MRob05

^couldn't agree more little_stephen. We need less BS and more football. Not more BS and less football. I appreciate the responses guys. It goes to show how knowledgeable members here are when it comes to sports. College football means a lot to me and I hate when the sport I love gets watered down. I hope one day we can see the sport go back to its roots. What would really help college football would be less commercials, less replay reviews, old clock rules and better overtime (only needed in championship games).

I believe the real problem here is that they moved kickoffs back to the 30 yard line in 2007. Remember their reasoning was that the kickoff return was "the most exciting play in football". And remember coaches like Joe Tiller of Purdue didn't like the rule because it was "the most dangerous play in football". Before 2007, there weren't that many kickoff returns, there were a lot more touchbacks, and coverage teams didn't form the wedge as much because the kickoff team was downfield quicker from the 35 yard line. Now, there are almost no touchbacks anymore due to the longer kickoff distance, so the return unit have 5 more yards until they meet the opposing kickoff team, essentially more time to form the wedge. 1inStripes, thanks for informing me as to the safety concerns of kickoffs. Now I understand where that is coming from. Perhaps the wedgebuster does cause concussions. But tackling a player with the ball can also cause a concussion. Perhaps it will limit concussions to limit the amount of players that can be involved a wedge, but to me that's something that has always been part of the game and part of a kickoff return strategy. I am of the belief that what is causing more concussions on kickoff returns than anything is the fact that kickoffs are now from the 30 yard line. From the 35, there were a lot more touchbacks, less returns, less of the most dangerous play in football.

Yeah I don't know if there was a rule that actually says "score and then do your dance", but now you can't even do your dance with the rules that were implemented a few years ago involving excessive celebration. Yeah exactly. I don't think college football is going to be as much fun anymore like it used to be. It's gunna feel very bland and repetitive. In years past college football was the most exciting game in America. There was nothing like watching the end of an exciting game. Now it's like you can't even celebrate, to me it just seems like the NCAA has gone bureaucracy on us really quickly over the past few years and to me it doesn't get me excited to watch games anymore like I used to. I don't get why they don't just leave the game alone and let it flourish. There are so many problems with the game now it seems counter-productive to focus on celebration penalties instead of trying to improve the actual game.

Perhaps it shouldn't have been part of the game, but the reality was it was part of the game. I agree that it's rude, risky, and coaches probably should scold players who do that, because the opponent will remember that stuff and it won't sit well with them. But there are teams that are coached well not to embarrass your opponent. Some teams showboat and sometimes it can be funny and exciting. That's why the game is to stop your opponent from running free into the endzone. I basically agree that it's not classy to do something like that on your way to an easy touchdown. It's kind of like running up the score. You shouldn't do it if you play the game the way it's meant to be played, but teams should be able to do anything they want on the field so long as they aren't physically harming the opposition. After all, they train and go through a lot of work to get on the field, and if they succeed in breaking through on the way to a touchdown, the way I see it is they earned their ability to celebrate. I agree that it's bad sportsmanship, but to me it's not necessarily unsportsmanlike. You can be a good sportsman or a bad sportsman, or you can be unsportsmanlike. Unsportsmanlike is really hitting a player for no good reason after a play is over, or spiking a ball into an opposing player from the other team after a touchdown. That to me should be penalized. But I don't think refs should be able to take points off the board just because you somersault into the endzone or high step into the endzone. That to me is an exciting play that fans of that team can cheer. The teams that I support always run into the endzone and hand the ball to the ref. But not all teams in the past do that. Some celebrate. And I think it kind of takes away from the style that some teams have. Like the old Miami teams in the 80s would have been flagged so much for their antics. But it was fun for the fans and more importantly it made teams want to try to find ways to beat them because they had such swagger. It's not that I support embarrassing your opponent, but I think teams should be able to do it because they have to earn that touchdown and it shouldn't be taken away from them imho if they decide to celebrate or showboat. Yeah exactly, like I don't want to see games decided by refs flagging a team for a borderline celebration, like what happened to Jake Locker when he throw the ball over his shoulder and got called for a 15 yard penalty after he scored, then they lost the game. Scoring a touchdown should be an exciting play, and so long as you aren't physically attacking a player on the opposing team, I don't see why a flag is needed. Why can't players celebrate when they score? It's so stupid if you think about it. Basically that takes all the emotion out of the game and teams will act like robots out there instead of creating exciting plays for their fans to watch.

