past your guides when getting ready to cast. As for what lb test, I like 30lb braid, but some people like to go to 40 or even 50 for general use. Mono, I'd go with 12-15lb Big Game whether we're talking about a leader or main line.

I have definitely had this happen with 1/2oz spinnerbaits, heavy catfish rigs, and some heavier topwater stuff. I've never had it happen with anything light. It certainly happens when something goes wrong like the line digging in and getting caught as someone above mentioned.

I noticed yesterday that there's some Yamamoto branded fluorocarbon fishing line available, in both a clear and gray color. It isn't anything new, but I didn't find any threads while searching for opinions. Has anyone used this stuff? It looks a little expensive, and the only review I could even find was one on TackleTour.

I'm asking myself what I would be thinking if it were KastKing.

Have you tried experimenting with various parts to see if it's possible to modify a Tatula SV(or even something like the Steez somehow), to have the standard line guide? I know there are several parts that would need to be changed between the thumb bar and the line guide, the worm gear, pawl, the parts that move the T-Wing mechanically etc. I wonder if some of these parts on, say, a Fuego CT or older Daiwa reel, could be swapped over.

I like the Plano Weekender bags, specifically the 3700 size. They're big enough that you can buy one of the deep, open 3700 boxes that's dedicated to soft plastics in their original packaging, and you can still use two other standard 3700 boxes for whatever. If you're really adventurous, you can get one of the shallow 3700 boxes for terminal tackle, and try to fit four total 3700 boxes in the main compartment. Of course there's still room for markers or dyes, pliers, gloves if you use them, or extra plastic storage if the open 3700 isn't enough. At that point as a bank fisherman, I'd argue that you're trying to do too much at once. So to summarize: Plano Weekender 3700 bag(either style) -Two standard 3700 boxes(for whatever) -One 3731 box(deep, open, for plastics in their bags) -One 3701 box(shallow, for terminal tackle) And like I said, there's plenty of room in the side compartments or the front one for more plastics, there's a "sheath" for pliers etc. I think the ultimate solution as a bank fisherman is the backpack if you move around a lot, and you don't have to take the time to shuffle things around if you want to make a cast on the way. The only problem is that a good one is going to be expensive($50+ on the low end, catered to 3500 or 3600 size boxes) whereas you can get a bag like I mentioned for ~$25. EDIT: I should mention that Plano markets the Weekender bags as having the room for 4 boxes of the appropriate size meaning 4 3700 boxes should fit in the 3700 bag. The method I mentioned above is really pushing the limits of the volume of these bags. 4 3700 boxes are 8" wide, whereas the aforementioned setup would be 8.5" wide. That extra half inch may or may not be too much to fit. I don't know how tight the fit is exactly.

I came back to this thread to talk about exactly this issue. I bought Goody Ouchless 71291 bands from Wal-Mart and they definitely melt when left on my Senkos, or at least my watermelon Dingers. Your picture shows an older packaging so I wonder if they're simply made differently now. Either way I've settled on using grommets. They're stiffer than a O-rings or these bands, they're more expensive, and they're a little wider than using two O-rings, but I put the hook through them and the whole thing is extremely secure. My bait hasn't ripped even a little so until I can find a more elegant solution, this is what I'm going with.

Another vote for the Curado DC. The other reels are fine, some different bearings here and there, slightly different spools, blah blah blah, but the DC is a different beast entirely. It's like buying a new car and you're considering whether you want a base model Toyota Camry, the Camry with the performance package, the Camry with the premium package, or a Jaguar. They're all going to get you to where you want to be, but you're going to have a lot more fun with the Jag.

When I was considering a reel, I took a good hard look at the Casitas. In fact my first thread here was asking people to talk me out of getting one. The main reason I had for getting one was its insane casting ability(distance with everything from light to heavy lures mostly), even though it's supposed to be notoriously "geary" feeling and it has the composite frame. I'd considered all comparable reels, the Daiwa Fuego CT/Tatula CT, Lew's, Abu Garcia Revo X, Quantum Accurist, KastKing, etc. After I looked into the Magforce brake system, and realized that I could get a brand new Fuego CT for <$55 on eBay(from a retailer, not a random person), I just stopped thinking and bit the bullet. I'm extremely happy with it. As far as I can tell there's no friction when turning the handle or spool, and it's silent in that regard, it feels great in the hand, and the brakes are just phenomenal. I've thrown 1/4oz crankbaits and large spinnerbaits with large trailers, senkos various ways, etc, and I've had to make no adjustments at all after setting it up initially.

