Putting together a skipping combo.

[new2BC4bass]

Plan on using rods and reels I already have.  After some research I decided to go with 20# fluorocarbon.  Have Sufix Advance coming.  220 yd. spool should be enough for me to try 3 different reels.  Rods will be MHF although I am going to try a 6' 10" HF Quantum Tour Edition and/or Superlite.  Not sure ATM what other 2 rods I will try first.  I've read (or watched videos) with suggestions running from 6' to 7' 3".  I have a Lightning 6' MHF at the short end and a 7' 3" Hammer on the long end with several in between.  From what I gather a softer tip is beneficial.

 

I will be learning from shore.  I imagine many will say shorter will be better, but I don't see why a 7' 2" won't work as long as there is room for a roll cast.  Is a shorter rod easier to learn with?  I have a 6' 6" MHF XMLTi and a 6' 9" MHF Smallmouth.  I am even thinking of trying an OG Tatula 7' MHR.

 

Obviously the goal is to eventually be able to skip with any of my reels.  However, I would like to minimize backlashes while learning as that can destroy fluorocarbon in a hurry.  Many suggest an SV spooled reel.  Or a DC.  I'm thinking a Magforce 3D reel would also be an excellent option.  How about a dual braked reel?  I have at least one reel in each category.

 

I could give a list of options, but don't know if that is necessary plus this post is already too long.  Thanks in advance for your suggestions.

[CFDoc]

If you’re brand new at skipping, I would actually say the best place to start is not on the water, but on a flat concrete pad. You can stand on an ice chest or a bucket to get the height above the concrete you need.

 

On concrete, you can really practice the roll cast technique without worrying about crazy back lashes. Just keep practicing the roll cast over and over until you can consistently get the bait riding just on top of the concrete where it sounds like the bait is ‘gliding’ across the surface.

 

From there, the best equipment available I’ve  found is shorter rods (6’6” - 6’10”), softer tips, and start with easy skipping baits like flukes, wacky senko, etc. Save the jigs for later. Reels I prefer something with combined centrifugal and magnetic braking systems.

 

Also, Google Gerald swindle, Andy Montgomery, and Fish the Moment YouTube videos.

 

good luck. Skipping is my favorite hobby.

[new2BC4bass]

Thanks.  I've watched videos of the first two.  Fish the Moment kind of contradicts other videos and "How to Skip" articles I seen.  He suggested 7' to 7' 6" rod and a jig/beaver lure whereas pretty much everyone else said jigs are harder to skip and a beginner should start with something like a Senko.

 

I've seen the idea of starting on concrete before, but ATM don't know of a place with concrete where I could practice.  Would a paved parking lot work?

[FryDog62]

The light went on for me when Daiwa came out with the SV spool 5 or so years ago. I had been trying to master skipping with other reels for a few years prior that usually ended up in a lash. 
 

I now use a variety of SV spools (Tatula, Alphas, Steez) and would say I’m 98% backlash free when skipping now. The acid test was going back to my Lews, Curados, etc now that I had the technique refined. With those reels I’m better but still backlash often enough that I don’t use them for skipping at all... not worth the headache.  I wouldn’t even consider anything but an SV for really light or weightless lures like wacky or Neko worms.
 

I also started out with shorter rods (6’6”) and they were accurate but I could not get the distance I could with the same length spinning rod.  I use 6’-10” to 7’1” bc rods now. Accuracy improves with a longer rod with practice, but I found out you don’t get more distance no matter how much you use a shorter rod... it makes you overthrow to get distance and that will cause lashes even with an SV spool.  It was an expensive mistake for me to start with short rods and then sell everything to buy longer ones.
 

I also like a high speed reel, and use  7.3 And 8.1. When you skip to a target, you’re only in the strike zone awhile, the you have to reel back fast to cast out again.  Slower speed reels get very tiring.  I do prefer 8.1’s for skipping - so I ended up adding longer handles to my 7.3’s because Alphas and Steez don’t come in 8.1 unfortunately. 

Light and weightless lures I throw on 20 lb Sufix braid + fluoro leader. At a 1/4 oz and higher I use either 10-12 lb Yo-Zuri Hybrid or 14-17 lb fluoro as main lines. 

