Why 20+pound line?

[Captain Phil]

The heaviest bass I have caught so far, I caught flipping Lake Eustis in January.  I was using 25 pound Big Game mono and a Gambler craw.  The fish hit right under the boat.  When I set the hook, the fish ran under the boat and broke my flipping stick in two on the gunnel.  This fish cleared the water on the other side of the boat and the line got tangled around my trolling motor.  I was sure I would lose her, but thankfully I was able to hand line her in.  I weighed her on a digital scale, took this photo and released her back into the lake.  The boy is my grandson.  He's thirty now.  If you fish where fish like that are swimming around, you might want to use some line that's up to the challenge.  ? 

 

[WRB]

Bass anglers in general use line 2X stronger then the rod can lift. Something is going to break unless the drag releases the force using 20 lb line. 

The advantage is abrasion strength. Abraded or nicked 20 lb line has reduced pulling force strength and less impact strength. In heavy cover the stronger line is like insurance, you only need when do needed it.

Northern strain LMB are not line shy bass and strike small lures on heavy large dia line. Florida strain LRM May Strike heavy large diameter line in cover with low light but rarely strike small lures in clear water with sparse cover during day light.

If you look up the giant bass caught in SoCal like Bob Crupi etc, they used live crawdads with 10lb line. Why?, getting bit is essential to catching the bass, larger diameter line results in no strikes.

Larger size lures that weight 4 to 8 oz, requires stronger larger diameter line to cast and get a good hook set plus the larger lures swimming action isn’t affected. Never the less I watch more big bass turn away from big swimbaits then strike them. Why? could be they see the line.

Tom

 

 

[PressuredFishing]

5 minutes ago, WRB said:

Bass anglers in general use line 2X stronger then the rod can lift. Something is going to break unless the drag releases the force using 20 lb line. 

The advantage is abrasion strength. Abraded or nicked 20 lb line has reduced pulling force strength and less impact strength. In heavy cover the stronger line is like insurance, you only need when do needed it.

Northern strain LMB are not line shy bass and strike small lures on heavy large dia line. Florida strain LRM May Strike heavy large diameter line in cover with low light but rarely strike small lures in clear water with sparse cover during day light.

If you look up the giant bass caught in SoCal like Bob Crupi etc, they used live crawdads with 10lb line. Why?, getting bit is essential to catching the bass, larger diameter line results in no strikes.

Larger size lures that weight 4 to 8 oz, requires stronger larger diameter line to cast and get a good hook set plus the larger lures swimming action isn’t affected. Never the less I watch more big bass turn away from big swimbaits then strike them. Why? could be theyvsee the line.

Tom

 

 

Very interesting, your explanation makes a ton of sense, thanks for this information as always.

[Captain Phil]

My understanding of the SoCal lakes is that they are clear and relatively snag free?  The anglers I see in videos are all throwing big swim baits.  I am a big believer in light line fishing if that's what it takes to get bit.  Here in Florida, our biggest bass are often buried up in all kinds of stuff.  Sometimes I think I could use a garden rake instead of a fishing rod.   The first time I fished a tournament on the St. John's river was back in the seventies.  I was so psyched out I refilled all my reels with 30 pound line. My line was like cable and I don't think I caught a fish.  Lesson learned. 

[Catt]

1 hour ago, PressuredFishing said:

So I have cheaper reels so forgive me if I don't quite understand, but I fish that type of cover somewhat often and I have found when flipping with 60+ pound braid my reel can't pull the fish out of cover on max drag and it keeps slipping. I have to pull with my hands. Do your reels do the same thing? 

 

Nope! I have 20+ drag but it still ain't 100% locked down.

[PressuredFishing]

6 minutes ago, Catt said:

 

Nope! I have 20+ drag but it still ain't 100% locked down.

May have to look into a new reel other than my revo stx, drag May just be tired.

[jimmyjoe]

 

22 minutes ago, Catt said:

 

Nope! I have 20+ drag but it still ain't 100% locked down.

 

That's when I start using my thumb! 

 

BTW, @Catt  .....  you said you have landed 35 double-digit bass on a Calcutta reel that only has 11 lbs. of drag. Which reel are you using that has 20+ lbs. of drag? (Inquiring minds want to know.  ? )       jj

[The Maestro]

34 minutes ago, jimmyjoe said:

 

 

That's when I start using my thumb! 