Yeah, getting one for less than $50 seemed a little crazy to me too. The person who said that was talking about a sale that happened last month some time after the 4th of July sale. Either way though, the 4th of July deal that I got was an eBay 20% off sale. They happen pretty often, there was one in June, there was one in March, and so on. There might even be one coming up for Labor Day.

x5 or whatever the number is, for the Tat/Fuego CT. Check this out for a realistic look at the differences: https://www.bassresource.com/bass-fishing-forums/topic/207969-the-tatula-ctfuego-ct-and-misconceptions/ EDIT: I got carried away with all of the reel recommendations. Yeah, line and rod are more important for sure. Your reel is not going to break before your line assuming you aren't using paracord as fishing line, and the rod needs to have enough rigidity to keep the pressure on the fish while you fight through the greenery. So get 50-65lb braid depending on just how thick your area is, and get a rod that can handle the load as well. Typically a heavy rod with a faster tip is what you're going to want, but there are recommendations above ^

I've personally found better casting -- more distance, accuracy, precision, etc -- with a baitcasting setup. Of course, I've seen the same sentiment as you, that spinning reels cast farther than casting reels, so I don't know. It's probably a comfort thing, because I grew up using casting reels on ponds and lakes fishing for bass, rivers for catfish, etc. So if you've been using casting reels for a long time or if you feel a lack of comfort with spinning reels, you're probably not going to get the result you're looking for. I have no spinning reel or rod recommendations, so I can't help in that regard. Edit: For me, spinning reels are delegated to catching bait or the occasional "finesse" approach. My main setups will always be baitcasting.

If you don't mind waiting, you can get the Fuego CT for at least a few dollars less than $60. I got mine for $53 around the 4th of July, and I've seen people talking about getting them in the 40s during similar sales.

Definitely a rod I was considering as well, I'm just unsure if I want to go with something cheaper that will work, or if I get something a little more expensive that will perform better and have a better place in my arsenal down the road.

Awesome, thank you for the recommendation. When I pointed out that I would be willing to go up to 7'6", I was actually referring to the Fred's Magic Stick rods, I just couldn't remember who made them or what the name actually was. Good shout on the DSG exclusive rod as well, I know places like Academy, DSG, Bass Pro, Cabela's etc, have their own exclusive rods, it's just so much to look through and figure out what's good and what's not. I had a similar idea about going with a cheaper rod for now so I can grab some tackle with the savings, and start going for more setups when the time comes. In that regard, I was considering the Daiwa Aird X in 7'3" MH with the same 1/4-1oz rating. I also looked at the Tatula XT, I just haven't done much research into it yet. I was already favoring the Powell but I know I've seen a lot of good things about the Irod 754C. Because it has similar aesthetics to the Dobyns Fury, how would you compare the two? Specifically the Dobyns 734C and the Irod 754C.