Another offseason in college football, another dosage of bureaucracy in college football. I'd like to know what you guys think about the latest proposed rule changes in college football for the 2010 season. Rule Change: If a player is deemed to have taunted an opponent during the process of a scoring a touchdown, the penalty would nullify the score. Note that excessive celebration after a score is not included and would still be viewed as a dead-ball misconduct foul, assessed after the score is counted. The rule could potentially flag actions like high-stepping into the end zone or doing a somersault over the goal line. I can't even believe that one. I am left speechless. "Our committee firmly believes in the team concept of college football," said Mike Bellotti, chair of the committee and athletics director at Oregon. "Taunting and prolonged individual acts have no place in our game, and our officials have generally handled these rules well. This is just another step in maintaining our game's image and reflecting the ideals of the NCAA overall." Other items from the committee meeting ... -- A proposal extending current policies regarding medical clearance of injured athletes to specifically cover possible concussions. -- Agreement on rule regarding "Eye Black": If a player wishes to wear patches under his eyes, he can't write anything on them, be it area codes, phrases, symbols, names or Bible verses (Tim Tebow-style). This is to be effective in 2010. -- Beginning in 2011, television monitors will be allowed in the press box booths used by coaches. The home team will have responsibility for insuring that coaches' booths for both teams have identical television capability. -- Removal of rule requiring a player's pants to cover his knees at all times. -- Discussed possibility of prohibiting an intentional wedge of three or more receiving team players on free kicks. This one I don't understand. Why should a wedge of three or more players be prohibited? Isn't that an effective, textbook way to teach special teams players to block during a kickoff return? I suspect this has to do with the initial starting field position that teams have received since they moved kickoffs back to the 30 yard line. This one just perplexes me. Just move kickoffs back to the 35. Sheesh. -- Agreed to discuss changes at next year's meeting to simplify rules regarding blocking below the waist. And they want to simplify rules. Ha! That's a good one NCAA

I read this message a few months ago but I waited until seeing this season through to just make sure the game has changed. And surely enough, it has. Everytime I watch a game and see a player run out of bounds, I look at the clock, and I see it start to run. And I say to myself, this is precious time in the game that a team may need late in the 4th quarter if it's close. And then when I see a player get tackled and I see the 40 second clock start running, and I see an officially rush to spot the ball with about 33 seconds left on the play clock, I say to myself, that's 8 seconds that an offense can just milk the ball instead of having to run a play. The other thing I hate is that now, when a player catches a ball and runs past the first down marker, no matter whether he gets out of bounds or whether he stays in bounds, the clock still stops momentarily and then runs. This last part is actually the thing I hate the most. Now when you are trailing in the 4th quarter and you pick up a first down and are still running, it doesn't matter whether you run out of bounds or whether you stay in bounds. See in the NFL, there is still incentive to run out of bounds, because the clock doesn't stop when you move the chains in the NFL. What people don't realize is the clock stopping when you move the chains is a rule that coincided with the refereeing spotting the ball and starting the 25 second clock. When a player got a first down and stayed in bounds, the game clock only started when the referee started the 25 second clock. There was a pacing to this. A pacing that kept the game in perfect synchronization and harmony. It was paced by the referee. This was an important part of college football because the coaches and players had a lot of things to think about throughout the entire game. scootz, these clock rules have hurt the game. And they've hurt the game in a way that most people don't realize. Some people think it's better, think the game is faster and more TV friendly and that's better or something. The replay system is even worse in college football. Stopping the game to "check the spot", then to get the call wrong more times than not is bad too. Bad calls are a part of the game, always have been. If a bad call decides the outcome of the game, then sometimes it sucks, but at least you watched a great game with enough possessions to satisfy the football fan in the stands. These rules will bother me forever and makes it hard for me to watch a college football game nowadays. I usually watch it until someone runs out of bounds and the clock just keeps running. At that point I usually just change the channel and just catch the highlights on ESPN. But I can tell ya that there was a time when the game meant something to me, such that I would watch a game and watch the whole game, call a friend to talk about the last play and how great it was, and when the game was over, have the winner actually mean something. You would watch a game