 

BTW, @Catt  .....  you said you have landed 35 double-digit bass on a Calcutta reel that only has 11 lbs. of drag. Which reel are you using that has 20+ lbs. of drag? (Inquiring minds want to know.  ? )       jj

A lot of the low profile Abu Garcias used to tout 20+lbs of drag. Dont know if they still do though.

[PressuredFishing]

1 hour ago, jimmyjoe said:

 

 

That's when I start using my thumb! 

 

BTW, @Catt  .....  you said you have landed 35 double-digit bass on a Calcutta reel that only has 11 lbs. of drag. Which reel are you using that has 20+ lbs. of drag? (Inquiring minds want to know.  ? )       jj

Legitimate question, I was thinking same thing, perhaps he was using his thumb on the spool, perhaps the fish didn't pull hard enough. Not sure 

[NoShoes]

Unless it’s punching or frogging I don’t really see the point in high test lines. You get bit far more on lighter lines and with well set drag and decent skill playing the fish you should be able to land them no problem. 
 

I don’t have an impressive list of DD fish, or even one for that matter. 12 lb big game hasn’t had any issues fighting any of the fish I’ve caught, even around vegetation 

[PressuredFishing]

1 minute ago, NoShoes said:

Unless it’s punching or frogging I don’t really see the point in high test lines. You get bit far more on lighter lines and with well set drag and decent skill playing the fish you should be able to land them no problem. 
 

I don’t have an impressive list of DD fish, or even one for that matter. 12 lb big game hasn’t had any issues fighting any of the fish I’ve caught, even around vegetation 

I use 12lb for most my techniques, it's a great all around size, of corse I may change to floro for bottom rigs, or copolymer for topwater, but usually 12lb unless I'm finesse fishing, then 6lb If I can get away with it, but usually 8lb.

[Catt]

1 hour ago, jimmyjoe said:

Which reel are you using that has 20+ lbs. of drag? (Inquiring minds want to know.  ? )       jj

 

Due to physical limitations that come with old age I had @Delaware Valley Tackle overhaul my Calcutta 100s & then I retired them.

 

My worm rod is a Lew's Team Lite & my jig rod is a Lew's Tournament MB.

[gim]

15 hours ago, jbsoonerfan said:

I would be willing to bet that 90% or more of fish that break off are due to one of two things, drag set too tight or compromised line. 

Virtually 100% of my lost fish are because of bite offs from northern pike.  My line is inspected before every outing but even perfectly new or unused line can't stand up to those teeth.

 

[Basseditor]

I use heavy line because the next cast could be a 10 pounder in a tree, bush, or heavy, heavy grass!

 

Some of the bass around here have rough teeth and saw through light line very quickly.

[NoShoes]

9 minutes ago, basseditor said:

I use heavy line because the next cast could be a 10 pounder in a tree, bush, or heavy, heavy grass!

 

Some of the bass around here have rough teeth and saw through light line very quickly.

Ive seen bass teeth abrade line that could cause a break on a future hook set, but never any that plain cut it. 

[PressuredFishing]

1 hour ago, Catt said:

 

Due to physical limitations that come with old age I had @Delaware Valley Tackle overhaul my Calcutta 100s & then I retired them.

 

My worm rod is a Lew's Team Lite & my jig rod is a Lew's Tournament MB.

Yeah my grandfather doesn't fish heavy Gear anymore light casting equipment with fine wire hooks or spinning equipment, he just leans into the fish and usually sticks em. I have found light wire+light line=higher catch ratio in open water. Big baits and heavy hooks scare me, don't bring up any fish I've lost on a hud.... 

32 minutes ago, basseditor said:

I use heavy line because the next cast could be a 10 pounder in a tree, bush, or heavy, heavy grass!

 

Some of the bass around here have rough teeth and saw through light line very quickly.

I have never had a big issue with 6+lb line for bass, but I spybait with 2lb line and an ultralight for winter bass, and I have to retire every catch. Because they have sandpaper mouths

[jbsoonerfan]

1 hour ago, gimruis said:

Virtually 100% of my lost fish are because of bite offs from northern pike.  My line is inspected before every outing but even perfectly new or unused line can't stand up to those teeth.

 

Sorry, I don't have to deal with toothy critters, never crossed my mind.

[bowhunter63]

20 lb Big Game caught em way back then and it  still does today . Like it  for Carolina rigging, Worms and Jigs 

[Catt]

3 hours ago, PressuredFishing said:

I have found light wire+light line=higher catch ratio in open water.