[Fishin Dad]

^^^^^Frydog hit it right on the head.  No reason to fight it when there are reels available to make it better.  Daiwa SV’s are awesome (I can’t afford the Steez like Frydog, but like my Tatula and Zillion SV’s a lot).   I also want to grab the new Lews reel made for skipping.   I have always had great luck with my Lews reels as well.  Technique is very important no matter what reel you use to get the most out of skipping casts.  I found that a more wrist driven roll cast with little arm or body movement works best.  Good luck!!   

[CFDoc]

2 hours ago, new2BC4bass said:

Thanks.  I've watched videos of the first two.  Fish the Moment kind of contradicts other videos and "How to Skip" articles I seen.  He suggested 7' to 7' 6" rod and a jig/beaver lure whereas pretty much everyone else said jigs are harder to skip and a beginner should start with something like a Senko.

 

I've seen the idea of starting on concrete before, but ATM don't know of a place with concrete where I could practice.  Would a paved parking lot work?

Paved parking lot is fine. Anything other than water for your first attempts I would highly recommend.

 

The SV spool is a great braking system for skipping but it will allow nasty back lashes on the accidental diving cast.

 

I skip with Lews SLP reels which have both centrifugal and magnetic braking systems and can do pretty much thumb free skipping with them as well.

 

What I like about Fish the moment videos on skipping is the good video angle on how to roll cast. When you start, really accentuate the cast low, finish high technique. His video I think shows the roll low, finish high.

 

I would disagree with him on the 7’6” rod length though. Unless you’re really tall, that’s a lot of length to control.

[new2BC4bass]

I liked the tip about keeping your upper arm next to your body.  Also not to wimp out on the cast.  He also suggested an Extra Fast rod.  I have two.  An OG Powell 7'2" and a Helium 3 7'1" in MH and a H-EF Witch Doctor.

 

 

[Deephaven]

7 hours ago, FryDog62 said:

The light went on for me when Daiwa came out with the SV spool 5 or so years ago. I had been trying to master skipping with other reels for a few years prior that usually ended up in a lash. 

Have you compared to one of the Shimano's more geared towards this?  Currently shopping a Zillion SV or Scorpion DC for my weighted skipping setup.  In all the reading I've done on the board and beyond there is the joker that states use a spinning rod, others that end in Shimano DC and the rest Daiwa SV.  Zillion & Scorpion are about the same price, but I have yet to see someone say they have used both or at least a Tatula/Curado DC.  In my case it is going on an 844 IMX blank.

[CFDoc]

On 1/3/2021 at 6:43 PM, Deephaven said:

 In all the reading I've done on the board and beyond there is the joker that states use a spinning rod, 

My favorite response to that is at 0:45 of the following video. 
 

To quote: “I want to skip docks, not with a spinning reel, my wife does that. I use a bait caster”. lol
 

 

[FryDog62]

On 1/3/2021 at 6:43 PM, Deephaven said:

Have you compared to one of the Shimano's more geared towards this?  Currently shopping a Zillion SV or Scorpion DC for my weighted skipping setup.  In all the reading I've done on the board and beyond there is the joker that states use a spinning rod, others that end in Shimano DC and the rest Daiwa SV.  Zillion & Scorpion are about the same price, but I have yet to see someone say they have used both or at least a Tatula/Curado DC.  In my case it is going on an 844 IMX blank.

I have not used the DC, but talked to a guy I know that does. He says it’s definitely better than the other Shimanos he skips with but not as smooth or as much distance as the Daiwa SV.  That said I’m sure both are great reels.
 

Are you talking about the new Zillion set to come out or the old one? A new release is planned with significant upgrades.  I had a Zillion a couple years ago and it was nice, but I think the Tatula SV that came out last year kind of leap-frogged the Zillion. Which makes me think the new release of the Zillion will be even better.  For me, I’d wait and at least compare... 

On 1/3/2021 at 7:16 PM, CFDoc said:

My favorite response to that is at 0:45 of the following video. 
 

To quote: “I want to skip docks, not with a spinning reel, my wife does that. I use a bait caster”. lol
 

 

I think the other thing he does right is more of a stand straight up and roll cast. He kind of calls out the guys that crouch down baseball style and sling it side arm. That was absolutely me when I started out skipping and I had some epic blow ups! 

[gim]

I was intending to start a thread like this soon because I am also considering a setup that is specifically geared towards dock skipping.  Last season I used a spinning setup in MH and a size 2500 spinning reel with 20 pound braid/fluro.  I would like to use a BC setup and I have heard that the Daiwa SV is the one to go with.  I am still a little unsure on the rod to pair it with as I personally prefer a slightly shorter one, something like 6'6" or 6'8".  I primarily skip with very light lures, usually a wacky rigged stick bait.

