Randall

Here is the best I think you will find. Is this recessed enough? I have pulled ten pounders out of hydrilla growing up fifteen feet tall from the bottom with this jig and the hook can't be bent. The line will break first. It's a little over three dollars but worth it. The Grass Stalker can be found at www.unclejosh.com and they may sell them at Tackle Warehouse also.

I got a Slow sink/Fast sink Tru-Tungsten bait from Bass Pro here in Atlanta. After fishing it It has a few issues also. I got the fast sink and even with all the balls in it stays up near the surface. So you would have to count it down to fish it deeper. The Spro will run deeper so that makes the Spro a better bait for deep fish. The Tru-Tungsten also has small hooks. Where I fish and the way I want to fish it that means a few lost larger fish but I switched out the hook from the Spro bait to the TT and it still swims great with the larger hook. I ended up with two short shank number four hooks and it in the end and worked great that way and the hooks never tangled or got caught in the joints. Casting distance was about the same on both baits but the TT is a much smaller bait and I was putting it up against the much heavier deeper running fast sink Spro. Since the TT bait compares more to the slow sink Spro even with larger hooks on the bait I give the edge in casting to the TT by far. It doesn't tumble and roll on the cast at all like the Spro. The fininsh on the TT bait didn't chip off and looks way better in person than in the photos. For a shad imitation I like the TT paint much better and they have more species than the Spro. As far as action the Spro is a better super slow moving bait but I like the action on the TT better at slow to fast speed. If I had to choose one I would take the TT just because it more closely matches the size or more small shad and panfish, It has two hooks and you can choose a bunch of different hook setups that work for your needs. You can change the weights. I also will rarely move a small swimbait at very slow speeds. I will mostly use the bait for schoolers, fish feeding near or on the surface over big flats and spotted bass that usually like a faster retrieve. I think it will catch more fish for me than the Spro.

So, 4bizz was throwing a swimbait and you beat him with a tiny dropshot that you don't even know how to set the hook on. ;D I would never admit to that 4bizz.

I have also seen them nowhere near the bottom. I have seen fish on beds in the forks of standing timber in 40 feet of water on the main lake.

Which lakes? In most of the lakes up there in winter I just pull the jig slowly along the bottom because of the lack of cover and the fish relate more to the very bottom when the water temps are in the forties. No hoping the jig off the bottom. Just find some rocky structure and slowly turn the reel handle keeping the jig in contact with the bottom.

Both, the fish will always be able to tell you more than any of us will. :)I would start with the jig though.

Really I was disapointed with the Spro overall. Its a good bait but I had problems with durability, castability and hookup ratio. I just think it could have been done way better from a design standpoint to make it work better. Looking at the Tru-Tungsten Bait just from videos I think it will be a better bait for me. They have a little more weight toward the center of the bait which should help the castability. Makes it a better bait for schoolers on top and covering more water in the fall when bass are chasing shad on flats which are the two main things I need a shad swimbait for. It has two hooks. I am usually a one big hook kind of guy but the Spro bait just misses fish and I can still go with one big hook if I decide to by removing the rear hook on the TT. The TT also appears to have a tighter more shad like action to me. I can also adjust the weight if need be. Let me also say Tru-Tungsten had a huge advantage on this one since they are using tungsten to weight the small bait. It will alllow them to make a smaller bait with more strength overall since the weight inside the bait takes up much less space. I just hope I am right and the TT works better since I need a good hard shad swimbait. As far as the size difference I don't think it matters to the fish too much since they are both small baits. Anybody been able to measure both baits so we know who is telling the truth. The Spro looks bigger than four to me but I could be wrong.

Yes you can fish a swimbait in winter. The best way for me is bouncing it along the bottom like a jig. Also I have found that fish that will eat jerkbaits will also hit a swimbait if it is a good swimbait that works and swims at the slowest speeds. My favorite to fish on the bottom is a Mattlures bluegill. It sits upright on the bottom when the bait is stopped and swims well at slow speeds when you move it. The Huddleston Deluxe is another one that works on the bottom or up away from the bottom in winter. I have also caught fish on the Storm Kickin' Minnow and the 6 inch Sebile Magic Swimmer by reeling them very slowly at the depth fish are suspended. Last way I fish swimbaits in winter is to fish a Mattlures shad in the place of a jigging spoon around deep schools of bait and fish.

