SENKOSAM

Granted, that's what keep tackle supply companies is business, but are you and I doing a disservice to all of the baits we bought years ago that sit buried in our basements or garages? I have a slew of old Bomber, Bagley, Rapala, Cotton Cordell, Smithwick, Matzuo, Storm and many others I gave up on along with hundreds of soft plastic baits. I have a feeling that the biggest reason we don't stick with certain lures comes from assuming that since they didn't work on different outings and others did, that these lures have no place in our tackle boxes. The other predominate factors are not knowing when to use certain baits - under what conditions or even how to use them to their greatest potential,most of which hasn't been discovered by me due to a low premature confidence in them. There aren't very many lures that are super versatile, each having limitations, but not knowing probably accounts for most of my ever increasing storage - and I don't even like collecting! Certain characteristics I think every angler should know (which many don't or guess) are depth, speed range, best presentation(s), lure action as compared to others in the same group and their limitations regarding each of those. Granted, some lures are junk regardless who makes them and deserve to be melted down or stripped of their treble hooks and split rings. But others like those we do have confidence may fill a niche in specific situations. Maybe it's time to get out the 30 or more Storm crankbaits I bought on clearance a few years ago....(or are they really just junk!?)

How does the rig fall with a rear weight?

Berkeley and Zoom aren't that cheap even though cheaper than GY. There are many small time, custom producers of plastics that have excellent products at 1/2-1/3 the price of the big mass producers and consistent quality applies to every bait. Bass Pro's Stikos are fine except I've found color not to be consistent in every bag for every stick. I've weighed them and found inconsistent weight, off by 1 oz. at times which makes a big difference in fall rate. Most BP plastics suffer the same inconsistent quality and I've had to call them to send another bag (free s/h). Wait until the sales start and load up. If you like a bait - even if it's a bit pricey - buy it. For a few cents more, it may have qualities that you'll swear by like those who use the original Senko. And of course, there's always E Bay and forums (like on this site) where anglers unload surplus tackle. I just sold all of my Arkie Crawlers for 20 bucks and now have 20 bucks to blow on more stuff I'll probably sell at a discount in a year or so. LOL Google soft plastic baits and check out Creme's site for cheap plastics in different designs. Only $1.99 a bag. Frank

Depends on season, cloud cover/weather and water temp. Spring - anytime from 8-8p; fall - anytime after it's warm enough for me to be out there; summer - 10-3pm and one hour before to one hour after sunset.

Good tip airborne. One thing that helps tremendously is to use drift socks for and aft depending on which way you want to cover a shore line or structure (pt.or hump). First, you won't be affected by waves nearly as much because of boat stability; second, your boat drift speed will be at a crawl depending on the size (diameter) of the drift sock. Small corrections in bow direction can be made ever so often with the trolling motor. I use them with my bass boat and 11' aluminum V.

Bankbeater - what size Slugo, hook size and presentation? I got a ton of them and can't make them work.

Now that I'm retired I plan on a pain staking documentation of my 10 local waters' bottoms - where the breaklines are, weed bed edges, bottom hardness changes, the extent of humps and points (rather than guessing) and seasonal changes in bass position relative to structure. How many of you really know what's down there or just stick to fishing the shallows which a majority of anglers pound? I bought some display rakes from a business going under and have started putting individual soft plastic lures, each in its own bag on display so I don't forget to try them and learn each potential. There are lures going back fifteen or more years that according to my log book did fine on different outings but were stored to make room for the latest lure-of-the-day. My own creations are at the top of the rack. When time permits, all lures should be given another chance unless they were defective or inferior to lures of similar design. I've gotten away from casting crankbaits, spinnerbaits, topwater plugs, spoons with trailers, spinner-worms and in-line spinners. Time to get them out of storage and get serious.

Shad Shape Worm kinda reminds me of this one produced By Gambler years ago (minus the salt). (CP, I've just got to say this - your picture bares a strong resemblance to a young Wolowitz on the Big Bang Theory! LOL)

I'll be! Someone a few years ago asked me to duplicate that lure and told me how he fished it using a straight hook exposed through the belly. Now I know the source and that he paid too little! LOL During spring I like to use tapered sticks with and without the blade pictured: (The one above I read about on another site and see its potential.)