 

I don't need distance when I'm skipping.  Its not like I'm trying to skip lures long distance.  I'm more focused on accuracy and avoiding getting hunt up.

 

Keep the comments and suggestions coming.

[Deephaven]

58 minutes ago, FryDog62 said:

I have not used the DC, but talked to a guy I know that does. He says it’s definitely better than the other Shimanos he skips with but not as smooth or as much distance as the Daiwa SV.  That said I’m sure both are great reels.
 

Are you talking about the new Zillion set to come out or the old one? A new release is planned with significant upgrades.  I had a Zillion a couple years ago and it was nice, but I think the Tatula SV that came out last year kind of leap-frogged the Zillion. Which makes me think the new release of the Zillion will be even better.  For me, I’d wait and at least compare... 

I think the other thing he does right is more of a stand straight up and roll cast. He kind of calls out the guys that crouch down baseball style and sling it side arm. That was absolutely me when I started out skipping and I had some epic blow ups! 

Great clarification, thanks.  I was indeed referring to the 2021 Zillion.  https://japantackle.com/reg0000293.html

 

Not in a huge rush as living in MN means I don't need it until the water gets soft again.  In HOURS of reading the 2 answers are always Tatula SV or a DC Shimano.

 

And lol, yep the crouching baseball style is what I thought was the right method initially as well.  Amusing since the roll cast was what I used in the same situations where I didn't need to skip, but reverted to being an idiot when I did.  Accidental skipping during a roll cast showed me my errors.

 

[FryDog62]

19 minutes ago, Deephaven said:

Great clarification, thanks.  I was indeed referring to the 2021 Zillion.  https://japantackle.com/reg0000293.html

 

Not in a huge rush as living in MN means I don't need it until the water gets soft again.  In HOURS of reading the 2 answers are always Tatula SV or a DC Shimano.

 

And lol, yep the crouching baseball style is what I thought was the right method initially as well.  Amusing since the roll cast was what I used in the same situations where I didn't need to skip, but reverted to being an idiot when I did.  Accidental skipping during a roll cast showed me my errors.

 

Cool, will have to get your feedback if you get the new Zillion... I have high hopes for it. Yeah, not a huge rush to get a skipping combo this time of year in MN. Although if you did it now out on the ice you might set a Guiness record for longest skip under an ice house..! 

[MN Fisher]

I just wish I had the time to practice skipping with a BC more...right now I can't skip with a BC to save my life.

 

Skipping rig for me next year?

Mitchell Avocet RTZ-3000 on a 7' Okuma Reflections MH/F

[CFDoc]

27 minutes ago, MN Fisher said:

I just wish I had the time to practice skipping with a BC more...right now I can't skip with a BC to save my life.

 

Skipping rig for me next year?

Mitchell Avocet RTZ-3000 on a 7' Okuma Reflections MH/F

I’m sure people are tired of reading what I say on skipping but you don’t need water to practice it.

 

I probably practiced for a month on concrete before I ever had enough confidence to try on the water.

 

If you have a driveway, start there. Get crappy/cheap line and a jig you don’t care about and have at it. Believe it or not, the concrete will teach you what you need to know.

 

When you can get the bait to stay in contact with the concrete but see the ‘gliding’ across the top, you’ve done it.

[MN Fisher]

Just now, CFDoc said:

I’m sure people are tired of reading what I say on skipping but you don’t need water to practice it.

 

I probably practiced for a month on concrete before I ever had enough confidence to try on the water.

 

If you have a driveway, start there. Get crappy/cheap line and a jig you don’t care about and have at it. Believe it or not, the concrete will teach you what you need to know.

 

When you can get the bait to stay in contact with the concrete but see the ‘gliding’ across the top, you’ve done it.

Gravel driveway

Street is part ice, part packed snow over the tar

Snow on the ice covering the lake.

Limited time away from the house - wife is partially disabled and I'm her PCA

 

So, currently have no way to practice...I'm fairly proficient already at skipping with spinning gear - which is why I got the upgraded rig to hand heavier lures.

[CFDoc]

18 minutes ago, MN Fisher said:

Gravel driveway

Street is part ice, part packed snow over the tar

Snow on the ice covering the lake.