 

I don't like light wire hooks which is why I throw Mustad Grip-Pin Hook. Not a light wire but not a punch hook either, comfortably in the middle.

[PressuredFishing]

4 minutes ago, Catt said:

 

I don't like light wire hooks which is why I throw Mustad Grip-Pin Hook. Not a light wire but not a punch hook either, comfortably in the middle.

Next time you are fishing open structure, try some light wire hooks, I loose alot less fish on a light wire hook than a heavier wire hook. Perhaps it could also be because I fish them exposed compared to t rig, but once you hook them they usually don't come off unless you take pressure off or they where hooked on the skin of the lip

[Catt]

@PressuredFishing I've had to many bigger fish straighten light wire hooks.

 

Ya ain't gonna straighten a Mustad hook!

[T-Billy]

10 hours ago, Catt said:

Now during pre-spawn/spawn I will move up to 20# on my Texas  Rig, 65# braid on my Jig-n-Craw & tighten my drag a little.

 

Why?

 

Buck brush, we don't fish the edges, we fish in it. Set hook, turn her head, get her coming towards you, all in one motion!

^^^THIS^^^ We don't have buck brush here, but I fish alot of shoreline brush, beaver huts, manmade brushpiles etc. I lost two PB's in two years because 20# Invisx wasn't up to the task of moving them out of cover, and they weren't DD's. All my pitching is done with 40# 832 these days.

Set the hook into a limb today, 40# 832. Tharp King Cobra is fine. Lew's Super Duty is fine. Ish's New Junk Flippin hook? Not so much!!! Lol. First time using these hooks. I really like the design. Hopefully this is an anomaly. Never had this happen with a VMC or 6th Sense Flippin hook. Time will tell.

[PressuredFishing]

2 minutes ago, T-Billy said:

^^^THIS^^^ We don't have buck brush here, but I fish alot of shoreline brush, beaver huts, manmade brushpiles etc. I lost two PB's in two years because 20# Invisx wasn't up to the task of moving them out of cover, and they weren't DD's. All my pitching is done with 40# 832 these days.

Set the hook into a limb today, 40# 832. Tharp King Cobra is fine. Lew's Super Duty is fine. Ish's New Junk Flippin hook? Not so much!!! Lol. First time using these hooks. I really like the design. Hopefully this is an anomaly. Never had this happen with a VMC or 6th Sense Flippin hook. Time will tell.

Odd, I have had this happen when fishing with hooks I have found, never with my own hooks. From what I understand when they make hooks too quick to cool=hard but brittle and to slow to cool=softer and can be bent out but not as hard. Could of been a bad batch, most companies including vmc test the hook machine before they make an entire batch, not sure about that company though 

6 minutes ago, Catt said:

@PressuredFishing I've had to many bigger fish straighten light wire hooks.

 

Ya ain't gonna straighten a Mustad hook!

When fishing light wire hooks you don't want your drag tight, usually loose, let the fish run, if spinning backreel, fighting the fish well will prevent straightening hooks. I use eagle Claws (cheapy hooks) when slip shooting and dropshotting in riprap, because I'm not wasting Gammies or owners/mustads. Have had no issues bending out in open water, in cover with tight drag have lost a few. I get away with lightest line and lightest wire in open water.

[T-Billy]

4 minutes ago, PressuredFishing said:

Odd, I have had this happen when fishing with hooks I have found, never with my own hooks. From what I understand when they make hooks too quick to cool=hard but brittle and to slow to cool=softer and can be bent out but not as hard. Could of been a bad batch, most companies including vmc test the hook machine before they make an entire batch, not sure about that company though 

Yeah, I'm assuming it wasn't properly stress relieved after the bait keeper eye was welded on. It broke right at the end of the weld. If another breaks, I'll pitch 'em and move on. Hoping they work out though. The design leaves plenty of room between the eyes, making them very easy to snell.

[T-Billy]

It's official, Ish's New JUNK Flippin Hooks. Broke another today when I hit a WOOD dock while skipping under it. Not good when wood breaks steel. Shame. I really like the design, but I'm done with 'em.

A good example of where I'm catching them lately. You won't catch many fishing the outer edge. Gotta get back in the thick of it. 20# Mono or Flouro will get your heart broke back in there. 40# braid or higher is the only way to fly IMO.