and see a team use the sidelines when trailing, be able to huddle up and take their time on the following play, a reward for your ability to get out of bounds against a tough defense. And when a player gets a first down and stays in bounds when trailing late in a game, they would line up with the referee standing there until the chains were moved, and wait until the referee spotted the ball and started that 25 second play clock only after he spotted the ball and signled it to start, and there was indeed a charm to that whole process. Now it's just a big mess, college football is just a shell of it's former self. Did any of you watch that Iowa - Ohio State game this past weekend? Both teams played very well and there was a lot of talent on that field. But the end of the game was such an awful way to decide a Big Ten champion. It was decided by overtime, for the first time ever. This year there are two Rose Bowls, for the first time ever. Ohio St got all of two yards in overtime and won the game on a field goal. At the end of regulation Iowa just let the clock run out instead trying to get into position for a field goal, because the clock was running out of control the whole game and there was no time left, so they just went for overtime. There was a time when college football had draws, had long epic battles in regulation with no friggin replay reviews and controversial replay reversals :-/where complex decisions were made throughout the game by both teams, and whether it was a win, loss, or draw, you saw a great game on a Saturday. A game that made America proud Ladies and gents, those days are long gone. And it's hard to argue that the game is better today then it was even just a few years ago.

The college football clock rules saga tears at the college football purist's heart. It's very simple. The game of college football has been butchered. The everylasting joy we all get out of a college football saturday is the fact that when a runner runs out of bounds, the clock always stops until the next snap. That's the game of college football I know, love and remember. This clock rules saga is unwelcome bureaucracy in sports at its absolute worst. When a team is trailing in a college football game, using the sidelines was one way of coming back. When you get out of bounds, as a quarterback, you get the added benefit of not having to worry about the clock running. You could run to your coach, for a quick play, maybe while the referee is fetching the ball, and starting the new 25 second play clock. If you ran out of bounds and didn't get a first down, it was a huge factor in determining who won games. It was a very, very important rule in the game of college football. Without the clock stopping on out of bounds plays, every American associated with college football is getting cheated out of a proper result. The game is still exciting, still fun to watch. There's still great coaches and great players. But that rule was the great equalizer of the sport. It was the backbone of college football, and it was ripped out from under every one of us. It allowed all styles to compete on a level playing field. Passing teams, rushing teams, no huddle teams, huddle teams. There was a precise matrix associated with each risk reward. A matrix that has been altered, again, again, and again, then not altered back the way it should be. Without that rule of the clock always stopping on out of bounds plays, and with refs rushing to spot against a NFL 40 second running clock, it makes huddling (you know the huddle, the thing that some teams still use) a liability in places where it wasn't in previous years (like when you run out of bounds). It creates a no-huddle game. Teams feel pressured to no huddle now. Let me say that sometimes a no huddle is a great way to play offense. And some teams can do it and try to score quick and catch the defense off-guard. But the balance of that was prefect in 2005 and it is now not perfect now due to the speed up rules. A huddle is an integral part of the game. Seeing players "break" and decide on a player is very important. Sometimes it takes players a while to get up after a play is over, like a scrum for a loose fumble, or something, and with a ticking 40 second closk, it creates a kind of a frenzy for referees to spot the ball, when in the past, they'd kinda handle the end of the play with more care. Because they decided when the 25 second play clock starts, usually when the ball is spotted. And they also decided (if ther is a scrum for a loose ball or something) whether the clock should stop because it's taking too long. It was fun the way it was. It was charming. Now, it is not charming and you don't smile at the end of the play and "see what happens". Now it's all automatic and i hate that. It's what they took away from us because they created an inefficient and frankly random, annoying, and unfair replay system. And they created a pointless overtime format 1996, that could potentially never end. It was just a cheap way to end a 60:00 game that's tied. If you don't have time to have an extra period, then I don't even wanna play overtime. Just leave it at a draw because both teams scored equal points. Don't just give to to one team from the 25 yard line. That's not real football. All the while the regulations were still great. But starting in 2006, they started changing the laws that govern the regulation time to fit it into a