Limited time away from the house - wife is partially disabled and I'm her PCA

 

So, currently have no way to practice...I'm fairly proficient already at skipping with spinning gear - which is why I got the upgraded rig to hand heavier lures.

Sorry to hear about the wife. 
 

Hopefully you get a chance to practice soon. Gravel can somewhat work but the street is the better option once the weather clears. And there are no cars in the street, ha.

[MN Fisher]

4 minutes ago, CFDoc said:

Sorry to hear about the wife. 
 

Hopefully you get a chance to practice soon. Gravel can somewhat work but the street is the better option once the weather clears. And there are no cars in the street, ha.

My whole point is that I'm skilled skipping with an 'egg-beater'. Last year I got out on the water a grand total of 24 hours...ya, that's it. How much of that valuable time do I 'waste' re-learning a skill I already have just to switch to BC?

[new2BC4bass]

9 minutes ago, MN Fisher said:

My whole point is that I'm skilled skipping with an 'egg-beater'. Last year I got out on the water a grand total of 24 hours...ya, that's it. How much of that valuable time do I 'waste' re-learning a skill I already have just to switch to BC?

I don't keep track of my time on the water, but can guarantee I spent less than 24 hours on the water last year.  Which is why I have several rods and reels that haven't been used by me yet.

 

Sorry about your wife.  Mine has Alzheimer's.  Emergency room doctor knew it for 4-1/2 years before I did.  Wouldn't have found out then if she hadn't had a really bad spell.  How doctors and hospitals can keep something like that from the patient's spouse is beyond me.

[gim]

50 minutes ago, CFDoc said:

I probably practiced for a month on concrete before I ever had enough confidence to try on the water.

 

So in your opinion would you say its worth practicing with a BC when/if I decide to get one?  I've got is mastered pretty well with a spinning setup.  Just wondering if you think the spinning setup skills would translate into using a BC or is it a completely moot point?

 

I would consider myself to be very proficient at using a BC except when it comes to skipping.

[Deephaven]

No one here propose a DC reel for skipping?

 

[CFDoc]

10 minutes ago, gimruis said:

 

So in your opinion would you say its worth practicing with a BC when/if I decide to get one?  I've got is mastered pretty well with a spinning setup.  Just wondering if you think the spinning setup skills would translate into using a BC or is it a completely moot point?

 

I would consider myself to be very proficient at using a BC except when it comes to skipping.

Keep in mind, this is just my opinion. I do think it is shared by a lot of skippers, but this is by no means law.

 

When it comes to skipping soft plastics, I think the spinning/casting rigs do the job equally well. So like senkos and flukes, I see both outfits putting the bait in relatively the same place. Those style baits I pretty much skip without touching the spool during the cast.

 

It’s really skipping jigs where I feel the two setups differ. For some reason, I seem to  be able to get more consistent/accurate skips with the bait caster. The thumb control helps when you need to slow the jig down. I feel like I have more control of the release point if I need more of a ‘bouncing’ skip or a ‘flat as a pancake’ skip that stays connected to the water.

 

Finally, jig hook sets seem to be more consistent with the bait caster as I feel I’m in a better position for the hook set when the bite happens. 
 

Again, without rambling too much, this is not law. And spinning tackle is fine if that’s your bread and butter. But I do think it would be to your benefit to try a bait caster. Just so you can see/feel the differences.

[new2BC4bass]

Let's forget the reels for the time being.  What rods do you guys favor?

[MN Fisher]

1 minute ago, new2BC4bass said:

Let's forget the reels for the time being.  What rods do you guys favor?

Lighter stuff - weightless worms, light jerks, etc - M/F

Heavier - jigs, spinners, etc - MH/F

 

7'0" length seems to be the sweet spot for me - I wasn't getting enough 'oomph' with the 6'6" to get the lure far enough.

[gim]

6 minutes ago, new2BC4bass said:

Let's forget the reels for the time being.  What rods do you guys favor?

 

I think the rod is more personal preference.  It may also depend if you are using a true bass boat or a boat with higher sides or some other type of watercraft.  I have found it MUCH easier to skip with the lower sides of a true bass boat than when I fish in my Father's boat, which is a Crestliner Fishhawk.  Additionally, it may also depend on how tall you are too.  A shorter person may want to use a shorter rod whereas a guy that's 6'6" will likely be able to use a longer one.