I think that is one important factor to even begin organizing for an outing. I never haul all my inventory around when I know the water I'm going to hit and the particular season and time of day that specific lures have done well year after year. It sounds like you know the lures you have confidence in and usually carry enough of in case of loss. I always carry and store my basics for the day in a few boxes and extras and less used lures stored in the car or boat compartments, if there's room. My basics box for soft plastics I have confidence in and like fishing with I store with hooks and jigheads to match in the same box. In my basic jig box I have different weight jigs with complementary trailers in the same box. Light finesse baits with hooks and sinkers or jigheads are together in their own box. A few cranks (deep, suspending and floaters) and maybe some topwater hard and soft baits (depending on time of day and season I'm fishing) are organized as to depth and speed of presentation. These are my basic; everyone has (or should have) their own. My basic lures are rigged on rods that are ready and waiting for situations I come across without the distraction of retying. I'm probably like you - I rarely stay in one spot for more than twenty minutes and investigate different cover and depths a body of water has to offer in a certain order. The basics are always at hand and it's like having a quick reference ready when I need to switch between different lures or presentations. But you need to know the water, its bottom and seasonal patterns to begin constructing your basics boxes and which rod/reel combos. That brings me to basic rod/reel combo selections. As far as rod length, rod action, line test and line type to have ready, the selection should also match your basic lures selection. For example, if I know I will be using long distance hook sets in pads over shallow flats, I will require a 6' 6 medium-heavy action rod and a reel filled with 20# test braid. (My local waters will certainly call for that soon!) If you know that you will be working jigs around rocks, fluorocarbon of a certain pound test and medium action rod might be a basic set-up ready and at hand. If you have a gut feeling open water schools might be near or on open water humps, you might have a medium light rod and 8# test ready for light jigs and plastics. I always do. Again, one size does not fit all in my experience and it makes it easier to carry and have at hand what I need until I become desperate to get strange with lures and presentations I'm not comfortable or experienced using. And of course your basics boxes and rigs will change with experiences and learning alone or fishing with others. My avatar shows me wading a local smallie river carrying two rod/ reel set ups and a basic selection of lures I knew worked that time of year. I was a mile away from the truck and you can only carry so much stuff as well as wading staff. (The other rod was resting on a nearby boulder.) The day was good - over a dozen smallies- and all I needed was four bait types. It's all in the basics buddy!

Did I mention float & fly? I watched a Jerry McGinnis show years ago where an eighty year old was clobbering large smallies in water over 30' deep using the f & f presentation.

I could do the top one but not the bottom one. I have to order some more Spike It Worm paint to be able to paint the coach dog pattern you normally see on crankbaits. The bottom stick is a laminate using florescent glitter in clear plastic. The top one is just clear plastic with black jumbo glitter, dyed with Spike It but without salt so it can be used just subsurface over the shallow flats I usually fish in April and May. For some reason chain pickerel are the main fish I catch on the fire tiger sticks, but largemouth do bite them along with bubble gum, opaque florescent chartreuse, white and Merthiolate (a super intense orange).

Not the only crappie caught on a 6 1/2" hand poured Trick Worm. They and bubble gum Flukes work good for bass and chain pickerel as well in Spring.

What brand? I pour my own: The bottom one is salted and painted (spots) and dyed with Spike_It. The top one is dyed but large flakes are used.

I pour a neutral buoyancy worm that s-l-o-w-ly drops with the weight of the hook and salt. It's super soft so the slightest rod tip twitch makes the pointed tail tremble. This I wacky or T rig. The other is a grub I pour I call the QT or quiver tail, rigged on a 1/16 round jig head with #4 or #2 hook, drop shot rig or split shot. I fish this on 4# or 6# test line. X-Rap suspending plugs are one of my favorite finesse lures because finesse to me always means slow to dead-stick with slight movements.

K-M I agree that fad lures may be of value but that a better mouse trap is always around the corner. Take the Slugo. Still used and still sold in catalogs, but many other soft jerk baits have blown the style away and are more versatile to boot. Pork rind was the only trailer people used, but now soft plastics are used far more for many reasons. The #8 willow leaf blade spinnerbait the Roland Martin sold is no longer popular, though I still make them and cast them every year. The Chatterbait is what a would call a niche lure - it fulfills the need for a specific action certain times of the year. Other baits do as well or better and I haven't heard of any major tournaments where they were key to winning, same as the Senko. Better baits and presentations survive the test of time and the marketing of them becomes unnecessary because they become standards. Many that don't sell well disappear and maybe shouldn't have - I miss many a good lure that was discontinued. Frank