timeslot. In 2006, they ran the clock on change of possessions and kickoffs (while the ball was in the air). These changes are not just "little things" to some people. They are "big things" that carry lots of unintended consequences. I can't really watch college football anymore. I love my team still, but game isn't the same. I can't take college football seriously. Even the BCS was a bogus system from the very start, but at least it didn't totally ruin the game. At least the games themselves were proper, felt right, not wrong to everyone except the select few in the NCAA who made the changes. Then you took the BCS with a grain of salt, and you just tried to support your team. Now college football has totally embarrassed itself with these rule changes. Rugby punting should be allowed. But I think the punter probably loses his protection when he runs to the side. That's why there should be blockers in front of him if he runs to a punt to block any incoming defenders trying to block or tackle. The problem I see is the 5 yard running into the kicker penalty going away last season. I think if you are clearly going for the punter's legs, and miss the ball, the ref should be able to call a 5 yard penalty. But it should be at the referee's discretion. Keep in mind that unlike a regular punt, the rugby style kicker is running, so it is actually harder to take the legs out from under the punter. I don't think it should be such a big deal. The rugby style kickers could get hit if they try a rugby style punt. It's a dangerous play anytime you run close to the LOS on a punt. Rugby style punts should be an exciting play for the fans. It shouldn't be like "how do we change the rule for rugby style punts". That's the problem with college football. Everything always needs fixing when somebody does something different. It's like we have to do this to accomodate this, that doesn't make sense, then we have to change this again. Not only should the out of bounds rule never, ever, ever change in college football from what it was in 2005, but there should never be any "pressure" from anyone to change rules like this. In America, we should not have as many TV timeouts as we do. A lot of it has to do with the economy, but that's for another post. If a team wants to throw the ball out of bounds on every play, they should be able to do it and get a long game. That's their reward for getting out of bounds. You earn more possessions. You get more plays, which shows that you got talent. Why would a team do this? Getting out of bounds is hard to do, especially against good teams. As bad as the rule itself is, it's even worse that there is pressure to create rules like this. Things like 5 yard facemask penalties and 5 yard running into the kicker penalties were important. Kicking off from the 35 yardline was fine. The 30 is probably too far back for college, it creates shorter initial drives, and a lot more returns, which change the game. Kickoff returns are dangerous plays. They can be exciting, but the number of touchbacks is a good milestone for kickers to have, and now that milestone is so far away from the 30. You should be rewarded for getting a deep kicker by not having to contain and tackle a dangerous return man. There's a balance to it. Kickoffs from the 35 are more about "touch" and less about distance. Yes, distance is important, but you are driving the kick from the 30 yard line. From the 35, you could drive it, but you could also kick it high in the sky and still get it near the goaline. That made teams have to drive longer, have to go more yards on defenses, and I think that was important. From the 35, in 2005, the kickoff distribution was perfect. There were touchbacks, but it was fairer. From the 30 now, it's almost always a kick return. And that creates shorter fields. I like seeing teams drives the length of the field early in games. I miss that. If you think about, replays are really only needed in the late stages of the game, if it's close. I think the game should flow more without having random stoppages to check the clock, especially early in the game. What good is it if you "get the call right" at the expense of future calls in the game? Lets just have the refs do the best they can, make the call, stop the ball, and lets get on with it, and not be dealing with exessive replay reviews. It's poor. There are way too many commercials and way to many commercial stoppages. There shouldn't be a commercial every time there is a change of possession. Sometimes it's fun to see a team return a punt, and go right to offense. It's nice, right even. A college game shouldn't always be "stopped" and "started" by commercials. As a college football fan, it's embarrassing to see what the NCAA has to the game college football between 06-08, and now 09 upcoming. 