It is made by a swimbait company and the action is a little different. It has a gliding type action after it turns that is different than a spook or sammy. I don't really see it as a swimbait or walking bait. I call it a surface glider.

www.mattlures.com All of Matt's baits are great and I fish all of them but the hard bluegills are the one to have for shallow water. Mattlures is also a member here. If you have gizzard shad try the Storm 6 inch Kickin' minnow in the Pearl or Gizzard shad color. http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/links/link.jsp;jsessionid=GBDDXDURRMYFVLAQBBKCCN3MCAEFKIWE?id=0037358121158a&type=product&cm_mmc=CRR-_-RLP-_-121158-_-productname_link&cmCat=CRR&cmCat=netcon&cm_ven=netcon&cm_cat=N/A&cm_pla=N/A&cm_ite=netcon&rid=0180101070502&_requestid=104471 If you have grass that grows up near the surface use these Basstrix baits over top of it. Another one that works well over grass growing near the surface is a triple trout. If it catches in the grass you can often rip it free like a rattle trap. No link for it but there are three retailers that sell the bait. Another great gizzard imitation is Triton Mike's Bull Shad. I like to fish it fast over grass for reaction strikes. Mike is a member here and you can PM him for info. Only place to get a Bull Shad is Natures Tackle Box here in GA. The number there is 678-567-1211. I fish mostly shallow grass lakes and these are some of the ones the ones I fish most.

I have caught plenty of fish on both at 42 degrees. I have caught lipless crank fish at 38 degrees.

I experimented with this a few years ago alternating jigs and looking to see how the fish were hooked and counting how many came off etc. To make a long story short the straight shank hook lost way fewer fish and hooked all the way into or through the roof of the mouth most often while there were a bunch of fish skin hooked in the roof fo the mouth or hooked in the soft part on the sides of the lips with the ewg. Only place I found the ewg did a good job was casting on a very shallow flat where the angle of pull was a little different (flatter). Even on the shallow flat the EWG wasn't any better than the straight shank. So ever since then nothing but a straight shank for me 99% of the time.

Fast sink. Its hard to get the others to stay down at all if you want to fish deeper. The baits don't cast very well and the extra weight of the fast sink helps with the cast also.

I just got a new Rapala Glidin' Rap and the new eight inch Storm Kickin' minnow. I have been making my own glide baits for bass for a couple of years. Saw the Rapala bait and had to try it. Took it out to my test pond today and it works great. Really nice action. Think I might stop making mine since the Rapala sells for just $9.99. and from the first swimming test works just as well. Can't wait to try it on some big bass. I also got the eight inch size Kickn' minnow which is new this year. Never could understand why they made a six inch and jumped all the way up to ten inches. The six inch bait has always worked great but the ten inch bait I have always modified to make it work like the six inch by taking out the weight and wire running through the bait. The weight makes the bait too heavy and the wire kills the proper action. Well on the eight inch bait they left the weight :)out but still ruined the bait by running the wire and plastic through the bait to a second hook which makes the bait just wobble instead of swimming :'(. Still have to do major surgery on the bait to get it to catch fish. But I do have something to work with to make a good 8inch gizzard shad swimbait.

It will catch fish. Don't have a photo of one though.

In addition to the ones above the river2sea S-Waver in the smaller size. Most flipping sticks and medium heavy rods rated for a one ounce bait can throw Mattlures East Coast series and baby bass even though they are around 1.5 ounces. Also the Storm Kickin' Minnows in the six inch size are little over 1 ounce but can be used on regular gear. Basstrix paddletails can also be used on smaller gear.

I had four Spro BBZ shads and three of the four have lost the tail section. Two on the first day I used them and one fell off on the deck before it ever hit the water. I am betting the Tru-Tungsten bait will be the better of the three.

Spro is no different. Reaction Strike and Spro are not much different when it comes to copies.

Here is my theory on wiggle warts and shad raps. They both work/wiggle well at very slow speeds and that is why they both have a reputation for being great cold water cranks. It has nothing to do with tight or wide. It's that both baits get a lot of movement with very little forward motion.

I fish lipless cranks without the rear hook and upsize the front hook. On deep cranks (Rapala DT series) I use the regular stock hooks. On shallow cranks and Shad Rap type baits I upsize the rear hook more often. I also don't crank with a fiberglass or crankbait rod. I use a flipping stick unless I am cranking tiny cranks.