I've read the stickied rod thread, essentially every rod thread that's come through here in the past month, and done some searching of my own, but I'm still not well versed on what specifically to look for, and some of the rods I'm looking at are rarely talked about. So, with that said, I'm a bank fisherman in Kansas going to ponds with sparse dead trees, light lily cover and cattails in some cases. Other than that, I go to smaller(50-60 acre) lakes with an average depth of ~8-10 ft. Right now I'm fishing weightless senkos Texas rigged and weighted wacky style, Zoom flukes, and occasionally weighted Texas rigged creature baits like the Pit Boss. I've always been a fan of jigs, spinnerbaits, and buzzbaits, but to make a long story short, I have to rebuild all of my tackle from the bottom up including a new rod, so I don't have anything even remotely heavy right now. I want a casting rod, anywhere from $70-$130ish that can throw ~3/8-1/2oz jigs with a trailer, weighted wacky senkos, spinnerbaits, buzzbaits, maybe even some horny toads and the occasional frog(again, there's not a ton of cover -- no thick slop or massive grass walls). Anywhere from 7'-7'4", but if there's something sweet at 7'6", it's not a huge deal. Now, I know that this is a pretty wide range of applications for one rod. I simply don't have the money to be spending on specialized rods right now, and I'm currently using a 6' M/F $20 Wal-Mart(it's a Quantum, IM7 graphite rod, not sure on the model number but the only reference to it that I found was Wal-Mart's website and it was really $20) special, found at my parents' house, that is actively hindering my ability to throw anything heavier than a lightweight wacky jigged senko. My plan is that I'm going to get one decent rod now for the majority of what I want to throw, and use a 6' M/F spinning setup for anything that doesn't load up well with the casting setup. After a while, I'll get another reel and something for cranks etc, a more specialized frogging rod if I venture out more onto bodies of water with a lot of cover, and so on. I already know what you're going to suggest. The Dobyns Fury 734 is out of the question because it's got green everywhere. I'm using a Fuego CT, so even though it's likely an incredible rod and would fit my needs perfectly, I don't particularly want to pull the trigger because of the clashing aesthetics. The only reason I don't know the model number of the Quantum rod I'm using now is because I painted it black. The color bothered me. I'm looking for thoughts on the following rods(and other suggestions if you've got something in mind). Generally though, all black, black and white(assuming the handle is black and the rod is white), black and red, are what I'm looking for: Lamiglas XP 7'3" "Heavy" Powell Inferno 7'3" "Heavy" TFO TFG 7' "Medium Heavy" Fenwick HMG 7' "Medium Heavy" Falcon BuCoo SR 7'3" "Medium Heavy" Duckett Terex 7'3" "Medium Heavy" Duckett Triad 7'3" "Medium Heavy" These rods have varying tapers, and I don't have enough experience to know what I will like and dislike in that regard, so I'll most likely just disregard the taper until I get one of these rods and can figure out what I like and dislike about whatever I decide on. Does anyone have experience with these rods? Am I just really stupid for not getting a Fury 734 and calling it a day? What are your thoughts?

Oh, that's another possibility I hadn't thought of. A snapping turtle makes sense if you're sure the pond is clean of trash and there are no toothy fish. If you had to re-tie shortly before it happened, it almost had to be something either very sharp or with a lot of force.

Aside from the possibility of a toothy fish biting you off, I can think of a few things: There could be a metal can(beer, corn, beans, coffee, whatever) torn up from bullets or rocks, that caught your line at an angle. There's also the possibility of a broken beer bottle; some people just don't care about the health of an ecosystem like that. Someone could have left a fish trap with sharp edges, that slowly made its way around the pond, etc. Surely there are more possibilities for some kind of sharp debris that I'm not thinking of. Other than that, do you carefully look over your line? There could have been some kind of stress at that particular spot from something you rubbed against earlier in the day, inside your vehicle assuming you don't use a cover, or even when you fished last. To me, it looks like some serious abrasion, so I'd lean toward a torn up can or broken bottle that just happened to catch your line in the worst possible way. Edit: If a bass picked up your craw and started to run, it's entirely possible that your line rubbed against something sharp and broke before you'd really feel what was going on.

They're fine rods. They used to be known for being nearly indestructible, and they were widely available from places like Wal-Mart, Bass Pro, sporting goods stores, etc. Nowadays, most rods on the market are just as tough, but things have changed and most rods you see recommended here will outperform an Ugly Stik in the ways mentioned above. I'm a little biased toward Ugly Stiks too, because of my dad and my experience with them when I was a kid, but any Ugly Stiks I have now are used for sitting on a sandbar and fishing for catfish.