2005 was the greatest season, and it will probably be the last great season of college football. Since that season, the game has been tinkered with in reprehensible ways. I only dream of a college football sport with 2005 rules, regular season draws (chuck this mindless OT format), and real, full period overtime (no sudden death) for Conference Championship Games and Bowl Games. This is America's game. Look at the Japan game versus the Notre Dame Legends. What a great game it was. College football is about having a level playing field out there and know what we are going to get going into a season. Lou Holtz understands this, he just can't say much. These rule changes have created so many problems to the game, the guys in the NCAA's must just be blind to it and obviously have an agenda. I am sick and tired of clock rule changes, and then not changing back the bad changes. I don't even want to talk about it, I just want to watch college football the way it used to be. (in out recent memories, like 2005) Those refs need to be able to pace college football games. It's a very intricate science to administer a game. Networks should totally stay out of it. Why can't it be like soccer, where there are no commercial breaks during each half? A lot of factors are in effect and the refs do the best job they can. But the fact that they pace it made the game great. Now human error has been taken out and frankly, I can't take it seriously anymore. It was fine when there were just a few commercials in college football. It was kinda a nice break to the athletes and even to the fans sometimes. It allowed a team to "take a breath" before going back on the field. But I think we have gotten to a point where America has made a mockery out of the standards that existed. Some change is good, but bad changes has become so overwhelming in sports that it is only prompting more serious reform and less corruption. But that also forces the corrupt in charge to make their group more elite. Maybe not this year, because after changing the clock rules for 3 straight years, (the one year they aren't changing the rules is because they have changed it for 3 straight years) but eventually I think it is possible that these rules will be reverted to 2005. But the problem is now we can't get really excited about college football because the games aren't proper anymore. And a college football saturday is something very important to a lot of people in america, especially those currently in their mid 20s. The clock rules just need to be reverted to 2005 in college football. Yes, even the horsecollar tackle. If someone uses the horsecollar exessively, he can be flaged or get a warning or something. But banning it creates less angles you have as a defender to bring down a ball carrier. Due to the complexity of college football teams ans strategies, sometimes a horsecollar is a great play on 3rd down. The referees should allow horsecollars but if they are used unnecesarily, they should throw a flag for unsportsmanlike. Very simply, America needs the 2005 clock rules, but at this point, college football has gotten so corrupt, that I think eliminating regular season overtime must now be put on the table. That's probably the only way they would be pushed back based on the collective illogic that we have seen. But that leads to more questions and more reform. I think America needs a small group of college football purists to get our game back. That's what we need. A 40 second clock is not college football. It loses its luster with that and running the clock on out of bounds. It loses it's polish, it's greatness even. The preamble to the game isn't as great because it's too close to the end of the game. We all know this, but most people don't say anything because they still want to "believe" that the game is great. The players and coaches certainly have to. But we the fans do not. There's nothing wrong with that; I am watching Notre Dame @ Tennessee in 2004, and boy am I on the edge of my seat. The game feels different than before the rule changes. The game was proper. You felt like it was "official". After 2005, college football has not been the same for me. It was so exciting and it made you feel good. The college hoops no charge zone was the icing on the cake. The NCAA has taken away all the great things that make college football and college basketball unique and interesting. They put wrong things in there and tug at the backbone of the game we know. That backbone can only take so much. They take away the tradition and the history without even batting an eye. They take away right, huddling, sanity, and team defense in college basketball. It's very important for America to take itself seriously. People grow up watching college football, know it a certain way. You can't change it and expect people to be okay with it. It has to be changed back, and until it does, it won't feel right. All you gotta do is watch a college football game 2005 and before that to know what it was and what it is now. So Quitlimpin, as you wrote, it is wrong for the clock to keep running when a player runs out of bounds. It's cataclysmically wrong. It's not really college football to see that clock running. I don't care what the NFL did. The NFL is the NFL. Just like the NBA is the NBA. Just because they change something like running the clock on out of bounds plays or kicking from the 30 yard line, or have a no charging zone, doesn't mean the NCAA should just copy them and change their game as a sort of knee-jerk reaction of elite members of the NFL. I heard rumor that defensive pass interference was going to become a spot foul. That must of been a close vote by the NCAA. :-? At least they came to their senses there, but they are so far lost to what the game has become. College football remained great because it somehow felt "untouched" in 2005 or before that. You know what you were getting. Now, with all this unnecesary confusion, it just all feels fake when it should feel real again like it did in 2005 and before that.