You really should you probably would get some great stuff like these replys to me below. He still claims he was telling the truth. I suggested maybe he was just mistaken and might have made an honest mistake but he will not admit the fish aren't the weight he told GON. I told him about the discussion over here so he could post his side. well when u do something good pepole will try to put u down but both fish are certified they were weighed on certified scales in front of many witenesses they are both in gon mag and i have witnesses to all of it iam 13th and 44th in the state of ga it is not a clame it is fact editors would not but them in the mag if it was not true so u go get one that big and u will see what u have to go trow to certifie them that nothing i was told by many that the 16.2 was bigger by the leath and girth it cameout bigger but i go by scaels .......... sorry u feel that way i have noting to prove but the next one i will have pics on scales what els to prove iam a bass master and will get one bigger next time lol well were is mr randall have not herd anything or any body els lets do it a freindly bass tournement iam not afraid of any bass fisher men. lets put ower real skill to work lets wade the flint now no boat no fish finder just true skill me and randall any time are you afraid mr randall. iam not mad all of this just rolls of my back .that would be a real challange me and you anytime right now sounds good. and pepole have put the wroung fish pics on here and were they were relessed i have nothing els to prove. but i would like to challange mr randall to this south 19 going toward butler ga there is a brige there i challange you 8 hours this saterday there.. 7am to 3pm i will be there just let me no i bet u will not this will show true skill ............... no motors no boats no live wells no fish finders true real fishing a freindly day of bass fishing this is the true test. i challanged you i will be there you do not show well that will tell me all i need to know old shcool this will be fun. all have a great day and get the big ones iam not trying to sell my plug that is aready took care of before this i did not no the 14.6 would be the record in westpoint // but i knew the 16.2 would be in toby peopel has the wroung pics up and tryed to make me look bad ihave caught many fish the ones you see in gon is the fish and they are not the same.i did make a mistake i did not wake the dnr up it was late both times .and i did not get the girth leanth right on the 14.6 but i no what the scales say next time i will get dnr /// but there are pleanty of witness to both bass so do not dog gon out mr baily contacted everyone a man i did not no weighed the 16.2 at toby i have a writen statements from him and statements about the westpoint bass to this is all i have to say ..ps do not jump the gun iam haveing reps done i will post them when i get them back and the best there is in the world is doing my reps ..thanks to all even the hateful people god bless the first pic is not one of this fish no what you are talking about before you talk and i do not care if i sell 1 plug and the other fish is mounted fish some pepole need to go to pearl and get hearing aids i never said the fish were releised in westpoint or tobesakee i said they were relesed you can not tell a live fish from a monted fish the other fish is from years of fishing thanks: u sorry u feel this way but u whant to but you money were your mouth is i will go against u 1on one any time bass heads up well since you know everything there is about bass fishing, i guess George Perry did not catch the world record bass in a beaver pond either did he, and i never said it was caught in the back of a creek channel i said off of sandy beach and the other at yellow jacket shoals, i will not give the dead direct spot out, that is my secert and i will go back and catch bigger fish, and i will call you to come verify it, if that makes you happier bassmaster sir. sorry you feel the way that you do, but pictures shows different things, i have already received a call form John Fox he has seen all measurement and photos and he says its larger than i reported, he contacted me about the fish. he is making the replicas for me so he has seen every single picture way more than you have been able to steal, and there were caught on a plug i designed and produced. i am not mad at you i know what i have done. i have many witnesses and photos and gon did call all of my witnesses and the people that weighed it and verified my story before it was printed. thank you and if you have anything else to say why don't you contact me yourself on myspace, i know you know how to find it. watch it slander is against the law, since you know so much about the law too. and by the way its not illegal to put the fish in a private pond as long as it is caught legally. I have told the DNR, and GON, the local newspaper and john fox, that i released the fish into a private pond, and it is legal. what is your beef with me and my fish, jealously or what?

My swimbaits are stored in a cooler where I rigged wires to hang them from. There are tackle boxes that are made just for swimbaits and that is really what you need. They need to hang so they keep their shape. Most swimbaits can be boiled in hot water and brought back to the original shape. Mattlures has some good info on his site including about how to care for swimbaits properly. http://www.mattlures.com/fishingtips.htm

That's just wrong. ;D

I did just to be fair.

This is his reply to me. well since you know everything there is about bass fishing, i guess George Perry did not catch the world record bass in a beaver pond either did he, and i never said it was caught in the back of a creek channel i said off of sandy beach and the other at yellow jacket shoals, i will not give the dead direct spot out, that is my secert and i will go back and catch bigger fish, and i will call you to come verify it, if that makes you happier bassmaster sir. sorry you feel the way that you do, but pictures shows different things, i have already received a call form John Fox he has seen all measurement and photos and he says its larger than i reported, he contacted me about the fish. he is making the replicas for me so he has seen every single picture way more than you have been able to steal, and there were caught on a plug i designed and produced. i am not mad at you i know what i have done. i have many witnesses and photos and gon did call all of my witnesses and the people that weighed it and verified my story before it was printed. thank you and if you have anything else to say why don't you contact me yourself on myspace, i know you know how to find it. watch it slander is against the law, since you know so much about the law too. and by the way its not illegal to put the fish in a private pond as long as it is caught legally. I have told the DNR, and GON, the local newspaper and john fox, that i released the fish into a private pond, and it is legal. what is your beef with me and my fish, jealously or what? Who is John Fox? I found a guide named John Fox that claims to have caught numerous fish in the upper teens. Like 18 and 19 lbs. Anybody know him?