There's no denying that Daiwa's Tatula CT and Fuego CT are fantastic reels at an even more fantastic price. On eBay, you can grab a Tatula CT for ~$97 from various sellers, and you can get a Fuego CT for ~$65. So, the question then becomes, do I spend an extra $30 on the Tatula, or is the Fuego good enough? I've had that question myself, and when I first created an account here, I made a thread asking about reel recommendations. Many people recommended these two reels, and most of those people suggested going for the Tatula if possible, because of the TWS, because of 2 extra bearings, and because the whole thing is aluminum, including the two side plates. So, despite the fact that I was set on getting a Casitas, I started looking into these reels. Over on another forum(I don't want to say it by name, because I'm not affiliated with them and don't know how the moderation team feels about "advertising" a "competitor"), someone last year made a thread complaining about their Tatula CT. The biggest gripe was that Daiwa AU described the Tatula CT as having an aluminum side plate, but after taking apart the reel, this user found composite("plastic"). In that thread is a picture of the side plate, as well as a screenshot of Daiwa's description which does indeed indicate an aluminum side plate. Looking deeper into this discrepancy, I pulled up the parts diagram for the Tatula CT as well as for the Fuego, to figure out what was actually different between them. I'll have a picture of the diagrams below, but while I was looking, I noticed part #51. The Fuego's shows a honeycomb pattern, indicating a composite side plate, while the Tatula's showed no pattern, seemingly indicating a difference in composition. Still though, the Tatula CT is actually a few grams lighter than the Fuego, despite the T-Wing and the parts required to move it back and forth. This didn't add up. With the slightly heavier line guide and a few bits of plastic to make it interface with the thumb bar, there's no way that the side plate could be aluminum as well and still result in a lighter reel considering the generally shared parts. Then, I decided to look up the Tatula CT Type R, and in that diagram, you can clearly see the same honeycomb pattern found in the Fuego. The Tatula SV TW diagram tells the same story. Assuming that the Tatula CT is not defying physics and that Daiwa wouldn't be using cheaper materials in their more expensive reels, I came to the conclusion that the Tatula CT does not actually have aluminum side plates(or at least on the gear side). From there, I looked at the other differences, specifically the bearing count. After combing through each part listed on both of the diagrams, I realized that they share the same number of bearings. The only part in the diagrams that wasn't broken down fully was the handle itself(part #94 in both diagrams). Therefore, the only potential place that 2 extra bearings could exist, is in the two handle knobs. Okay, so at that point I was ready to make this thread, mostly to dispel the idea that the Tatula CT has aluminum side plates, but to point out just how similar these reels actually are. Still though, I decided to contact Daiwa myself to get some confirmation either way from them. This is the email I received: Cool, so it's confirmed then. The Tatula CT does not have aluminum side plates. So what are the differences, really? Well, there are only a handful of parts listed that are different. The frame, the two side plates, a stabilizer bar, the spool tension knob, handle nut and plate, as well as the brake adjustment knob, are all different. Most of these differences are because of the color of paint used(frame, side plates, etc), and some are different because of the design and the way that Daiwa marks the gear ratios in the Tatula(brake adjustment knob, handle nut plate, etc). Beyond that, the worm shaft and a few more level wind parts are different because of the TWS. There's a single bearing retainer that's different(part #49), though the Tatula CT Type R shares the exact same retainer as the Fuego CT, so take that for what you will. The last difference is that there are 2 extra bearings, one in each handle knob. The entire spool assembly is the same model number, the main bearings are all the same model numbers, the gears, the drive shaft, the drag star and washer system, the thumb bar, they're all the same. Here's a picture of the two parts diagrams, highlighting each bearing, as well as the single retainer that's different: To put it simply, the Tatula CT and the Fuego CT are the same reel, with the exceptions of the TWS and two handle knob bearings, which are the reasons for an extra $30. Are those differences worth an extra $30? I can't say because it will largely depend on you. I will say that I absolutely love my Fuego CT, and that Daiwa's more expensive reels are fantastic as well.

Yeah, I've noticed that as well. Reminds me of licorice. I have a quick question about the bands you use. Do they need to be the Ouchless bands? I'm guessing they're made out of a different material. Right now I'm using rubber grommets. A lot harder and a bit wider than O-rings or those Goody bands, but I can't imagine them ever cutting through the worm

That's good to hear! Like I said originally, I wasn't trying to say that KastKing stuff is garbage, it's just inexpensive because of where it's made, and there's not quite as much care taken(in China, generally speaking) on the very base level of the people putting the reels together, as you'd see in Malaysia or a European country for example. Your reels seem great. They're light, they have similar features to other big name reels on the market, the aesthetics are great(the Assassin is my favorite)... I'd already have one or two of your reels, baitcasting and spinning, if it wasn't for the reputation of Chinese manufacturing, and the anecdotes I've seen from various people with issues out of the box. It's not a knock on your company at all, and I'm interested in what you guys come up with next.