I don't remember saying that or reading it. Many anglers I've fished with that are limited in versatility and don't care to become more versatile, seem to just like buying stuff when they can't be out fishing. The lures just accumulate and hang out in the tackle box until maybe they are cast a few times. If those lures don't produce, the angler forgets about them and may never cast them again unless by chance he sees someone use them successfully. For many of us, new lures on the market may work but only with a select few presentations to be of any value.Banjo minnow has caught fish, but the ads lie about the lure's versatility. Lure and presentation diversity are outside the scope of why many anglers fish and those anglers are usually at the bottom of a club 's standings. Those at the top are those, like you, that investigate claims, try new or old things with new or old lures. One of the quickest ways to do that is watch a video or be in the same boat as someone versed at using certain lures and presentations. Again, seeing is believing and once an idea smacks me upside the head, I become a fanatic believer and will master the lure/presentation just for the challenge, as well as add it to my knowledge base if successful over time. I might even discover something by accident on my own and use that presentation another day to see if it was a fluke, but in any case it will something of value, always. Many pros, IMO, try to start a fad with products they endorse. Nothing wrong with that because you and I will be the final test and those lures that make it will be in catalogs for years to come; those that don't make it two years in a row end up in clearance sales. I'm curious if the A rig and Chatterbait will still be around five years from now (I have no desire to try the A rig). That to me, is what versatility is all about.

Me too! Hey but at least its fun when you discover something you can sink your teeth into!

Other than learning from others directly, you have the fantastic opportunity to learn from the variety of structure available in your area, same as Franco. Many of us settle for the limitations of our local waters and can't try out presentations and lures specific to what some of us want to learn applicable to what we've been exposed to, at least in theory. (Theory is just a word meaning, maybe, maybe not, awaiting confirmation) lol You're one lucky dude! I took copious notes at a seminar where KVD, Brauer, Nixon, Woo Daves and Bill Dance were speakers and understood exactly the wisdom they imparted. To this day I haven't been able to apply 1/10 of their suggestions because of the waters I've been limited to. Now that I'm retired, I hope to break the habit of not venturing outside my area and exploring new waters or re-learning rarely visited waters. It's not just time on the water; it's time spent on different waters with different bottom types and cover.

Perfectly said. Ditto !!! X10

It's not separate and can never be separate! You've made a good point!!! It's all related to what I cast and how I work a lure. There's nothing wrong with toting around more stuff than you'll ever use, even stuff you have zero confidence in, but I would at least want to know when and where to try (as you said) different lures in certain areas such as humps, channels, stump fields, deep, shallow or in between. Each test or condition of versatility mentioned only scratches the surface and if all an angler just wants is to get some sun and breathe fresh air while getting some time away from the ol lady while downing a few Buds, absolutely nothing wrong with that. But versatility is a challenge for many of us, whether recreational or tournament fishing, and many that aspire to becoming versatile mistakenly believe that more = being more versatile without ever truly knowing the limitations or advantages of the stuff stored (permanently?) in their tackle boxes. So much so that they can't find anything half the time that they swore they packed! I would think that another key part of being versatile is being organized and disciplined. This forum and others have given many of us insight into not only what it means to become more versatile, but how to build on it and stay more flexible under various conditions and in different locations. For me the opposite of versatility is what a call FISHING INSANITY or doing the same thing over and over and going hours or days without a bite.

Agree with statement but that doesn't determine versatility. Say you have different lures rigged on different rods that aren't producing, when do you change lures or weights or add light leaders? On some days location is everything; other days it's a combination of location and presentation plus the best lures for those presentations. Again it goes back to the fantasy that catches more anglers than fish - newer has a high probability of doing better than what we own and that we truly know how and when to use. 3/4 of the junk baits I own (approx. 60 lbs. ) was purchased on a whim and a prayer and the misconception that cheap knock offs are better than the original. Just the fact I bought the stuff (mostly during clearance sales) speaks to my lack of versatility and the phrase, a sucker is born every minute. Granted, new products come out ever so often that have unique characteristics and can become a new breed of lures that better stimulates a bass's senses or that are significantly better lures for certain presentations and locations (IE. large swimbaits, creature baits, better jig trailers, improved crankbaits, etc.). Those are the lures we must evaluate and compare notes as well as master to become more versatile.

Jbird, I first got confidence in them when Roland Martin won a tournament locally on the Hudson River using a huge willow leaf blade and white skirt. I did great the first time I cast them in different waters, including tidal waters. Start out casting them around the spawn over flats and any place you usually do well early season and expect some good hits. A trailer hook might be a good idea, at least at first. Think bright and flashy! That is one fad lure that is no longer mentioned in Bass Master, but what makes a lure a fad lure and more important, why stop using it when no one else seems to be?

Each angler is different when it comes to versatility. Are there lures or presentations that KVD hasn't mastered or refuses to learn? Many like him were power fishermen and slowing down meant less fish until not slowing down nor using a slower presentation meant less fish. Not too many who've posted this topic are in a Clunn or KVD class and most likely will never be given the many factors that limit us. Here are a few: 1. You and I can read every article written on a certain presentation or lure, but unless we've seen someone in the same boat clobber fish with it, we are less inclined to use it or after trying it unsuccessfully, ever try it again much less master it. Seeing is (sometimes) believing (except on TV). 2. Many of us don't have the time or resources to fish many different waters where certain presentations do well with certain lures at different times of year or a different time of day. Again, we can read until the cows come home what the winners used to win a tournament on lake X, but until we fish that water or one very similar, under those conditions, you or I will be at a loss why the lure or presentation didn't work where we normally fish. Ever fish a lake only once in the year because the club had a tournament there? Not knowing a body of water is like not knowing when or where to use certain lures - you won't go back there and in the back of your mind believe the lake stinks because you couldn't get a bite. I know a group of guys from my club that fished a Red Man open tournament down south and skunked miserably. These guys were the best at fishing waters the club fished but not as versatile as they thought on strange water in a different state. 3. Strong beliefs and prejudices limit the confidence needed to believe in a lure or presentation and they are due to 1. and 2. as well as financial considerations to justify even owning a variety of lures and colors. One size does not fit all - not one lure size, not one color, not one lure action nor at all speeds nor at all depths. Disappointment and frustration kills confidence in lures and presentations when we don't follow that simple rule. As has been stated many times before, there is a time and a place that certain group of tools of the trade are called for and many of those tools are put to better use by others who have overcome a whiff of prejudice against using them. The strangest thing of all is when I've logged having caught many fish on certain lures in the past and then packed them away, completely forgetting them or their successes. I have a tendency to mistakenly believe that a lure that did well the first year or so, will not do well from then on - anywhere. So much for keeping an open mind and not substituting the new for the old. Which brings me to: 4. Embracing the fad --- or fear of it How many have completely substituted lures and presentations for new ones? We live in a disposable society so for many that's the norm. On the other hand how many fad lures come and go and it makes us skeptical every time a new one comes out. Sure, the A rig works in some waters for some anglers, but we automatically suspect the lure is far less versatile than some we already own. Same for the Chatterbait or the similar action of Helin's Flat Fish crank bait. Why would we buy a new lure that obviously only works in a brief period of the year or day? Was it promoted by someone that we no longer trust? Again, the tendency is to buy a one size does not fits all lure or never give it a chance. 5. Lastly, how many of you pack a ton of lures every time you go fishing only to use maybe a hand full. Many anglers I know carry hundreds of lures, many full packs of soft plastics, boxes of spinnerbaits, jigs and crankbaits, yet few get wet anytime. I think some believe that carrying more is better, not realizing that more is just plain confusing and limiting to those that don't know how and when to use the majority of what they own. I witnessed that frustration with a tournament partner I fished with. In two days I caught far more than he did with the small selection I carried versus the large box of lures he never used except for one or two. Not once did he look at the sonar or ask questions and therefore never knew what I was casting to. My lures were never adopted by him even though he owned them and worse, he refused to use them after three fish were caught within fifteen minutes! A closed mind is such a waste and much of the time self defeating.

Thanks Wayne - I wondered the differences and similarities. The top hook in the picture may look like and Octopus hook but is actually from a tie flying company and the hook is called a San Juan Worm hook with upturned eye. I liked it because of the thin metal hook and the size that fits my hand pour finesse worms. So I gather from what you posted was that not all Octopus looking hooks can be called Octopus hooks (depending on manufacturer), but that all circle hooks are Octopus hooks. Dink Dawg - I just saw a video on You Tube where Marsten opened up the gap a bit on the drop shot hook he was using. What was confusing was his use of a uni-knot to tie on the hook. I've always thought the palomar was basic.